Southern California Coast Guard Transmitter Locations

[krazybob]

As many of you know two small planes collided approximately 5 miles of the Long Beach breakwater yesterday. Wreckage and debris fields have been found but no survivors are expected. I am still monitoring the search operations that have been continuous since the crash yesterday.

Some of you know that I also run an extensive network of remote located and remote controlled scanners throughout California as part of the Scannerbuff Network. Our remote receivers could hear CG Oxnard all the way down to CG San Diego and points in between. We could not hear the rescue boats form Long Beach, L.A. County Fire or L.A. City Fire until I switched our feeds to my mountaintop home at 6400 feet.

We heard it all. In fact, a fuel tank was just picked up at 1:28am. They are hard at work. Apparently two bodies have also just been recovered.

But this has caused me to wonder: where are the CG transmitters located? As an extra class amateur radio operator I know that elevated points are likely. But I am unaware of a database that shows transmitter locations and sectors covered. I suspect that CG transmits at upwards to 500 watts just to make sure that they penetrate.

Are they located on mountain tops like Santiago, Palomar, Otay, Elsinore Peak, Mt. Wilson? Such locations would give them approximately 140 miles of VHF coverage and since I hear them so loudly I don't expect that they use directional arrays. I just heard a warship reporting 100 miles out and I'm inland 100 miles at 6400 feet.

Is there a list of locations? Do they use phased simulcast? Transmitter steering?

 

[archduke]

This is an old list, but it is great as a reference source, some of the high sites may still be located as per the charts at this site. Enjoy.

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/cgcomms/charts/11lbeach.jpg

National Distress System - USCG Navigation Center

 

[ecps92]

With Rescue 21 being implemented, it is changing.
For Rescue 21 info, just google Rescue21

For the older [Pre Rescue 21] maps
try
National Distress System - USCG Navigation Center

As many of you know two small planes collided approximately 5 miles of the Long Beach breakwater yesterday. Wreckage and debris fields have been found but no survivors are expected. I am still monitoring the search operations that have been continuous since the crash yesterday.

Some of you know that I also run an extensive network of remote located and remote controlled scanners throughout California as part of the Scannerbuff Network. Our remote receivers could hear CG Oxnard all the way down to CG San Diego and points in between. We could not hear the rescue boats form Long Beach, L.A. County Fire or L.A. City Fire until I switched our feeds to my mountaintop home at 6400 feet.

We heard it all. In fact, a fuel tank was just picked up at 1:28am. They are hard at work. Apparently two bodies have also just been recovered.

But this has caused me to wonder: where are the CG transmitters located? As an extra class amateur radio operator I know that elevated points are likely. But I am unaware of a database that shows transmitter locations and sectors covered. I suspect that CG transmits at upwards to 500 watts just to make sure that they penetrate.

Are they located on mountain tops like Santiago, Palomar, Otay, Elsinore Peak, Mt. Wilson? Such locations would give them approximately 140 miles of VHF coverage and since I hear them so loudly I don't expect that they use directional arrays. I just heard a warship reporting 100 miles out and I'm inland 100 miles at 6400 feet.

Is there a list of locations? Do they use phased simulcast? Transmitter steering?

 

[ecps92]

Are they using any of the LMR CG Channels? or only the VHF Marine ???

As many of you know two small planes collided approximately 5 miles of the Long Beach breakwater yesterday. Wreckage and debris fields have been found but no survivors are expected. I am still monitoring the search operations that have been continuous since the crash yesterday.

Some of you know that I also run an extensive network of remote located and remote controlled scanners throughout California as part of the Scannerbuff Network. Our remote receivers could hear CG Oxnard all the way down to CG San Diego and points in between. We could not hear the rescue boats form Long Beach, L.A. County Fire or L.A. City Fire until I switched our feeds to my mountaintop home at 6400 feet.

We heard it all. In fact, a fuel tank was just picked up at 1:28am. They are hard at work. Apparently two bodies have also just been recovered.

But this has caused me to wonder: where are the CG transmitters located? As an extra class amateur radio operator I know that elevated points are likely. But I am unaware of a database that shows transmitter locations and sectors covered. I suspect that CG transmits at upwards to 500 watts just to make sure that they penetrate.

Are they located on mountain tops like Santiago, Palomar, Otay, Elsinore Peak, Mt. Wilson? Such locations would give them approximately 140 miles of VHF coverage and since I hear them so loudly I don't expect that they use directional arrays. I just heard a warship reporting 100 miles out and I'm inland 100 miles at 6400 feet.

