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Multi-State Communications Networks - The purpose of this forum is for discussion of trunked or conventional communications networks that span more than one state. They are local government or commercial in nature. For Federal or Military use the appropriate Topic Specific forum.

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Old 01-29-2018, 8:18 AM
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Default TRBOconnect IL/IN/KY/OH

This thread is for discussion of the ERS-OCI Wireless TRBOconnect system(s) covering Indiana and parts of Illinois, Kentucky and Ohio.

Please post all queries, findings, etc in this thread.
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Old 01-29-2018, 12:30 PM
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Thank you, Tom!

mike
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Old 02-27-2018, 9:59 AM
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Default "Stadium" site

All,

A submission has been made for the "Stadium Repeater" on this system. Info:

001 (1) Stadium Repeater
01 461.2375
02 461.6875
03 462.1625
04 463.2375
05 463.6375
06 463.9125
07 464.5875
08 464.8625

The submission identifies it as Site 1 (a number already in use), but gives no other identifying information such as county, location, color codes, etc.

I've not gotten a response from the original submitter as to this information; research shows some of the frequencies licensed in the Bloomington, IN area, fairly close to the IU campus, but not enough to convince me that's actually the location.

Unless someone can fill in the blanks I'm going to have to reject this submission as incomplete.
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Old 02-27-2018, 11:39 AM
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<deleted -- not necessary>

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Old 02-27-2018, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wa8pyr View Post
All,

A submission has been made for the "Stadium Repeater" on this system. Info:

001 (1) Stadium Repeater
01 461.2375
02 461.6875
03 462.1625
04 463.2375
05 463.6375
06 463.9125
07 464.5875
08 464.8625

The submission identifies it as Site 1 (a number already in use), but gives no other identifying information such as county, location, color codes, etc.

I've not gotten a response from the original submitter as to this information; research shows some of the frequencies licensed in the Bloomington, IN area, fairly close to the IU campus, but not enough to convince me that's actually the location.

Unless someone can fill in the blanks I'm going to have to reject this submission as incomplete.
Here it is -- Lucas Oil Stadium (actually licensed as Indiana Convention Center but license says its for Lucas Oil Stadium) in Indy.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/...llsign=WQIX923

Already in the DB: https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9454

Mike
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Old 03-22-2018, 7:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtindor View Post
Here it is -- Lucas Oil Stadium (actually licensed as Indiana Convention Center but license says its for Lucas Oil Stadium) in Indy.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/...llsign=WQIX923

Already in the DB: https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9454

Mike
The system is for both Lucas Oil Stadium and the Indiana Convention Center. They are one complex. Most legal paperwork IDs the whole system as LOSICC or LOS/ICC.. (I attend at least 3 conventions there yearly.)
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Old 07-09-2018, 6:10 AM
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Tropo this morning from the west. This site is likely in northern Indiana, such as Peru (Miami) or Bluffton (Wells) given it's neighbor list, although sites 3/9 are not known in the DB and site 10 doesn't exist in the DB.

464.6125 CC
127-11
DCC:9
CON+
NL: 3, 9, 10

Mike
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Old 07-09-2018, 9:32 AM
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There are several sites we have not locked down yet, and still a couple that are being built out. And I believe they still have a couple of LTR and Moto Legacy systems to convert and add in. I keep pushing hard to get folks to jump on this system and help lock it down as it is going to go Statewide by 2020.
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Old 07-09-2018, 12:28 PM
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I'd suspect Site 11 to be Bluffton -- based upon FCC license, site neighbors, and location to those site neighbors. All other ERS licenses that have 464.6125 are too far away for those locations to be neighbors of sites 3 / 9 / 10. Not to mention the fact that Bluffton is closer to me than any other site.

I have occasionally heard some of the other identified single-digit sites in the past, but of course from my location it was not possible to pinpoint them to anything other than NEIN or NWOH, especially with the 454 mhz spectrum being used on some of them.

