ADAM-12 error

[karldotcom]

Nearly all computer use in movies and television are just screens that have been created/programmed to show the intended results when an actor presses a key or two...

 

[prcguy]

This was in the town of San Pedro, CA where there is still constant filming (taping) of TV shows a movies. The house I was born and raised in was in in a major movie plus I was an accidental extra in an episode of "Friends" where a friend and I tracked down some unusually bright lights at our local High School and we followed a few hundred people being herded into the bleachers for a shoot. Everyone seemed to be in subdued colored clothes and my bright jacket really stood out when the episode aired.
prcguy

What neighborhood was that? I remember reading that they filmed in areas north of Universal Studios back then. Toluca Lake, etc (?)

If you watch all of the seasons you can see the progression from the studio back lots to various areas in and out of the city.

Someone stated that the street addresses that they dispatched were real streets but they didn't intersect. Watching a few episodes and looking up the locations, actually revealed real locations in the city.

 

[SCPD]

If I'm reading correctly someone said that only the supervisor vehicles had a radio dedicated to receiving the division mobile frequency. Some had more than one division on the same mobile frequency such as West L.A. (#8) and Venice (#14 now called "Pacific "). I lived in the Venice Division near LAX. I remember sometime in the mid 60's being at the scene of something where people were out on the street watching some type of police activity. My dad and I became interested in the radio traffic we were hearing out of one of the cars. I remember seeing two control heads on the dashboard. I remember hearing both sides of the conversation as being up on the on the bluff where Westchester is located has some great reception of the western L.A. Basin/Santa Monica area. We could hear a lot of activity on the mobile side as a result. It was a bit confusing to hear the dispatchers (RTO if memory services me) talking with a car in another division other than West L.A. and Venice simultaneously with a car in those divisions speaking with a RTO. I think there were only 5 dispatch frequencies and many more mobile frequencies. Each RTO had to wait for the dispatch frequency to clear to answer a unit that had called in on a mobile frequency if things were busy. .

Anyhow, I listening to the mobile side of the conversations in those division that night because it confused my dad and I. I remember my dad asking an officer what the second control head was and the reply was they could hear the other cars calling the dispatcher. This was an adam unit as two officers returned to the sedan and a single officer got in a station wagon and left about the same time. I remember having two green lights on each control head at the same time and sometimes one at a time while standing at the open front passenger window of the adam unit.

One other question I would like to ask about that era. When I purchased my first real scanner, a crystal Regency, in 1970 I could hear the SF Valley. Sometimes I would hear a RTO from the valley speaking when a L.A. Basin would transmit right over the top of them. I asked a ham radio friend of mine if the southern divisions would hear the valley units like I did and he said no. I don't recall what his answer was. I don't think CTCSS was in use then otherwise this would be the logical answer. Does anyone know how the two areas operated on the same frequency without each hearing each other?

 

[KMA367]

If I'm reading correctly someone said that only the supervisor vehicles had a radio dedicated to receiving the division mobile frequency. Some had more than one division on the same mobile frequency such as West L.A. (#8) and Venice (#14 now called "Pacific ").

(First of all, remember we're talking about LAPD's VHF-era, pre-1981, and they weren't using repeaters.)

When LAPD added the two Tac frequencies to the patrol cars in 1967-68, they switched from their previous 1- and 2-channel radios, to four-channel DFE rigs. The old radios then became available and got programmed as receive-only for the mobile (uplink) side of their dispatch frequency pair, so the officers could now hear transmissions from other units in their division(s). Previously they could only hear the dispatch side. Generally the first of these mobile receivers (known informally as "cheaters") went to supervisors' cars, but most patrol cars eventually got them. And yes, there were more divisions than frequencies, so a number of divisions got paired together on uplink/downlink channels... like WLA and Venice, which you mention.

I lived in the Venice Division near LAX. I remember sometime in the mid 60's being at the scene of something where people were out on the street watching some type of police activity. My dad and I became interested in the radio traffic we were hearing out of one of the cars. I remember seeing two control heads on the dashboard. I remember hearing both sides of the conversation as being up on the on the bluff where Westchester is located has some great reception of the western L.A. Basin/Santa Monica area. We could hear a lot of activity on the mobile side as a result. It was a bit confusing to hear the dispatchers (RTO if memory services me) talking with a car in another division other than West L.A. and Venice simultaneously with a car in those divisions speaking with a RTO. I think there were only 5 dispatch frequencies and many more mobile frequencies. Each RTO had to wait for the dispatch frequency to clear to answer a unit that had called in on a mobile frequency if things were busy.

