Apologies- FT-70D noob

[KF0JZS]

So I hope this hasn’t been covered in a thread already, since I searched and didn’t find an answer.

I got my tech 2 years ago, but life got crazy and I’m just now trying to get started. After a little research, I bought a Yaesu FT70D, but have found its not even close to reaching my closest repeater (~20 miles) and until I’m further down the rabbit hole my wife has little tolerance for me laying out a ton of cash on equipment.

I had a chance to chat with a club member who recommended I get a J-pole, but after looking at those on-line I’m still not sure what I need - can someone lay it out for me at the kindergarten level please?

Thanks in advance, Sean KF0JZS

 

[KC3ECJ]

Is the repeater 2m or 70cm?
A handheld Yagi antenna might be of some use.

 

[KF0JZS]

2m is 21 miles away, 70cm is 22 miles

 

[rf_patriot200]

2m is 21 miles away, 70cm is 22 miles

Are you using the oem anternna that came with your FT70 ?? Mine works great, but some users have switched to a higher gain antenna, like the Signal Stick, from the Signal Stuff company.

 

[KF0JZS]

I bought a Diamond SRH77CA and got some improvement, but I believe my primary problem is terrain and I need to get further off the ground. Hence the recommendation I received about acquiring a J-pole and putting it on a mast or up a tree - I could do either, but I’m not sure what all I need. I see plenty of j-antennas on ebay, but I assume I’d need some additional cabling to attach it to the radio, also a bit concerned about grounding.

 

[rf_patriot200]

I bought a Diamond SRH77CA and got some improvement, but I believe my primary problem is terrain and I need to get further off the ground. Hence the recommendation I received about acquiring a J-pole and putting it on a mast or up a tree - I could do either, but I’m not sure what all I need. I see plenty of j-antennas on ebay, but I assume I’d need some additional cabling to attach it to the radio, also a bit concerned about grounding.

For only 22 miles away to a Repeater, a j pole while doable is overkill. Your standard dual band duck antenna should do this fine on high power, or maybe even medium power on a Gain antenna like your Diamond 77, or a Signal like I mentioned.

 

[KF0JZS]

Even without LOS? This isn’t a flat area and that’s the only reason I can think of for the lack of signal.

 

[K4EET]

I bought a Diamond SRH77CA and got some improvement, but I believe my primary problem is terrain and I need to get further off the ground. Hence the recommendation I received about acquiring a J-pole and putting it on a mast or up a tree - I could do either, but I’m not sure what all I need. I see plenty of j-antennas on ebay, but I assume I’d need some additional cabling to attach it to the radio, also a bit concerned about grounding.

You say that the primary problem might be terrain. Do you know if you can achieve Line-of-Sight to both repeaters by going higher with an external antenna? What azimuth from your QTH are the 2M and 70cm repeaters? For a Yagi antenna, would they be in the beamwidth if you had a dual band Yagi? And I have to ask just to be sure that your Yaesu FT-70D is programmed correctly, have you gone to an alternate location and talked to someone on both repeaters? It probably is correctly programmed but I just wanted to be sure that the toaster was plugged in to the wall outlet before we took the toaster apart because it wasn’t making toast. 73, Dave K4EET

 

[KF0JZS]

You say that the primary problem might be terrain. Do you know if you can achieve Line-of-Sight to both repeaters by going higher with an external antenna? What azimuth from your QTH are the 2M and 70cm repeaters? For a Yagi antenna, would they be in the beamwidth if you had a dual band Yagi? And I have to ask just to be sure that your Yaesu FT-70D is programmed correctly, have you gone to an alternate location and talked to someone on both repeaters? It probably is correctly programmed but I just wanted to be sure that the toaster was plugged in to the wall outlet before we took the toaster apart because it wasn’t making toast. 73, Dave K4EET

Yes, I’ve been able to talk to folks on those repeaters when closer to them.

 

[KF0JZS]

Here’s the 2 closest

 

[KD9AKE]

Look into a Ed Fong Duel Band. Been using one for past 3 years in a RV and have had very few problems hitting repeaters at that distance with a FT-70 or a VX-6.

Ed Fong J-Pole Antennas - 6 Variations

J-Pole Antenna designed by Ed Fong out of California. These antennas are custom built and come in several different versions. Be sure and choose the version you want from the drop-down menu. 6 variations of this antenna: 144/440 J-pole that fits in a PVC pipe 220 J-pole that fits in a PVC pipe...

grapevineamateurradio.com

 

[mmckenna]

Getting an antenna up higher MAY be what you need. VHF is mostly line of sight, and UHF is more so. If you have dirt between your radio and the repeater, then getting above that will help.