I question Granger in the DB, simply because, according to the DB, New Castle reports Site 21 as a neighbor. It's a far stretch from New Castle to Grainger, with many active sites in between -- and Grainger licenses are also the same locations as MIshawaka (which does seem correct as Site 18).

Mike
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Old 07-10-2018, 2:29 PM
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Smile Site 13 Neighbor List

Gentlemen,
Watching this thread carefully, since I spend a little time in the Richmond area (Wayne Co) every now and then...

Pulled my "notes" from a field excursion a little bit back and have info on Site 13 (Richmond) that shows that its NL was as follows:

Site 10 - ???
Site 13 - Richmond (Wayne Co)
Site 14 - Anderson (Madison Co)
Site 26 - ???
Site 29 - New Castle (Henry Co)

Unfortunately, there was virtually no traffic at the time I was running DSD+ on Site 13, so I was not able to get LCN's for it. I want to say that I believe Site 26 may, big MAY here, be Connersville (Fayette Co) (WPPV349) site...

Going to try to help as much as I can with this system; however, since I live in Preble Co, Ohio, it makes it a little bit of "work" to get information. But, I will contribute as much as I can, when I can....

Hope this helps,
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Last edited by n8yid; 07-10-2018 at 2:33 PM..
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Old 07-12-2018, 8:34 AM
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For anybody who (a) is within earshot of one or more sites in the DB and (b) is capable of using DSDPlus to obtain Site neighbor information (and LCN info), please consider parking on the control channel for a while and gathering/submitting info.

NOTE: Just because one frequency on a site might be listed on a CC doesn't mean that there aren't other control channels. If you do not pick up a DMR CON+ signal on the listed control channel and feel you should, check the other frequencies associated with that site.

There are many sites with no site neighbor information. We definitely could benefit from having that information from those sites which lack that information. But, even if a site does have site neighbor information it would be nice to have the latest site neighbor listing for each site (in case the neighbor lists have changed).

I do have a question about LCN order (and this is directed to milf and KD4YGG) -- Are all of those LCNS / LCN order confirmed? It appears that all frequencies associated with a site license might have been added and that LCNs might not be confirmed. And if the LCNs are not confirmed, all nonconfirmed LCNs should be set to an "invalid" LCN so that people know at a glance whether or not the LCNs need to be confirmed. Or, some other notation should be made to indicate that LCN order isn't confirmed.

On the other hand, if every frequency/LCN is confirmed to be active and accurate, that's a pretty great job you guys have done on sleuthing out that system.

Mike
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Old 07-20-2018, 2:07 PM
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Cool Little more info...

For anyone interested....

Found some time to do a bit more sleuthing on the Hoosier-side of the line today.... this info was taken during a drive, starting in College Corner, to Liberty, then to Richmond... monitored stationary in those spots with (2) BCD436's, a TRX-1 and a Laptop running DSD+... external antennas on all monitoring devices....

ERS/OCI Connect+ - Indiana (NID: 127)

Site: 7 (Indianapolis) must've been tropo on this one...)
DCC: 4
463.200 - no traffic heard

Site: 10 (Either Muncie <Delaware Co WPPV656> or Marion <Grant Co WPUG943>)
DCC: 10
NL: 9, 11, 13, 14, 26
464.6625 - no traffic heard

Site:13 (Richmond) - site info per RR.com/ again, no traffic to help with LCN's...
DCC: 2
NL: 10, 14, 26, 29
461.4875

Site: 26
DCC: 5
NL: 10, 13, 14, 29, 33
463.2125 LCN #1
463.4625 LCN #2
- Heard TG 26100 talking with dispatch

Site: 29 (New Castle Henry Co) - no traffic to help with LCN's... but, was able to sit on 463.9625 and
have DSD+ pull Site information...
DCC: 12
NL: 13, 21, 26, 30, 33
463.9625

for Site: 26, FCC records have the freqs being used as located in Henry County (New Castle)... and the frequencies being used for Site:29 as located in Fayette County (Connersville)...

