DSD+ & Hytera Encryption

[natedawg1604]

Just out of curiosity, does DSD+ display the Encryption type and/or Key ID used with Hytera encrypted calls? It seems like it only displays the fact that Encryption is being used, is this correct?


EDIT: Here is an example of what DSD+ shows on the command line for an encrypted Hytera call:

2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot1 BS DATA DCC=13 Voice Hdr Enc GC TG=115 RID=2505
2021.02.27 10:24:16 XPT 1000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot2 BS DATA DCC=13 CSBK XPT Beacon 1CFF730000000000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot1 BS DATA DCC=13 Voice Hdr Enc GC TG=115 RID=2505
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot2 BS DATA DCC=13 CSBK [LB=0 CSBKO=11 (?) FID=68 v16=0820 id1=0 id2=0]
2021.02.27 10:24:16 0B 68 0820 000000 000000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 000010110110100000001000001000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000101000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot1 BS DATA DCC=13 Voice Hdr Enc GC TG=115 RID=2505
2021.02.27 10:24:16 XPT 1000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot2 BS DATA DCC=13 CSBK XPT Beacon 1CFF730000000000
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot1 BS DATA DCC=13 Voice Hdr Enc GC TG=115 RID=2505
2021.02.27 10:24:16 +DMR slot2 BS DATA DCC=13 CSBK [LB=0 CSBKO=11 (?) FID=68 v16=0820 id1=0 id2=0]
2021.02.27 10:24:16 0B 68 0820 000000 000000

 

[Kazzaw]

You won't find the key as it's never broadcast. The radios only broadcast the Key ID used, not the key itself

 

[RayAir]

It can differentiate between Hytera basic and enhanced privacy (40 bit ARC4) and AES.
Hytera basic encryption sounds the same as enhanced but there will be no message indicators and dsd will show "alg=BP"
If it is using enhanced or AES you'd see something like "Alg=EP (ARC4) keyid=01".

I'm fairly certain ARC4 isn't used on XPT systems. It's either basic or AES.

 

[natedawg1604]

It can differentiate between Hytera basic and enhanced privacy (40 bit ARC4) and AES.
Hytera basic encryption sounds the same as enhanced but there will be no message indicators and dsd will show "alg=BP"
If it is using enhanced or AES you'd see something like "Alg=EP (ARC4) keyid=01".

I'm fairly certain ARC4 isn't used on XPT systems. It's either basic or AES.

That's what I thought. However, for a particular Hytera system it won't display the alg type at all. Here is what the event log displays (I took out the frequency):

2021/02/27 10:26:12 Freq=xxx DCC=7 Enc Group call; TG=115 RID=2507 Slot=1
2021/02/27 10:26:18 Freq=xxx DCC=7 Enc Group call; TG=115 RID=2507 Slot=1 3s
2021/02/27 10:26:29 Freq=xxx DCC=7 Enc Group call; TG=115 RID=2507 Slot=1 3s


Sometimes I've seen DSD+ incorrectly display ENC with a weak signal, perhaps that's what's going on here. I should probably uncheck the option for muting encrypted calls so I can listen to the per-call audio files and see what they sound like.

 

[TheButcher]

Might pay to include version of DSD+ (FL?) you are running...

 

[natedawg1604]

Might pay to include version of DSD+ (FL?) you are running...

DSD+ Fastlane 2.289 (the latest version) with the automatic updates.

 

[racingfan360]

I have just re-run these tests to confirm with the latest v2.289:

Hytera Basic Encryption (10 character, 32 character and 64 character al behave the same) will show as XPT, show as Encrypted Group call, but not show the Alg or the KeyID

Hytera Full Encryption (10 character/40Bit) will show as DMR, show as Encrypted Group call, show the Alg=EP/RC4 and show the KeyID. It will sometimes confuse this EP/RC4 for BP on weaker signals.

I can't run an AES test for Hytera.

DSD+ can't distinguish an in the clear Simplex Hytera DMR call from a Motorola one and will show as DMR MS

 

[slicerwizard]

Just out of curiosity, does DSD+ display the Encryption type and/or Key ID used with Hytera encrypted calls?

Absolutely. There are HYT TIII systems here that make extensive use of AES and DSD+ reliably shows it.

That's what I thought. However, for a particular Hytera system it won't display the alg type at all.

You've only shown us a bit of the console log, with no PI headers. No headers equals basic privacy.

 

[Forts]

Don't forget that Hytera also has the 'over the air encrypt' option, which will encrypt all voice, data and signalling transmissions. When DSDPlus is parked on a channel using this no activity at all is displayed.

 

[RayAir]

Don't forget that Hytera also has the 'over the air encrypt' option, which will encrypt all voice, data and signalling transmissions. When DSDPlus is parked on a channel using this no activity at all is displayed.

True, but if OTA encrypt was set he wouldn't have been able to get even the TG or RID.

 

[Forts]

Yes I realize that... Was just mentioning one of the dirty tricks Hytera can use.

 

[n1das]

Don't forget that Hytera also has the 'over the air encrypt' option, which will encrypt all voice, data and signalling transmissions. When DSDPlus is parked on a channel using this no activity at all is displayed.

It sounds like DSD+ doesn't recognize the traffic as DMR traffic at all when Over the Air Encrypt is used. IIRC Hytera calls this feature Signalling Frame Encrypt.

Is Hytera's Signalling Frame Encrypt feature equivalent to Motorola's RAS?

 

[slicerwizard]

Is Hytera's Signalling Frame Encrypt feature equivalent to Motorola's RAS?

No.