No? How about if you put all of the conventional channels in Zone 1, put all of the talkgroups in Zone 2, 3, etc., and simply don't program any ZONE/ZNUP/ZNDN button so the radio will forever remain in Zone 1? Sounds like it can indeed be done.
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Using a Motorola P25 radio as a scanner.
- Thread starter N0OVC
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Yes; that's how you can do it.
clbsquared
Member
Sure it can. Just assign “zone up” & “zone down” to the buttons. Leave the channel knob alone. If you’re trying to scan one talkgroup at a time, then create a zone for each talkgroup.
It’s really not necessary to hardware disable TX or try and program the concentric switch to “TX inhibit”. TX inhibit does not stop the radio from trying to affiliate. Programming the radio correctly for NAS will eliminate it from trying to affiliate.
Incorrect. TX Inhibit disables all transmissions, including registration/affiliation.
ElroyJetson
Getting tired of all the stupidity.
That does not follow with the experience of others. TX inhibit prevents the user from using the radio for voice transmissions, so that an authorized user can be authorized to LISTEN but not transmit, but that does not keep the radio from affiliating.
That's central to the whole reason for the NAS scan setup method to exist. It's why I was thrilled out of my tiny little mind when I tried it,
AND IT WORKED.
TX inhibit allows the radio to register and re-register when changing sites.
NAS is the only proven method that eliminates registration, because the radio is never set to directly listen to a trunked system.
The XTL5000 does not have a 16 position rotary switch for talkgroup/channel selection. It's a continuous rotary, so you can go above position 16 where you've got your trunked data parked.
There is a way to make it LESS likely that you'll navigate your way to the trunked systems when using an XTL5000. It's very simple.
Place several dummy channels between your scan-linked conventional channels and your trunked channels.
Name those dummy channel such things as: "WARNING" "GO BACK" "ABANDON ALL HOPE". "HERE BE DRAGONS."
Give yourself enough dummy channels in between the two groups that you can't possiblky overshoot and end up going to a trunking selection.
That's central to the whole reason for the NAS scan setup method to exist. It's why I was thrilled out of my tiny little mind when I tried it,
AND IT WORKED.
TX inhibit allows the radio to register and re-register when changing sites.
NAS is the only proven method that eliminates registration, because the radio is never set to directly listen to a trunked system.
The XTL5000 does not have a 16 position rotary switch for talkgroup/channel selection. It's a continuous rotary, so you can go above position 16 where you've got your trunked data parked.
There is a way to make it LESS likely that you'll navigate your way to the trunked systems when using an XTL5000. It's very simple.
Place several dummy channels between your scan-linked conventional channels and your trunked channels.
Name those dummy channel such things as: "WARNING" "GO BACK" "ABANDON ALL HOPE". "HERE BE DRAGONS."
Give yourself enough dummy channels in between the two groups that you can't possiblky overshoot and end up going to a trunking selection.
Oh for cryin' out loud. Wrong again.
The TX Inhibit switch on an XTS or APX portable STOPS ALL TRANSMISSIONS. That means registration. That means affiliation. And that means voice/data transmissions. Any and all RF, period.
You are confusing TX Inhibit with TG/AG Disabled, which is the per-personaly setting that prevents voice transmissions, aka "listen only" mode.
In fact, the APX mobiles have a menu item for TX Inhibit, which the XTL series did not. It accomplishes the same thing as the portable, which is to stop any and all RF from going out of the PA.
Anyone who has a legitimate ID on a trunked system can very easily demonstrate this by enabling TX Inhibit via the portable concentric switch or mobile softkey press, then parking the radio on a trunked talkgroup. Watch the control channel with your favorite decoding software while you do this. You will not see any attempt at registration, the TX LED will not flash, blah blah blah.
We hashed this out 3 years ago...
XTS3K TX Inhibit
Hi All, Sorry if this was posted before, but I could not find a direct answer to this questions. Will TX Inhibit prevent trunked system affiliation? If it does, would a radio still receive a specific talk group in a trunked system?* Also, What is TX inhibit on busy? I have seen the option all...
ElroyJetson
Getting tired of all the stupidity.
I am not able at this time to test your assertion due to a lack of suitable test equipment, but I can tell you from past experience that I explicitly tested this feature, TX inhibit, on a trunked system, and found that it did NOT inhibit attempts at registration. However, the scenario was slightly different. The radio was not programmed using NAS scan. The test here was to see if TX inhibit prohibits registration when the radio is set to listen DIRECTLY to a trunked system, not doing it via a trunked member of a mode slaved scan list.
Under those circumstances, using a 1 meg IMBE Astro Saber as the test radio, it DEFINITELY tried to affiliate. But I can't tell you what level of firmware and DSP code was in the radio. All those things may be significant factors that affect the outcome when trying the same thing with another radio.
It was those experiments that directly led to me figuring out the non-affiliated scan method. Because TX inhibit alone was just not stopping the radio from affiliating.
Ever since then, I have STILL always been leery of TX inhibit. I have been suspicious that it doesn't ALWAYS keep the radio from transmitting without the user being aware of it.
Thinking further on it, attempting to trigger memories that are 20 years old, more or less, I do think you're right based on dimly remembered memories, plus the logic of TX inhibit in trunking being a feature that would depend on the radio actually being parked on the trunked system, instead of listening to it via scan while parked on a conventional channel.
I think that clarifies my experience. And forgive me for my imperfect memory of things long in the past.
Under those circumstances, using a 1 meg IMBE Astro Saber as the test radio, it DEFINITELY tried to affiliate. But I can't tell you what level of firmware and DSP code was in the radio. All those things may be significant factors that affect the outcome when trying the same thing with another radio.