Is there a list of locations? Do they use phased simulcast? Transmitter steering?

 

[krazybob]

When I googled Rescue 21 it didn't say much. As for the use of LMR, the only LMR I am aware of being used was Long Beach Fire and Baywatch (not just a TV show!) All agencies were bouncing back and forth between one another at will and no common frequency was announced until Baywatch located a debris field. From that point most communications were on 22a and 23.

What LMR frequencies are you referring to?

Thank you for the map. CG Los Angeles shows that it is transmitting from San Clemente Island, which is halfway between Los Angeles and San Diego. Its highest peak is 1900 feet, so it has moderate coverage from 60 miles out at sea.

 

[ecps92]

Try this WIKI for the CG LMR and these for Rescue 21

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rescue_21
and here is a list of others

When I googled Rescue 21 it didn't say much. As for the use of LMR, the only LMR I am aware of being used was Long Beach Fire and Baywatch (not just a TV show!) All agencies were bouncing back and forth between one another at will and no common frequency was announced until Baywatch located a debris field. From that point most communications were on 22a and 23.

What LMR frequencies are you referring to?

Thank you for the map. CG Los Angeles shows that it is transmitting from San Clemente Island, which is halfway between Los Angeles and San Diego. Its highest peak is 1900 feet, so it has moderate coverage from 60 miles out at sea.

 

[krazybob]

AH HA! That was some good information! I enjoy monitoring the safety channels. Although I listen mostly to forest fire stuff my elevation lets me hear about 100 miles offshore.

I wish that I could fix the typo in the title...

 

[brandon]

Although I listen mostly to forest fire stuff my elevation lets me hear about 100 miles offshore.

Must be nice Ever thought about leasing some space out to folks to put remote scanners up there? :lol: hi hi

 

[krazybob]

The Scannerbuff Network already covers Riverside County and more. We have numerous remote locations that house remote controlled scanners from Bakersfield south to San Diego. Not one location can hear everything but our Running Springs location can hear a 1 watt hand-held in your backyard We use Teamspeak and simulcast using Icecast. Our goal is not to conquer the world as some large providers do with itty-bitty departments that close on holidays, but rather, to focus our efforts on the hottest radio market -- Southern California. You are invited to join our free service as a provider. We provide unlimited and free Icecast connections as well. In fact, I am confident that we started doing this first and ya'all followed It's all good.

Although I can hear your backyard you may be able to hear it or parts of it better. Like I said, it's all good. We will be experimenting with a scanner up on Keller Peak at 8400 feet. I think site noise will tear it up, though. We'll have to reduce senbsitivity so much that it may not be worth it.

Today we provided rock solid coverage of the T38 that went down north of California City. We streamed Kern County from our Lancaster remote while I streamed the air-2-air on 243.000. I really don't mean to brag, ok a little bit -- but I can hear aircraft on the tarmac at LAX just using a discone.

The price paid though is intermod. The higher elevation means having to decrease the sensitivity of a scanner to avoid frontend overload. To avoid this for fires I use commercial two-ways. Since I work from home they don't need to be remote controlled. Using an antenna for each band and a reversed two triplexers we can hear CHP up into Bakersfield and down to San Diego; VHF fire and coast guard; aircraft, and 800.

I've spent my marble money so somone send me a free cup of coffee. This hobby is expensive!

 

[NML-21]

The Coast Guard is limited to only using up to 100 watts of power to broadcast on VHF-FM. There is no designated place for the antennas, they move often. I know of only one tower that hasn't moved in over 15 years and that is because of where it is located. It is Sector Lake Michigan's Chicago High Level Site. It is actually located on top of the Sears Tower. With the Rescue 21 system, there should be several smaller towers going up.

 

[krazybob]

I would challenge the statement that the CG is limited to 100 watts. I can measure their signal strength at my mountain home at well over -61dBm. Doing the math their signal is at least 165 watts and a EIRP of over 2100 watts and assumes a 9dB gain omni directional antenna with slight down tilt. This is suggested by their low-level site on San Clemente Island. Wow, would I love to sit up there and look out over the vast ocean! This is really a minor point though. Even NOAA stations transmit at up to 500 watts depending on location. In an emergency any station may use any frequency at any power level. Nonetheless, they power in at mny home located at 6300 feet over the Inland Empire of California.

I am more curious about the LMR frequencies. Why if common radio equipment cannot use them?

 

[WayneH]

In California AT&T's radio department controls the license and maintains the MC equipment for the Coast Guard in some cases. Here's an example.

