Yaesu: Does MARS/CAP mod void warranty?

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

There used to be a whole industry around MARS/CAP modifications. I recall a guy attended every hamfest with a big white cardboard sign listing the radios and doing the mods as you waited.

He is probably repairing iPhone screens these days.

And no more reason to do any hand wringing over an illegally modified ham radio useful for Part 90. Just buy a cart full of BaoFengshuii radios and have at it.

 

[N4KVE]

Probably my friend Mike. We called him Mod Mike. Used to live in Florida. Now in Texas. In charge of a crew working on cell phone towers. He’d make $2000-$3000 a weekend at a big hamfest. He got his start doing the same thing to CB radios. At one time he was an authorized Icom repair center when Icom got swamped. I remember seeing he had 3 R7000’s that belonged to the DEA in NYC.

 

[TailGator911]

Yeah I apologize for the drift to Alaska, too. Don't get me goin! My question was answered, so the original OP will now sign off. 73s! Thanks, folks!

 

[AK9R]

We had a mod guy who worked hamfests in the Indiana, Ohio, Illinois, Michigan area, too. He'd set up a booth with his solder station, magnifying worklight, and microscope. Later on, he would set up a screen around his worktable so you couldn't see what he was doing. Made a killing, in my opinion. Charged me $25 to out-of-band mod a Yaesu FT-23R and all it took was bridging two solder pads. Of course, I didn't know that at the time. Later, I got smarter and started doing my own mods.

Then, one day, my modded FT-530 was stolen out of my car. It had all the local police and fire frequencies programmed in it. That taught me a lesson. I stopped modding my radios. I simply see no need for it.

 

[AK9R]

I didn't address these two posts earlier, but I'd like to do so now.

Or, rather, Mike @ Gigaparts did. They have an agreement with Yaesu that if the MARS/CAP mod causes a malfunction in the scanner, Gigaparts agrees to pay the repair cost. This mod does not void any warranties from the manufacturer.

What that tells me is that after the mod is done by GigaParts, your only recourse for warranty service will be GigaParts. If Yaesu balks at servicing your radio due to the mod, your radio will have to go to GigaParts for repair. In the unlikely event that GigaParts goes out of business, Yaesu may refuse to service your radio.

I wasn't even thinking about transmitting outside my amateur radio boundaries, more interested in having the extended receive capabilities so I can listen in.

Then, you don't need the mod. It looks like the radio is very broad-banded right out of the box--30 to 999 MHz (cellular frequencies blocked in the U.S.) plus the AM broadcast band.

 

[prcguy]

Considering the warranty aspects of these mods, I've returned a Yaesu FT-817, FT-857 and an FT-897 to Yaesu with diodes and things cut for MARS mods with no affect on warranty service. I know I've returned other brands of radios over the years with mods but can't remember the brands or models at the moment.

I suspect if you did the mod using a soldering gun on tiny surface mount parts and damaged the radio in the process it would be a different story.

 

[TailGator911]

I'm always about the latest and greatest. Expensive addiction, I know. When I order a radio I get whatever options that can be had. Whether I need them or not, I don't want it to be lacking in anything. Factory options, mods, hacks. I once drove back home to Florida and got a radio (IC-275a) and brought it back to a guy at a hamfest in Montgomery, Alabama, just because I liked his mods and his prices and absolutely had to have it. That's just how I roll

 

[zz0468]

One semi-legit use of a modified radio would be in servicing commercial or public safety systems. Sometimes a quick go/no-go check of something needs to be made, and dragging out a heavy service monitor is more trouble than its worth. Or maybe what's needed is a strong uncalibrated signal to see if something is alive and awake somewhere.

In all this, I'm assuming a legitimate service responsibility. In that case, the modified radio is functioning as a piece of test equipment, which doesn't need Part 90 type approval, so far as I know.

The "just in case" scenario doesn't hold water with me. If you put yourself in remote areas out of cellphone range enough to plan ahead that way, get yourself a PLB.

 

[TailGator911]

The "just in case" scenario doesn't hold water with me. If you put yourself in remote areas out of cellphone range enough to plan ahead that way, get yourself a PLB.

Or, maybe, like me, you find yourself in a predicament where all comms are down, no power, no cell phone, no water, water in your house up to your knees, all your windows blown out. Mosquitos eating you alive. Humidity in your house like a pot of boiled vegetables. All you have is your radios and your vehicles to charge them with. That 'just in case' definitely 'holds water' with me, pardon the pun. It's called a hurricane. And, after standing in line for water and rations (no services for 3 seeks) with the masses all day long in 95 degree heat I made a promise to myself that this would never happen to me and my family again. Therefore, I am prepared for the worst, in every way imaginable. I suppose no one can relate to that if they haven't experienced it. I buy the latest and greatest, and radios are only one area of my family plan.