Exactly right. Again, there were more divisions than available dispatch downlink frequencies, so there were multiple divisions - and RTOs ("RadioTelephone Operators" = dispatchers) sharing each downlink frequency. With two exceptions I won't get into, they only had 5 dispatch frequencies at the high point, so as many as 5 dispatchers - talking to their 5 to 8 divisions - could all be sharing a single downlink frequency. There was some sort of interlocking device that allowed only one RTO to transmit at a time on each downlink freq.

Anyhow, I listening to the mobile side of the conversations in those division that night because it confused my dad and I. I remember my dad asking an officer what the second control head was and the reply was they could hear the other cars calling the dispatcher. This was an adam unit as two officers returned to the sedan and a single officer got in a station wagon and left about the same time. I remember having two green lights on each control head at the same time and sometimes one at a time while standing at the open front passenger window of the adam unit.

One other question I would like to ask about that era. When I purchased my first real scanner, a crystal Regency, in 1970 I could hear the SF Valley. Sometimes I would hear a RTO from the valley speaking when a L.A. Basin would transmit right over the top of them. I asked a ham radio friend of mine if the southern divisions would hear the valley units like I did and he said no. I don't recall what his answer was. I don't think CTCSS was in use then otherwise this would be the logical answer. Does anyone know how the two areas operated on the same frequency without each hearing each other?

That situation was unique to the Valley divisions, WLA-and-Venice, and Harbor Div, and at times they definitely would hear the other areas' dispatchers. For several years from about the mid-60s to the early 70s, all of these divisions used 159.03 as their downlink frequency (because there were only three downlink freqs for the whole city until about 1971). There were separate transmit sites for each of the three areas, and they did their best to use distance, and directional and possibly down-tilt antennas to keep the overlap to a minimum. As you suggested they also used separate CTCSS tones on each. But as opposed to the metropolitan frequencies I alluded to above, these three transmit sites worked independently of each other, so the Valley, WLA-Venice and Harbor RTOs could all transmit at the same time.

It wasn't anywhere near perfect, but unless you were in a particularly bad area and all three transmitters were going simultaneously, it worked OK most of the time. The upper parts of the Santa Monica Mountains toward Mulholland Drive were one of the problematic areas: the Valley and West L.A. transmitters had to cover their sides of that ridge, and if your receiver was already open listening to one of your side's RTOs your audio could get wiped out if the other side's transmitter lit up. For example, a West LA car working on Mulholland would be listening to WLA & Venice calls from "their" 159.03 site, but if a Valley RTO then came on the air on THEIR 159.03, you were ripe for interference.

Clear as intermud?

P.S. I don't remember ever seeing any LAPD cars that I knew to be assigned to LAX or Air Support Division, so I have no idea about aircraft radios (or three radios) in them, though it does make sense. But I distinctly remember seeing patrol sedans from time to time with longer roof-mounted antennas, base-loaded as I recall. My impression at the time was that they might have been 5/8-waves for the 154-159 range, but I never looked closely or measured them or asked anybody. Maybe a radio tech just didn't bother cutting a quarter-wave down to size.

 

[Archie]

Adam 12 car radios

Watched a re run today, correct me if mistaken, looked like the car radio had six frequencies in it.

Correct??? What was the maximum number of frequencies that could be added to those car radios??

Many Thanks

 

[n5ims]

Watched a re run today, correct me if mistaken, looked like the car radio had six frequencies in it.

Correct??? What was the maximum number of frequencies that could be added to those car radios??

Many Thanks

Based on memory (and this thread --> https://forums.radioreference.com/motorola-forum/281757-mocom-70-control-head-12-channel.html <-- to help support it), they maxed out at 12 channels. These were very rare and generally were only sold to a few large cities. The radios themselves were specialized units (often modified IMTS telephone units) and very expensive. The cities that had them often only put them in specialized units (division commanders and above) while the typical units were 2 or 4 channel units that only had their sector's frequencies. These special radios could be switched to the various sectors as needed so the commanders could control major incidents.