Confused now... unless there is the possibility that Sites 26 & 29 should be "switched" around....

Dave T.
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Old 07-20-2018, 3:14 PM
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Don't rule out ignorance on behalf of the tech when setting these systems up. I often come in behind these guys and find poor RF install practices, misconfigured sites, incorrect neighbor lists, unlicensed or mis-licensed frequencies, etc. TT
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Old 07-20-2018, 9:57 PM
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Dave, et al,

I think you are right about Site 26 / Site 29

Site 26
- based upon frequencies (463.2125 / 463.4625)
- based upon site neighbors (10 / 13 / 14 / 29 / 33) New Castle sites smack dab in middle of them

Site 29 is Connersville
- process of elimination - 463.9625 is only licensed to New Castle and Connersville
- based upon site neighbors (13 / 21 / 26 / 30 / 33) Connersville sits in the middle of them

The conundrum:

Mishawaka / Granger - Four licenses - all with the same physical location
- license address: 4 km S of Int SR 23 and Adams Rd
- license city: one says Granger, 3 say Mishawaka
- FCC ASR database shows same location for all four licenses (12990 SR 23, Granger, IN)

Yet, there is a MIshawaka in the DB and a Granger in the DB.
- Site 18 Mishawaka would be correct (based upon neighbors reporting site 18 as a neighbor)
- Site 21 Granger would not be correct (but its listed because 461.65 is only licensed to ERS at Granger)

The only site (per DB) that we know which lists Site 21 as a neighbor is Site 29 Connersville (463.9625). Granger is a long way from Connersville, way to far to be a neighbor.

So there are discrepencies between Site 18 / Site 21. And the question of Site 21 being a neighbor of Site 29 Connersville even though Site 21 Granger is too far away. It could be a programming mistake. It could be a copying mistake / a mistake writing down info for 461.65. If Site 29 and Site 18 were online before all of the other sites in between them, then they could have been neighbors at some point in the past.

Either Site 21 isn't Granger, or Site 29 is erroneously reporting Site 21 _as_ a neighbor, or 461.65 is not the actual frequency that was copied as broadcasting a site ID of 21, or ERS is using somebody else's license down somewhere surrounding Connersville for 461.65 Site 21.

Another note: Site 20

Site 20 isn't listed in the DB, but it is listed as a neighbor of Sites 7, 15, 22 and 34. That would suggest that Site 20 is going to be one of the following: Indianapolis (High School Rd), Bloomington, Bedford, French Lick, Borden or Columbus.

Sure would help if somebody could get a site neighor listing from Sites 25 (Floyds Knob), 28 (North Vernon), 30 (Greensburg) .

My Map: https://goo.gl/2EiCzS
- does not jive completely with the RRDB currently
- red sites with a * suggest that I have a higher confidence of their location
- red balloons suggest I don't have quite as much confidence in them yet
- there are sites in the DB totally missing from the map (since locations of those sites aren't known yet)
- 19 could be Lafayette or Indianapolis (High School Rd) but probably is Lafayette
- 19 probably Lafayette right because site 15 and site 34 report is at a neighbor
- 1 could be ligonier, evansville or lafayette per FCC licensing
- but we already know evansville; lafayette is likely 19, and ligionier would be the other choice
- plus during tropo I copied Site 1. I often copy into NW Ohio during tropo and Ligonier is not out of the question
- but it is unlikely that I would have copied lafayette during tropo without copying a slew of other sites in between

So although my map suggests my doubts about Lafayette and Ligonier, I believe they are correct.

If the map isn't useful to you, just forget about the link

Mike
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Last edited by mtindor; 07-20-2018 at 10:15 PM..
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Old 07-23-2018, 6:05 PM
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Cool Gentlemen... your thoughts..