If I want my radios to be wide open and modded to the max, that's my educated option.

 

[kayn1n32008]

The "just in case" scenario doesn't hold water with me. If you put yourself in remote areas out of cellphone range enough to plan ahead that way, get yourself a PLB.

100% a modified hammy rig is not being prepared.

Sadly a PLB/Spot/InReach does not have the ‘cool’ factor that Whackers are looking for by talking on PS frequencies.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[KC4RAF]

Very well written kayn1n32008.
Last year when we had the hurricane come through Polk county here in Florida, I was able to have comms with many people through the use of EOC's hams at the center. Was no need for any modded out transceivers what so ever. Amateur operators right there at the EOC center. to help other amateurs, first responders, etc.

 

[mmckenna]

Or, maybe, like me, you find yourself in a predicament where all comms are down………..I buy the latest and greatest, and radios are only one area of my family plan.

Then it sounds to me like you are spending your money foolishly.

If money isn't the issue and you want to have the latest/greatest, and you want communications in an emergency, then buying an amateur radio is a pretty silly way to go about that.

Some ways you can better spend your money if safety is a concern:
-PLB. Works everywhere. Gets your message to the right people. About $250.00. No monthly/annual charges. Legal. No questions. Anyone can use it, requires no paper license, no special training. Battery powered. Portable, stick it in your pocket. Waterproof/submersible.

-Satellite phone. Works nearly everywhere. Gets your messages to anyone with a phone or e-mail address. Price varies, monthly charges vary. Legal. No questions asked. Anyone can use it, requires no paper license, minimal training. Portable, stick it in your pocket. Can be waterproof.

-HF radio. Works nearly everywhere. Gets your message to anyone with a similar radio. Price varies. No monthly charges. Legal. No questions asked. Anyone can use it in an emergency.

If I want my radios to be wide open and modded to the max, that's my educated option.

It is your choice, but I'd challenge the "educated" part of that statement. Your justifications and overall plan shows a lack of research.

Modifying a VHF or UHF radio to operate outside it's intended parameters is your choice, but there are a couple of things you need to consider:
-Who is it you are going to talk to? If a hurricane hits, who's going to help you on VHF or UHF? Police, Fire, EMS? Only if their systems are up and running and you can reach them. Then you have to deal with the "who's this guy talking on our radio system".

-Why do you think a modded amateur radio is going to work better than one of the above forms of communications?

-If money is not the issue, then why are you choosing what amounts to low end consumer grade equipment? Why not just get a proper Part 90 radio? Many of us are using commercial equipment on the amateur bands since it works with our jobs. Amateur for when we want to play, Part 90 for our work stuff. All legal, no modifications required.

-If you are not concerned about the legal ramifications of this, then you really should be looking at a VHF Air band radio. 121.5MHz AM will likely get you in contact with any aircraft from overhead to the horizon. In a true emergency, there will be enough aircraft up there, all listening on 121.5 that you'll get help.



Your justifications are what we hear from those classified as "whackers". The "I'm going to use my amateur radio on public safety frequencies one way or the other" attitude. True, there is nothing we can do to stop you from doing that, it's your choice.

If it is the only tool you have in an emergency, then it's a valid choice. But to claim to be planning for an emergency, but completely ignoring what people are telling you will work better, well, that does sound a bit wackerish to us. It's obvious you've made up your decision about what you are going to do. So why are you asking these questions?

 

[zz0468]

...It's called a hurricane...

But isn't that exactly the type of event that brings the public service oriented hams out of the woodwork? That being the case, I question the necessity of having public safety frequencies plugged into a ham rig.

And, after standing in line for water and rations (no services for 3 seeks) with the masses all day long in 95 degree heat...

I have to ask... How would ANY radio help with that?

If I want my radios to be wide open and modded to the max, that's my educated option.

It's certainly your prerogative to do that. But the reality is, it's of questionable value, and an unquestionable liability.

 

[mmckenna]

I'll add that I work in the communications field. I run several radio systems, including VHF systems used for our PD and Fire, as well as a trunked system.

When someone comes to me and asks about being outside the coverage of our systems and needing to get help in an emergency, I steer them to the PLB's or a Sat Phone. We have a fleet of loaners that researchers can check out as needed.
We don't give them modded amateur radios. That would be irresponsible of me. We supply the right tool for the job.