 

[PaulNDaOC]

In the late 70's, LASD cars had 8 channel GE radios, five dispatch channels of the patrol region east/west, "c" charlie, 'H' henry. and 'E' Edward, or 'W' William, the regional tactical for unusual events. It was on 'E' or 'W' where units switched over to run subjects for warrants. I don't think you could obtain a radio that could accommodate everything that was used in the crystal days.
It would seem that 4 slots would be all a patrol unit would need for the LAPD VHF system as it was then as it was not until technology advancing past the days of crystal radios and the release of new freq spectrum by the FCC, allowed capacity to expand cheaply and enable inclusion of every freq possible.

In the 70's the 18-20 VHF -low channels on the LASD dispatcher console (tac's included) was considered beyond huge at the time, as compared to say CHP that used the same 8-10 on 42 mhz statewide.

 

[Archie]

NYPD two way radios with telephone style head sets???

Remember watching the 1960's TV series "NYPD" ( great cast and gritty show) and their car radios had a telephone style head set used as a microphone and speaker ...was this just a gimmick for detectives/ supervisors only??

Saw some of these auctioned by the Yonkers, NY, PD in the very late 1970's along with the standard Motorola radio heads.

Also saw one in the "French Connection" car chase, Black uniformed NYPD cop calls in via above type head set to set up the road block at the George Washington bridge...now that the toll is an obscene $12.00, I feel like driving through it too!! LOL

 

[jcardani]

Up until the 1980's Philadelphia Police used the GE Master II radios with the telephone handsets. There was a PTT button on the inside of the handset to talk.

 

[mule1075]

Remember watching the 1960's TV series "NYPD" ( great cast and gritty show) and their car radios had a telephone style head set used as a microphone and speaker ...was this just a gimmick for detectives/ supervisors only??

Saw some of these auctioned by the Yonkers, NY, PD in the very late 1970's along with the standard Motorola radio heads.

Also saw one in the "French Connection" car chase, Black uniformed NYPD cop calls in via above type head set to set up the road block at the George Washington bridge...now that the toll is an obscene $12.00, I feel like driving through it too!! LOL

FDNY still uses the telephone handset.

 

[Archie]

Correction to my posting above

OOOPS!!! Car chase was in "The Seven Ups" NOT "The French Connection"

 

[Matakovich1]

My ambulance I worked on back in 2010/2011 had the the telephone handsets hooked up in the back with a standard palm mic in the front.

 

[frankdrebbin]

I remember watching Adam-12 when I was a kid and remembering KMA367 on the radio. I always wondered when Malloy called for a "radio car" what was that exactly? I watched Emergency! a lot more and remember watching Cap talk on his Handi-Talkie and collapsing the antenna down when he was done xmitting and wondering how he would receive any comms with said collapsed antenna.

 

[ladn]

I remember watching Adam-12 when I was a kid and remembering KMA367 on the radio. I always wondered when Malloy called for a "radio car" what was that exactly? I watched Emergency! a lot more and remember watching Cap talk on his Handi-Talkie and collapsing the antenna down when he was done xmitting and wondering how he would receive any comms with said collapsed antenna.

An LAPD "radio car" is just a regular black and white patrol car. "A" cars (as in 1Adam12) were two man cars, "L" (Lincoln) cars were single man units, as in 1Lincoln10 who was a sergeant. The leading number was the station/division (in this case Central Division), the ending number was the unit or beat designation. LAPD also uses "non-geographic" identifiers for citywide special units.

On Emergency, Cap was a dysfunctional radio user.In the station scenes, he tended to talk into the back side of the hand mic. In reality, extending the HT antenna on xmit gave the antenna better efficiency. The radio would still receive with the antenna collapsed, but not as well--didn't really matter in a strong signal area, but would make a difference in the fringes.

Both Adam 12 and Emergency (as well as Dragnet) were Jack Webb productions. Webb was a stickler for authenticity and I'm a bit surprised that Captain Stanley's radio backwardness wasn't caught and corrected.

 

[frankdrebbin]

An LAPD "radio car" is just a regular black and white patrol car. "A" cars (as in 1Adam12) were two man cars, "L" (Lincoln) cars were single man units, as in 1Lincoln10 who was a sergeant. The leading number was the station/division (in this case Central Division), the ending number was the unit or beat designation. LAPD also uses "non-geographic" identifiers for citywide special units.