It was those experiments that directly led to me figuring out the non-affiliated scan method. Because TX inhibit alone was just not stopping the radio from affiliating.
Ever since then, I have STILL always been leery of TX inhibit. I have been suspicious that it doesn't ALWAYS keep the radio from transmitting without the user being aware of it.
Thinking further on it, attempting to trigger memories that are 20 years old, more or less, I do think you're right based on dimly remembered memories, plus the logic of TX inhibit in trunking being a feature that would depend on the radio actually being parked on the trunked system, instead of listening to it via scan while parked on a conventional channel.
I think that clarifies my experience. And forgive me for my imperfect memory of things long in the past.
APX8000
Sarcastic Member
Some people are legends in their own minds....
APX8000
Sarcastic Member
Exactly what I was going to say.
APX8000
Sarcastic Member
Again, what he said. You can even use this method to perform a RSSI check without ever registering or affiliating.
And I’m the guy that figured out the correlation of Type II TG’s to Type I fleet/sub fleet so you could monitor a Type II system with a Type I radio. Sold lots of Standard HX580 and GX5800 by doing that.
Unfortunately not correct. The radio will still attempt to register and affiliate, even if all the personalities are set to TX Inhibit; tried it myself when I programmed an RX-only radio for one of our subscriber agencies. Had to go to Plan B, which was get into Provisioning Manager, and change the ID to RX-only; as it was, I ended up leaving the personalities as TX Inhibit just to be on the safe side.
That trick came in very handy with a Motorola Visar that I set up for RX only use. Probably still have the dang thing around here somewhere, even though the Type II system I used it on is long gone.
ElroyJetson
Getting tired of all the stupidity.
APX8000, or maybe I should call you newcomer or noob, Yes, I did figure out the NAS approach first, or at least was first to publicize it via the batlabs board back in the day when it was actually relevant and a decent place to hang out and trade information. Today it's whacker central and everybody knows that.
I was only the first to tell others how to do it. Somebody else would have figured it out before too long if I hadn't, or had remained silent about it. In truth it wasn't THAT hard to figure out.
Its value to me was nothing more than the satisfaction of helping others to do the same thing I wanted to do. It has never earned me a penny or helped me to sell a radio.
I gave it to everybody. Even to you. Believe me, that doesn't make me a legend in my own mind but do try to conceal your obvious hero worship of me.
I was only the first to tell others how to do it. Somebody else would have figured it out before too long if I hadn't, or had remained silent about it. In truth it wasn't THAT hard to figure out.
Its value to me was nothing more than the satisfaction of helping others to do the same thing I wanted to do. It has never earned me a penny or helped me to sell a radio.
I gave it to everybody. Even to you. Believe me, that doesn't make me a legend in my own mind but do try to conceal your obvious hero worship of me.
Man, I'm even more confused! There are folks here that know their stuff, that's for sure....
Be safe
Be safe
Just tried it on an APX8000 with FW 27 something. With the concentric switch set to TX inhibit it will not attempt to affiliate.
Tom, you're confusing the TG/AG Disabled setting in the trunking personalities with the radio-wide TX Inhibit function that can be mapped to the XTS or APX portable concentric switch (or mapped to a menu item on an APX mobile). Two different functions; the former only prevents the radio from transmitting on talkgroups, the latter prevents the radio from transmitting at all. Literally zero RF passing through the power amplifier.
APX8000
Sarcastic Member
@ElroyJetson....Noob, lol. I was a member of Lindsey's old trunked radio site before RadioReference was even created and submitted a lot of the info to that site, that folks like you used to program your 20 year old Saber, that you are still referring to today, because you couldn't figure it out on your own. Let me know when you program up fleet of APX's and I'll laugh if you think you know what you are talking about.
What I find more amusing is how people, like you, don't know your audience. I again stand by what I and others have said. I could easily post up a video with a legit subscriber and Unitrunker running in the background showing how it does NOT register and affiliate. But, I let you and others spew the same incorrect info because the funnier thing is, I don't have to NAS while you do.
What I find more amusing is how people, like you, don't know your audience. I again stand by what I and others have said. I could easily post up a video with a legit subscriber and Unitrunker running in the background showing how it does NOT register and affiliate. But, I let you and others spew the same incorrect info because the funnier thing is, I don't have to NAS while you do.
APX8000
Sarcastic Member
ElroyJetson
Getting tired of all the stupidity.
All I know about you is what I see in your user profile and what you post, and that includes a 2004 join date. Can't know about your history before that so I shouldn't make any assumptions.
In truth I have WAY less APX experience than I'd like to have. I want an APX8000 for my personal radio but haven't had the heart to part with that much cash. They cost as much as a decent used car. I'm also not currently working in the industry, in fact I'm semi retired. Probably not going to go back in. I'd sort of like to, but I am also enjoying my abundant leisure time as well.
So....peace. I have no reason or wish to have any conflict with you or anybody else.
In truth I have WAY less APX experience than I'd like to have. I want an APX8000 for my personal radio but haven't had the heart to part with that much cash. They cost as much as a decent used car. I'm also not currently working in the industry, in fact I'm semi retired. Probably not going to go back in. I'd sort of like to, but I am also enjoying my abundant leisure time as well.
So....peace. I have no reason or wish to have any conflict with you or anybody else.
Ant9270
The Green Weenie
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I can also confirm that programming the concentric switch to TX Inhibit prevents any emission of RF from the unit. I was told by an MSI engineer that it is absolutely critical that this option does not allow ANY RF to emit, even affiliation/de affiliation requests due to this option being used often by EOD/HAZMAT units that cannot risk any emissions/interference from the portables. Elroy, much respect for you figuring out the method to NAS, however.
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