The other thing I can tell you is that I've run into similar attitudes at work. Almost always an amateur radio operator. They want me to tell them that in an emergency it's OK to use a modded amateur radio to talk to our 911 dispatchers. Short answer is that it isn't. Part 97 rules aside, the last thing our dispatch center wants is a random person talking on their dispatch channels. I've asked the center supervisor about this specifically. Same answer, it's not the way they want you to contact them. If you have ever been in a 911 PSAP, you'd know that most centers have "call takers" who's job it is to talk to the public. They are trained to ask questions that get them the information they need to do their job. Then, using the Computer Aided Dispatch system (CAD), the information is passed over to the dispatcher. The dispatcher is the one that interfaces with the public safety professionals on the radio. They pass on only the necessary information to get the professionals on their way to where you are.
An amateur radio operator popping up on the dispatch channel will be met with skepticism. Talking with our dispatchers echoed this. Their first reaction will be that "someone got a hold of a radio and is screwing around". Depending on the traffic, they may totally ignore you.
They might eventually take you serious, but then there are some other issues you need to consider:

- You have no idea what other calls they are working on. While you may personally think that your needs are more important than everyone else, that may not be the case. The professionals at the 911 PSAP are trained to triage calls and do the most good with a limited resource. Amateur radio operators popping up and wanting special treatment can screw things up for others.

- Passing a 35 question multiple choice test to get your amateur radio license does NOT make you a public safety professional. You are a hobbyist. There is a huge difference between a professional and a hobbyist. If you think amateur radio operators are special, just take your radio and start butting into a real emergency. You'll find that someone in a uniform will quickly set you straight. If you are causing issues with your radio, you may find yourself temporarily detained and you and your radio separated for a period of time. Explaining to the professionals that you passed a multiple choice test will not go over well.

- Don't confuse you and your radio with being a trained professional. For public safety professionals, a radio is just one of MANY tools they have in their tool box. Like any craftsman, you have to know how and when to use each tool. If the radio is the only tool in your tool box, then you are likely going to use it incorrectly at some point. It's like they guy that only has a hammer. If the hammer is your only tool, then all problems start to look like nails. Don't be that guy.

- If emergency preparedness is your thing, then you need to build up your skills beyond just an amateur radio license. Take something better than a 4 hour first aid class. There are ways that you can get "Advanced First Aid" or "First Responder" training. With those classes goes a bit of knowledge about what constitutes an emergency and what doesn't. That knowledge can help take pressure off the emergency responders. Calling for help is a drain on resources if it's something you can take care of on your own. I learned that in the service. Getting dragged out because of a "perceived emergency" only to discover it was caused by someone not prepared to take care of themselves, or for an issue that could have been solved easily with a bit of training, those all diverted our resources from those with -real- emergencies.

Also, keep in mind, that the public safety professionals have their own families they are worried about. They need sleep, they need to eat, they need to use the bathroom. Having an amateur radio operator that doesn't have a clue what's going on in the rest of the city, county, state, where ever, doesn't treat them with respect. Let the pro's handle it.


I get the idea, you want to protect your family at any cost. I'd do the same for mine. But listen to what those with a lot more experience than you are trying to tell you. There are better ways to do what you want to do. Do not assume that you know what's best for everyone else. Don't pop up on public safety frequencies with your own issues and bypass the dispatchers. That just diverts time, energy and resources from others.

 

[sloop]

Mmckenna, WELL SAID!! As a ham operator and an emergency responder I agree 100% with your post. I have two radios, one for hamming and the other for work and I don't mix the two! My ham HT will not go through the punishment that my work radio takes and at work my life sometimes depends on my radio.

 

[mmckenna]

Mmckenna, WELL SAID!! As a ham operator and an emergency responder I agree 100% with your post. I have two radios, one for hamming and the other for work and I don't mix the two! My ham HT will not go through the punishment that my work radio takes and at work my life sometimes depends on my radio.

Thanks. I've been working in this industry for a long time, but I've been an amateur radio operator longer. I've been in our dispatch center when the doo-doo has hit the fan and heard the phone traffic, the radio traffic and watched the stress the dispatchers were under. Anyone wanting to bypass the system for their own benefit while knowingly putting others lives at risk just screams ignorance.

I've never understood the attitude that getting a passing score on a multiple choice test somehow equals being a public safety professional.

Using what tools you have in an emergency is one thing. Refusing to consider all easily available options is just negligence. Not sure why the though process stops at "if I just remove this resistor from my radio…."

I get the idea of wanting to have a benefit over your neighbors in an emergency, but sometimes the attitudes I see are a bit twisted. So many more ways to do this correctly. It's just one of those -shake-my-head- moments.