On Emergency, Cap was a dysfunctional radio user.In the station scenes, he tended to talk into the back side of the hand mic. In reality, extending the HT antenna on xmit gave the antenna better efficiency. The radio would still receive with the antenna collapsed, but not as well--didn't really matter in a strong signal area, but would make a difference in the fringes.

Both Adam 12 and Emergency (as well as Dragnet) were Jack Webb productions. Webb was a stickler for authenticity and I'm a bit surprised that Captain Stanley's radio backwardness wasn't caught and corrected.

Thanks for the explanation of radio car. I could never find it anywhere. I know Jack Webb strived for authenticity. I am lineman and always shudder when seeing Chet or Marco cutting downed sparking power lines with a pair of loppers, from the ground, with no rubber gloves but I guess that adds to the drama. Still like both shows anyway.

 

[mmckenna]

The sergeants wagon from Adam-12 (or a reasonable facsimile) was on display at APCO this year:

And just for kicks, "CHiPs" era CHP car:

 

[krokus]

I know Jack Webb strived for authenticity. I am lineman and always shudder when seeing Chet or Marco cutting downed sparking power lines with a pair of loppers, from the ground, with no rubber gloves but I guess that adds to the drama. Still like both shows anyway.

Or using a pike pole to lift power lines off of a car.

Both Emergency and Adam 12 inspired a lot of people to get into public safety, or at least inspired other shows that inspired later generations.

Sent using Tapatalk

 

[PaulNDaOC]

Emergency! is so full of technical accuracies it's best just to turn your institutional knowledge off when watching it.

For example, a squad was never dispatched on it's own then as now to any type of call, especially back then when it was closer to the days that were pre-medic and the captain played a bigger role at medical calls.

Before paramedics LA County Fire was not even running EMT's. BTW. There was the resuscitator in the green case and that was about it.

 

[radioman2001]

The radio in the back of that Sattelite wagon is a Mocom 70 (looks like a 110 watt unit), with a max channel capacity of 8 frequencies unless it had another extension board on the back of it. I bought over 100 of them at an auction in the 80's. A Motrac HHT model which was seen in the pilot episode (when Reed looks in the trunk at the station while Malloy gives him the lowdown about the car.) it had a max capacity of 4 frequencies, unless it had the 8 inch extension on the back end of the radio then it could go to 8 frequencies with the Dual Front End (receives a second channel at the same time by injecting both receivers into a single IF stage). I have a few of them also. Motrans the 30 watt VHF solid state version of the Motrac had the same capabilities. The 12 freq VHF unit mentioned was a TLD which was VHF version of the car phone at that time, or the Mark 12 the UHF version which only needed one crystal for each frequency since on UHF they had an offset crystal for the spacing of 5 mhz. Same theory was used later in the Micors on UHF. There were many of those around up until the 90's, I have collected a few of them too.


The telephone style handset has been around for NYPD and FDNY since they got radios. It's much easier to hear radio transmission through the handset than the speaker in pre-noise abatement vehicles. In the 80's NYCEMS dropped them as they had a high failure rate,and NYPD went in the 70's almost exclusively to portables (HT-200 then HT-220) except for bosses cars.

referring back to the other post listed here.
Quote"
Well I'll comment, and that would be good luck and best wishes. A 12 channel Motrac/Motran/Mocom will be about as rare as hens teeth. I imagine someone with a dire need would be the only one to order some and Motorola would have to SP a design to make it work. This would equate to many $$$.

I actually have one with the correct cable NOS. sorry but I have a lot of junk.

Quote"
Or using a pike pole to lift power lines off of a car.

Been there done that back in the 70's myself.

 

[cmdrwill]

The radio in the back of that Sattelite wagon is a Mocom 70 (looks like a 110 watt unit), with a max channel capacity of 8 frequencies unless it had another extension board on the back of it.

No the radio in the station wagon is a Mitrek. Not a Mocom 70. All tho they do work with the Motrac control heads and cables with a change in the control head so the speaker is not grounded.

Most VHF MITREKs were 40 watts. And that one looks to be the longer housing that is the high power radio. Or could be the SP with more than 4 channel capability,

Two mikes and only one radio?????

And I kick myself for letting my dual frontend dual receive LAPD Motrac and LAPD halftrac radios go.