CHIRP or similar FreeOpenSourceSoftware Support? Arduino?

[nergal]

Mornin'!
I noticed a distinct lack of native support for anything Motorola within CHIRP, which is a pity for models whose programming tools are long since No Longer Available.
Recently inherited a box of SP50 radios. Some work together, others need to be reprogrammed to sync with the others, and others still do not turn on.

<x-thread, no desire to reopen>
I go into this knowing that it probably isn't worth the time to track down everything needed to reprogram these the right way. More specifically the archaic process of tracking down an authentic DOS-box from back in the day, which as a fan of Steins;Gate I find the idea amusing to no ends, when there are various micro-controller programmers, such as the Arduino suite, that would accommodate adjusting of baud rate.

Am I missing something here? From a purely technical specification point of view, most radios aren't particularly special under the hood. If done incorrectly, custom firmware which causes radios to broadcast on frequencies which they shouldn't be on due to local laws, can land you into heaps of trouble; however the same can be said about EVERY OTHER RADIO. Just feels like a shame to landfill the things when they become 'bricks' simply because the proprietary tools to reprogram them are beyond their End Of Life support date when the underlying hardware still 'works', regardless of the questionable quality. The key question I have as a computer engineer would have to be:

Is there a reason why the community treats Moto hardware specifically, although it might apply to other brands, in such a mystified way?

 

[clbsquared]

Motorola has never allowed open source software to be used on their radios. Their software has always been proprietary. They’re not in the business of selling hobby or ham radios. They are however, in the business of selling professional grade and public safety grade radios that are deemed “mission critical”. I, myself, would not put a lot of faith in a $4000 radio that is my only lifeline in an public safety situation that had been programmed by “free open source software”.

The software for those radios is easily obtained by a Google search. You may need to register on a couple of different websites to obtain it, but registration is usually free.

 

[nergal]

Motorola has never allowed open source software to be used on their radios. Their software has always been proprietary.

So the short answer is: 'nothing special, but corporate said no'?

I, myself, would not put a lot of faith in a $4000 radio that is my only lifeline in an public safety situation that had been programmed by “free open source software”.

I don't wish to alarm you, but a huge share of the servers which keep society as we understand it functioning run FOSS. Moreover, I was specifically speaking of the Radius SP50 which is by no means $4000, nor is anyone asking you to use it as your sole lifeline in any situation.

I am in no ways interested in their proprietary software, I am interested in using modern tools without unnecessary manufacturer obfuscations to revitalize these devices in a streamlined fashion. Reliance on Motorola's software should however be seen as a single point of failure for devices which anyone considers mission critical; if you don't understand how the firmware works, can you be sure that it isn't in fact a rogue-party's firmware? Even if it is genuinely Motorola software, why do you choose to trust Motorola wholeheartedly?

 

[clbsquared]

So the short answer is: 'nothing special, but corporate said no'?
Even if it is genuinely Motorola software, why do you choose to trust Motorola wholeheartedly?

You’re correct. The short answer is “because we said so”.
I trust Motorola radios because they have a track record of dependability ( when programmed correctly).
But you’re correct, for the radio that you mentioned, there is no reason why open source software couldn’t be used. At least on their consumer line of radios.
With that being said, perhaps obtaining the SP50 software and reading it with a hex editor, would allow you the opportunity to develop an open source software for the lower end Motorola consumer radios of the past.

 

[mmckenna]

I think you answered your own question.
Archaic radios, no longer supported by the manufacturer, limited capability for the hobby users, limited support results in no one wanting to take the time to reverse engineer the software to make it work with CHIRP. Doesn't mean you couldn't do it yourself, but you'd probably want to start with the Motorola software to see what makes it tick. I'm sure if you wrote code to make CHIRP work with older Motorola gear, you'd be a popular guy in the right circles.

