VP8000 Unable to PTT after another Site Transmits

[aglowgibbon]

Is there any reason why a VP8000 would not be able to key up for about ~30 seconds after a radio from a different site finishes their transmission? Every other radio I have works (Moto and Harris) and I do not experience this issue when both radios are on the same site. It only happens to inter site traffic. I only experience this issue on trunking, not conventional. The radio just bonks without trying to transmit (no red led or transmit icon on radio, even briefly).

I thought it might be an issue with the buys update time, but the lowest you can set it is 15 seconds and "infinite" didn't solve the problem either.

Any ideas?

 

[kd4efm]

May be a settings issue in the system, not much to go by with this information.
All you can do really is sniff the control data to see what's going on.

 

[KevinC]

If you're talking about a P25 trunked system the subscriber doesn't know which site the other units are transmitting on and I can't imagine a system setting that would cause this.

I don't know Kenwood radios, but I suspect a bonk with no TX light either indicates the subscriber thinks the TG is in use or is out of range. I remember early Kenwood's had roaming issues, but I'm sure that's resolved by now. But to me I'd suspect the radio is trying to find a different site for some reason during those times. Can you turn off roaming and see how it reacts?

 

[aglowgibbon]

If you're talking about a P25 trunked system the subscriber doesn't know which site the other units are transmitting on and I can't imagine a system setting that would cause this.

I don't know Kenwood radios, but I suspect a bonk with no TX light either indicates the subscriber thinks the TG is in use or is out of range. I remember early Kenwood's had roaming issues, but I'm sure that's resolved by now. But to me I'd suspect the radio is trying to find a different site for some reason during those times. Can you turn off roaming and see how it reacts?

I had it set to a single-RFSS already. However, I can remove all of the other control channels and information to see what happens. I'm wondering if it's what you're saying that the SU isn't hearing the system send the call terminate command. I'll see what happens and report back.

 

[j3hunt]

Just Curious, is this a single radio issue or are multiple VP’s experiencing the same thing? And, could you provide your firmware version? Is the trucking system your radio is affiliating too a simulcast system?

 

[otobmark]

Fire dept tested using 2 sites with VP8000 for conversation without any observed issues. I wasn't there so not sure how much they tortured the gear. I'm wondering if voice channel hang time is involved in the issue. Do you need to wait long enough for the voice channels being used are released before getting bonked? If you key up before channel release does that change anything?

 

[otobmark]

Sounds like spectrum scan engaging. But why? Is neighbor site cc info being received and stored? Maybe increase delay time for spectrum cc scan.

 

[aglowgibbon]

This issue has been resolved. In the codeplug, all of the sites had the RFSS and site ID swapped. For whatever reason, Armada lists the Site ID first and then RFSS, which is backward from most other programming software.

 

[aglowgibbon]

Fire dept tested using 2 sites with VP8000 for conversation without any observed issues. I wasn't there so not sure how much they tortured the gear. I'm wondering if voice channel hang time is involved in the issue. Do you need to wait long enough for the voice channels being used are released before getting bonked? If you key up before channel release does that change anything?

Well, disregard my previous message. This issues is still occuring. I do see the hang time light appear briefly, but it goes away quickly. If a I wait long enough (30+ seconds) it will allow me to tx again. When it is in this state, I also miss all incoming traffic for 30 ish seconds, regardless of the site it's coming from.

 

[KevinC]

Well, disregard my previous message. This issues is still occuring. I do see the hang time light appear briefly, but it goes away quickly. If a I wait long enough (30+ seconds) it will allow me to tx again. When it is in this state, I also miss all incoming traffic for 30 ish seconds, regardless of the site it's coming from.

It sure sounds like it’s looking for another site (roaming).

 

[otobmark]

Increase spectrum scan delay to 20-30 seconds.

 

[aglowgibbon]

I have an update! We have narrowed the issue down to one problematic site. We thought it was every site killing the radio because after 30 seconds, it would drop every site. Turns out, only the one problematic site is causing the issues. Either way, I'm now working with the sys admin to figure out what setting or change needs to fixed for the VP8K to work. Update to (hopefully) come soon.

It sure sounds like it’s looking for another site (roaming).

 

[KevinC]

I have an update! We have narrowed the issue down to one problematic site. We thought it was every site killing the radio because after 30 seconds, it would drop every site. Turns out, only the one problematic site is causing the issues. Either way, I'm now working with the sys admin to figure out what setting or change needs to fixed for the VP8K to work. Update to (hopefully) come soon.

Is the site equipment Motorola or some other manufacturer?

 

[Project25_MASTR]

I have an update! We have narrowed the issue down to one problematic site. We thought it was every site killing the radio because after 30 seconds, it would drop every site. Turns out, only the one problematic site is causing the issues. Either way, I'm now working with the sys admin to figure out what setting or change needs to fixed for the VP8K to work. Update to (hopefully) come soon.

Sounds like an issue I was experiencing with a BDA issue. The BDA had things so screwed up that every time someone keyed locally in the building the site controller would flag an illegal carrier and force a control channel roll. This was an OBT Astro 25 system in Central Texas and it didn't matter if it was a first gen Kenwood (which I avoid like the plague), first or second gen Viking (no one has third gen out here yet), or if it was Motorola.

 

[aglowgibbon]

Sounds like an issue I was experiencing with a BDA issue. The BDA had things so screwed up that every time someone keyed locally in the building the site controller would flag an illegal carrier and force a control channel roll. This was an OBT Astro 25 system in Central Texas and it didn't matter if it was a first gen Kenwood (which I avoid like the plague), first or second gen Viking (no one has third gen out here yet), or if it was Motorola.

It's just so weird that it is only site-site, and the issue only comes from that one site. Sadly, everything other SU is Motorola or Harris, so no luck troubleshooting multiple radios. However, I'm accurately able to reproduce the problem. At this point, we're going through the configuration of both sites to find what the differences are and see if anything makes a change.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

It's just so weird that it is only site-site, and the issue only comes from that one site. Sadly, everything other SU is Motorola or Harris, so no luck troubleshooting multiple radios. However, I'm accurately able to reproduce the problem. At this point, we're going through the configuration of both sites to find what the differences are and see if anything makes a change.

I had to rebuild a Vx900 codeplug for GATRRS that a 3rd party tech had built...what had been done was very evident of someone who had never dealt with a dual band unit as everything was programmed as single band units using a common control head. Actually, what I did was just throw my POV VM900's codeplug in as a base and rebuild from there.

Armada does some things differently (TX and RX spacing being swapped to what everyone else uses for example) but overall it's pretty easy to pickup if you have experience with APX CPS. The whole reason I have one Viking radio and an APX radio in my county vehicle is specifically due to those being the two vendors that I am currently having to support. Makes it easy to compare differences.