I believe Site #10 is going to be Muncie... or have we already decided that?

Using Mikes' site map (Big Thank You for the hard work on that, btw), I printed out and sat down with an enlarged copy of my area of the map, a straight edge and a pencil and played "connect" the dots/sites...

Site 13 (Richmond) and Site 26 (New Castle), both which reference Site 10 in their Neighbor Lists', had one unconnected site in common.... Muncie

...and since I was able to get a copy on Site 10 the other day, its NL has Site 9 and Site 11 showing..
I believe Site 9 is definitely going to be Marion (which the list shows) and Site 11 is more than likely Bluffton, even though that is an approx 35 mile distant neighbor (straight as the fly crows)... the only other site in the area that could possibly be a neighbor is Kokomo (site 12), and it is further yet (approx 45 miles)...

Thoughts, comments, concerns?

Dave T.
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Old 07-23-2018, 8:10 PM
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You are welcome, Dave. I'm glad it was useful. And making a map is not nearly as difficult [for me at least] as wardriving is. I appreciate all of you guys who go out and actually look for sites in your travels.

I must admit I was too lazy to do a print-out, so I was doing what you were doing with a folder piece of paper on my laptop screen. I'm sure connect-the-dots is much more enjoyable the way you did it.

My "scientific" notes regarding 9/10/11 (with the first line indicating the FCC license locations that are licensed for that frequency):

Code:
9	461.4625	MARION, madison(no), anderson(no)
			anderson is already figured out
			9 is a neighbor of Peru - Madison is too far away to be a neighbor
			site neighbors are:  11, 12, 14, 16, 27
			so 9 is Marion
10	464.6625	MUNCIE or marion (no)
			marion is already figured out as 9
			site neighbors broadcast are:  9, 11, 13, 14, 26
			so 10 is Muncie
11	464.6125	danville(no), peru(no), BLUFFTON
			peru is already figured out
			danville is already figured out
			site neighbors broadcast are:  3, 9, 10
			so 11 must be Bluffton
For what it is worth, I copied that Bluffton site recently, as you know, from East Ohio. Since I've never experienced tropo to Western Indiana but have quite often see tropo into NE Ohio / NW Indiana, I tend to believe that 11 is Bluffton. I had come to that conclusion before Peru and Danville were ruled out by having been identified already.

So those are my thoughts, which seem to jive with your and probably also with the admins who have been making progress on the system.

Site 3 is a neighbor of (11) Bluffton and (1) Ligionier, and I'd guess is likely Warsaw, Ft Wayne or Auburn.

Site 2, 3, 4, 6 and 8 are clearly up in the northern section.

Thanks to everyone who previous obtained data (esp site neighbors). The information is so useful!

Mike

Last edited by mtindor; 07-23-2018 at 8:14 PM..
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Old 07-26-2018, 1:25 PM
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Sit 21 corrected .. Proper location is Columbus, IN. As also its being there fits in with the basic site neighbor numeration scheme thus far. Its finally starting to come together nicely.
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Old 07-26-2018, 1:53 PM
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milf,
Are you going to revise the entries on Sites 26 & 29 to reflect the location change (ie Site 26 is New Castle, etc)?... or, would you prefer me to put in a submission to do it?
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Old 07-26-2018, 2:24 PM
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Go ahead and make a sub.. I will try to get all my subs worked in before next week as from Wed til the nexxt Monday I am at Gen Con. And this is the same New Castle that was in the LTR listing? If so that resolves that one at least.
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Old 07-26-2018, 2:54 PM
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OK, I have one pending sub now, that has Site 26 info, just no location.... that location has been determined to be New Castle (26) in Henry Co...

As well, Connersville in Fayette Co has been determined to be Site 29...

I will put in a sub for these two locations...

I'm not sure about your New Castle/LTR question.... I didn't see a "New Castle" in any of the remaining LTR Sites....
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