And as clbsquared suggested, on more modern Motorola radios, Motorola is pretty darn hard nosed about their intellectual property/software/code, and they are well know for chasing down people that start messing with it for the newer radios.
Also, no one that relies on modern/current Motorola gear is going to risk bricking an expensive radio with something like CHIRP. Heck, it's easy enough to brick a Motorola radio using Motorola software.

Can't be hard to do for the SP-50 radios. I hope you give it a try…

 

[nergal]

perhaps obtaining the SP50 software and reading it with a hex editor, would allow you the opportunity to develop an open source software for the lower end Motorola consumer radios of the past.

you'd probably want to start with the Motorola software to see what makes it tick.

Motorola is pretty darn hard nosed about their intellectual property/software/code, and they are well know for chasing down people that start messing with it for the newer radios.

These would actually, in and of themselves, be asking for legal trouble; I'd be doing this entirely blind of Motorola's tools if I were to do it myself, obligatory I AM NOT A LAWYER

it's easy enough to brick a Motorola radio using Motorola software.

Can't be hard to do for the SP-50 radios. I hope you give it a try…

That's why I am thinking an arduino would be the way to go, difficult to brick a chip if you're writing the entire firmware yourself; un-bricking by design even.
The internal workings of any given radio should be similar in theory and the sp50 radios just seem like particularly low hanging fruit for it; partially because I now have a box full of them but also because 'bricked' ones are dirt-cheap.

 

[mmckenna]

These would actually, in and of themselves, be asking for legal trouble; I'd be doing this entirely blind of Motorola's tools if I were to do it myself, obligatory I AM NOT A LAWYER

That would be my guess. Reverse engineering their software would likely be problematic if Motorola felt like going down that path. But part of me thinks they wouldn't for a 30 year old radio.
There's some existing hex editing info for these radios over on BatLabs. Likely not enough to get you far, but someone has at least looked at it:

The SP50

 

[jaspence]

There have been cracks in Motorola software availability. I was able to get cost free CPS for 12 DLR1060 radios my church purchased, and the offer is available to legitimate purchased radios from that and other general use series Motorola HTs. The 1060s are very good little units and replaced some CCRs that the church had been talked into a couple of years ago. Although they are not cheap, Anyone needing good short range comms will find them far superior to even the best FRS radio

 

[petnrdx]

The SP50 was not a terrible radio. Worked quite well for an entry level radio.
Having "seen" the software to make it work out of band, I am kinda sure it was written under some kind of contract
by a decent company in the "south" that wrote for Icom and several others.
I am NOT a software engineer or any of that, but doing the OOB hacks over a couple decades, I see some REAL similarities
in a lot of that era of software.
Yeah, I am sure a good software person could make most of the Motorola stuff of that time program with something
they wrote themselves.
There is one out there that is something that will PARTIALLY program GM300 and MAXTRAC radios.
But it doesn't do the PL or something else, can't remember. Something Doctor or Doctor Something maybe...
Motorola used to REALLY come down hard with lawsuits and things like that, so most people just "found" the existing
software or got someone they knew to program the radios for them.
They look at even the old intellectual property as having a value. Maybe to keep old radios from being used.
There was a guy selling firmware for the Maxtrac and Maratrac lines specifically for the hambands.
From what I heard, Motorola shut him down for IP issues.
Can't prove that, but that was the word om the street.
Easier to just get around the "issues" by finding the real software.
Unless you just like the intellectual exercise.

 

[merlin]

Chirp at this time doesn't support any of the commercial radios and for now, don't plan to.

 

[merlin]

My approach is quite different.
I used nothing more than a terminal emmulator and UN bricked an older RADIUS (same as MaxTrack)
A list of HEX codes to talk to the radio is all that is needed. It isn't that complicated and an ambitious coder could easily write software for it.

 

[ViperBorg]

My approach is quite different.
I used nothing more than a terminal emmulator and UN bricked an older RADIUS (same as MaxTrack)
A list of HEX codes to talk to the radio is all that is needed. It isn't that complicated and an ambitious coder could easily write software for it.

Just using a terminal emulator?
Sounds like nothing more than a simple Python script would be needed.