 

[TailGator911]

I have no idea what you are talking about, or where you came up with these ridiculous assumptions. I have no desire to transmit on a public safety frequency, nor did I ever claim that was my intention. I would never assume that I know what's best for anybody else. Where did that come from? I am not a Whacker, as you somehow presume. Your diatribe had me scrolling and searching for comments I might have made to initiate such a response. Did I ruffle some feathers here? haha not my intention, guys. Take a deep breath. What's right for me not be right for you, and your blues ain't like my blues. I would probably think you spend your money foolishly, but really who cares? It's yours, spend it however you want to. Have fun with it! Life is short.

I asked a simple question, and I got my answer. Thank you very much!

73s

~~~~~~~,~~~~,~^^-------

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

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McKenna sum'd it all up perfectly--and I think this topic has really gone astray now- far off the track of a warranty issue for a brand specific radio...but so be it- its still a fun issue, No ?
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Highly Charged, emotional-
"Damn good tuck'r, Mates"---
...... this happens any and every time the hint of a "hacking" is about to occur.
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That said, I have to add a Two Cents worth.
At home in my mountains, when hiking (I'm seldom ever alone- safety tip #1)......someone has a 'cel phone. Even in the outbacky-ish of the lower 48, we can find cells a good 80% of the time- at least good enuff by muv'ing about some, or sending text messages we can communicate.
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Number two, --- I like to take along a 2 meter handheld-- There are repeat'rs I can usually hit- though I wouldn't stake my life on any chance I'd so much as get a answer, let alone help. I really carry it for mountain topping things like SCOTA on "52," or to chat with other hikers.
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And number three:
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We/I *usually* (tho not always- its heavy) throw into someone's pack an old trusty friend, my Icom A4 airband handheld. I know with almost dead (opps- shouldn't use that word here ) certainly I can contact some aircraft in our mountains-- it has all the Unicom's for the local fields program'd in.........
And if it come down to something like that poor fellow with his hand wedged beneath a boulder** in a Utah canyon- we can scream out our bloody "MAYDAY !!" on "guard" channel 121.5.
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Note, I did not included a single mention of carrying any "hacked' radios. But someone in our group will have a signal mirror (quite an art to using one, I will add- best practice before you'd really need it)--- there are a loud 'wilderness' whistles.... and my .357 (3 shots in quick succession - so 'they' say-- is a universal distress call-- like 'Yeah.' )
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Carry a hacked radio if it makes one feel better- but don't expect it to be anything but a heavy brick of lead in an emergency.
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Lauri

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______________________________________
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** Want a real life adventure/foolhardy-turned-deadly emergency-- movie? .... watch "127 Hours"
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[mmckenna]

I have no idea what you are talking about, or where you came up with these ridiculous assumptions. I have no desire to transmit on a public safety frequency, nor did I ever claim that was my intention.

Well, this right here for one:

Just more options if, indeed, there is an emergency situation.

If you don't plan to transmit outside the amateur radio bands, then there isn't a need to do the modification to make it transmit outside the amateur radio bands.

If you just want to do it for "reasons", then go at it, no one really cares what you do.

But if, like you said, your intention is "if, indeed, there is an emergency…", then consider what has been posted before you push the button.

Doesn't really matter if you like what was said or not, people have provided some good information. It's not only directed at you, but at any other reader that searches on this subject. This is a public forum and there are a lot of newcomers that show up looking for information about doing this. Unfortunately there are some in the amateur radio community that perpetuate the assumption that amateurs are allowed and encouraged to transmit on public safety frequencies. This thread can serve as a tool for others.

 

[zz0468]

I have no idea what you are talking about, or where you came up with these ridiculous assumptions.

I guess one could make those "ridiculous assumptions" when you post stuff like this:

Or, maybe, like me, you find yourself in a predicament where all comms are down, no power, no cell phone, no water, water in your house up to your knees, all your windows blown out. Mosquitos eating you alive. Humidity in your house like a pot of boiled vegetables. All you have is your radios and your vehicles to charge them with. That 'just in case' definitely 'holds water' with me...

But that's neither here, nor there, I suppose.

The bottom line is, it's your radio. If you want to do it, then do it. I've done it, the purpose was to use it as a piece of test gear added to the arsenal, working on systems I'm authorized to have access to. Definitely NOT to have in case of emergency. I travel to some VERY remote locations, and I'm always within range of something on the ham bands, be it VHF, UHF, or HF.

I exclusively use Part 90 radios for my hobby monitoring, and without exception, THOSE radios are programmed as BLANK in the transmit frequency, even on systems I'm authorized to access.

Your original stated purpose was to expand the receive capability, but the receiver already does what you want, right out of the box. Again, that's neither here nor there. Go forth and conquer.