A hand held radio is going to be limited by it's altitude, antenna and lack of ground plane/counterpoise.

Before you spend money, it's usually a good idea to do a little test:
If you can easily and safely access the roof of your home, take the hand held radio up there and see if you can reach the repeater. That extra height may be enough to do the trick. Climbing trees is probably out of the question….

But, give it a try, that'll tell you a lot.

Be careful with antenna recommendations. What works for one person in their specific location may not work for you.
A J-Pole is a half wave antenna, so it'll have no gain. That lack of gain plus coaxial cable losses are something you need to consider. A higher gain antenna might be beneficial, and you absolutely need to consider your coaxial cable as part of the overall antenna system.
22 miles with a clear line of sight shouldn't be an issue with a decent antenna and suitable coaxial cable for the length of run. J-poles can be an easy and cost effective solution, but be careful buying them off e-Bay/Amazon. Most of them are pretty poorly constructed and you could probably build your own much easier/cheaper.
If you want your setup/investment to last you a long time, consider a good base station antenna like one of the Diamond brand ones. Also, pay attention to the length of your coaxial cable and the inherent losses with that. Don't spend money on a good antenna and then use inappropriate cable.

 

[K4EET]

Here’s the 2 closest

So the two repeaters that you would like to reach are south of you about 90 degrees apart in azimuth. What @mmckenna said is good info. Let us know if you can do the “roof test” with the HT and what the results are.

As for a Yagi antenna, that may not be in your best interest. The repeaters are wider than the beamwidth would be. Also, if you have a solid obstruction blocking the repeaters, a Yagi antenna may not work either. Besides, your RF energy is mostly directed in one direction.

So see what else you can shed light on and we will try to help you access those repeaters.

 

[KF0JZS]

You say that the primary problem might be terrain. Do you know if you can achieve Line-of-Sight to both repeaters by going higher with an external antenna? What azimuth from your QTH are the 2M and 70cm repeaters? For a Yagi antenna, would they be in the beamwidth if you had a dual band Yagi? And I have to ask just to be sure that your Yaesu FT-70D is programmed correctly, have you gone to an alternate location and talked to someone on both repeaters? It probably is correctly programmed but I just wanted to be sure that the toaster was plugged in to the wall outlet before we took the toaster apart because it wasn’t making toast. 73, Dave K4EET

Yes, I’ve been able to talk to folks on those repeaters when closer to them.

 

[KF0JZS]

Serendipitous event - at a church picnic this afternoon and brought up I was starting out in HAM as a new hobby. One of the guys there asked if I was interested in some antennas. Kiwanis club took down two FM antennas to use the lower half for lights at s local ballpark, but they have been storing the tops for a while with no purpose in mind - I’m going to get some pictures and ask for advice.

 

[KF0JZS]

I can probably do the roof test tomorrow - thanks all

 

[KF0JZS]

I rode mountain bike up to the top of the hill backside of my property, which is the one highest point around here, around 90 feet above my house and overlooks the Missouri river flood plain. Tried everything in repeater book within 50 miles with no responses to CQ. Haven’t been able to arrange a time to go look at the antennas yet - MTF

 

[KF0JZS]

Got a look at the antennas today, nothing impressive - simply mast sections able to get me 80-90‘ if i used them to raise something else.

 

[alcahuete]

I rode mountain bike up to the top of the hill backside of my property, which is the one highest point around here, around 90 feet above my house and overlooks the Missouri river flood plain. Tried everything in repeater book within 50 miles with no responses to CQ. Haven’t been able to arrange a time to go look at the antennas yet - MTF

You don't want to call CQ on a repeater. It's bad form, and people probably aren't going to answer. Were you actually able to get into the repeaters? You will normally get the repeater carrier back if you're hitting it, sometimes a morse/voice ID, or courtesy tone. People might not answer, but were you at least able to hit the repeaters?

 

[KB2GOM]

Where I live -- near Troy NY -- it's permissible to say "YOURCALL testing" on the repeater.

If other hams hear you, often they will come back with a signal report for you.

If you belong to a ham club, you might ask some members to come over to test if they can hit the repeaters from your location.

Also, make sure your handi-talkie is set on high power. (I'm not being condescending here; I have an HT that occasionally itself to low power for reasons unknown.