I've seen some sophisticated setups that USCG uses. Primary and redundant satellite receivers setup to scan various MC freqs in the same rack as the transmitters used to talk on them, also setup with a primary and redundant transmitter.

 

[WayneH]

I am more curious about the LMR frequencies. Why if common radio equipment cannot use them?

Law Enforcement purposes.

 

[krazybob]

I have been in radio a very long time and the Coast Guard is a para-military agency and under the control of Homeland Security. They do not get licences through the FCC. In fact, I have never heard the CG ever identify with a call sign - civilian or otherwise. More specifically, the call signs are issued by the NTIA -- not the FCC. The Office of Spectrum Management is the actual office responsible. Your example shows that AT&T has a license. This alone makes me curious but even their license shows 250 watts. The MC - Coastal Group is a civilian designation. "Public coast stations are an integral part of the Maritime Services, and traditionally have served the maritime community as commercial mobile radio service providers, permitting ships to send and receive messages and to interconnect with the public switched telephone network." AT&T is a telephone company. This is not to say that AT&T doesn't maintain certain radio equipment but the question asking how much transmitter power the CG uses.

Like I said, just curiosity and I have measured their signal strength on a service monitor. By noting the dBm reading I can resolve it into watts.

 

[ecps92]

Many of the CG Call-signs are 3x2 or 3x3 ie: NMF-21
and are mainly used on HF Only not VHF

I have been in radio a very long time and the Coast Guard is a para-military agency and under the control of Homeland Security. They do not get licences through the FCC. In fact, I have never heard the CG ever identify with a call sign - civilian or otherwise. More specifically, the call signs are issued by the NTIA -- not the FCC. The Office of Spectrum Management is the actual office responsible. Your example shows that AT&T has a license. This alone makes me curious but even their license shows 250 watts. The MC - Coastal Group is a civilian designation. "Public coast stations are an integral part of the Maritime Services, and traditionally have served the maritime community as commercial mobile radio service providers, permitting ships to send and receive messages and to interconnect with the public switched telephone network." AT&T is a telephone company. This is not to say that AT&T doesn't maintain certain radio equipment but the question asking how much transmitter power the CG uses.

Like I said, just curiosity and I have measured their signal strength on a service monitor. By noting the dBm reading I can resolve it into watts.

 

[ecps92]

the license example is where AT&T still Operates the Marine Operator [so out-dated] Telephone [Phone-patch] system. Not maintaining USCG Transmitters....... I have not heard the Marine Operators in atleast 10 yrs for the New England Region...

In California AT&T's radio department controls the license and maintains the MC equipment for the Coast Guard in many cases. Here's an example.

I've seen some sophisticated setups that USCG uses. Primary and redundant satellite receivers setup to scan various MC freqs in the same rack as the transmitters used to talk on them, also setup with a primary and redundant transmitter.

 

[WayneH]

the license example is where AT&T still Operates the Marine Operator [so out-dated] Telephone [Phone-patch] system. Not maintaining USCG Transmitters....... I have not heard the Marine Operators in atleast 10 yrs for the New England Region...

CH 16 is included on that license, among other AT&T ones. I only include this specific site because there was paperwork on the cabinets stating they were maintained for the USCG.

I'll change my wording in the past post to make it more up to date.

FWIW, the CG owned transmitters were set for 70 watts in their programming.

 

[krazybob]

It's all good! We got it straight and seem to be in agreement. But being set for 70 watts doesn't mean that this is the maximum. I run 35 watts on my repeater but could run 50. The repeater runs cooler.

 

[WayneH]

But being set for 70 watts doesn't mean that this is the maximum.

It's what the currently programmed maximum power setting is. So given feedline loss, and a Stationmaster antenna, I'd say it's possible they're exceeding 100W.

 

[krazybob]

You're mixing math. Feedline loss is subtracted from the power output and could be 1-3dB depending on how they are configured (like through a combiner). That would be a 3dB loss from 70 watts (45 watts). A Station Master has 6dB gain so we recover the 3dB loss and have a net gain of 3dB bringing us back up to about 179 watts ERP. As I said, I have measured their signal in dBm and it far exceeds 100 watts. This could indicate that they are using an exposed dipole array by Telewave that offers 9dB gain. I'm not going to get the calculator out, but the ERP of 45 watts in this case would be roughly 375 watts. ERP.

Again, I think we're talking about a moot point. They are loud and that's all that I am saying and I am 100 miles inland.

Bob Ricci
AF6D