Encrypted

MilkyFresh

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Hey guys I'm new to this, and Google AI has limited helpfulness. I'm starting the process of deciding which scanner to buy. I'd like to listen to the local police/fire/EMS agencies. I've been able to learn what type, tone, and mode mean; but I'm still unable to determine how to tell from this website whether any of the local communications are encrypted. For example, Farmington Police in Franklin County in Maine...

Ideally someone could tell me how to find out for myself, but at the very least where to start..

Also, perhaps a good entry-level guide for learning about radios in general :)

🥛
 

AK9R

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Whiskey3JMC

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I'm still unable to determine how to tell from this website whether any of the local communications are encrypted. For example, Farmington Police in Franklin County in Maine...
Welcome to the RR forums. Farmington Police is analog conventional (mode FMN), no encryption, as is the rest of your county. In order to tell the presence of encryption by looking at database listings focus on the "Mode" column. Any time you see an uppercase "E" as in P25E, DMRE, NXDNE conventionally or DE, TE in a trunked system this would indicate full encryption. The presence of a lowercase "e" would indicate partial encryption (some transmissions clear, others encrypted). Hope this helps
 

ecps92

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Please take a look at the Franklin County, Maine, listing in the RadioReference database: Franklin County, Maine (ME) Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference

Also, take a look at the Maine State Communications Network system in the RR database: Maine State Communications Network (MSCommNet) Trunking System, Statewide, Maine

In either case, if there's an "E" in the Mode column, that frequency or talkgroup is reported to e encrypted.
and (for the OP) keep in mind, the RRDB is only as good as Reported.

IMHO/Experience Agencies have gone ENC and not been reported by anyone for years, till someone complains they can't hear them
So with that said, right now the RRDB indicates...
 

WRQI583

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For the State of Maine, there have been a lot of bad listings I have noticed over the years when it comes to frequencies and other things. Most, but not all, of the state police system is correct. There are a few sites with incorrect frequencies that make a difference if you even hear the site since control channel frequencies can change daily if needed. Waterville Police is another example. Their frequency is not listed (a friend of mine visiting from out of state pointed it out to me) even though everyone in the community knows about the new one and it is DMR, not analog. What I found in Maine is that you have to use this site, Scan New England Wiki, The FCC page (when the toddlers in Washington stop fighting) and your own radio equipment. The mix of all of that will get you all the frequencies you need. It helps to do it with an SDR dongle and some computer software to decode digital stuff. To the best of my knowledge, the only encrypted stuff are some police departments along the southern most coast up to Lewiston/Auburn area and then the Ellsworth PD from what I heard but can't confirm. Everyone else is pretty much analog unless otherwise noted. It helps to build and maintain your own database. Thats what I did, but sadly, haven't had time to keep up on it in a couple of years.
The scanner is a bit pricey, but seeing as how Maine has a mix of different digital voice modes, I got the BCD 996p2 scanner. It has P25 Phase 1 and 2, DMR, NXDN, and some others not used in Maine. You can load the whole entire state of Maine into it and I do have the file. Some of the stuff in the file needs some updating because I don't live in southern or northern Maine, so I can't confirm what I have programmed. Most of Maine is still analog but P25 and DMR are two standards entering into the communications world up here with P25 being more dominant.
 
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ecps92

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For the State of Maine, there have been a lot of bad listings I have noticed over the years when it comes to frequencies and other things. Most, but not all, of the state police system is correct. There are a few sites with incorrect frequencies that make a difference if you even hear the site since control channel frequencies can change daily if needed. Waterville Police is another example. Their frequency is not listed (a friend of mine visiting from out of state pointed it out to me) even though everyone in the community knows about the new one and it is DMR, not analog. What I found in Maine is that you have to use this site, Scan New England Wiki, The FCC page (when the toddlers in Washington stop fighting) and your own radio equipment. The mix of all of that will get you all the frequencies you need. It helps to do it with an SDR dongle and some computer software to decode digital stuff. To the best of my knowledge, the only encrypted stuff are some police departments along the southern most coast up to Lewiston/Auburn area and then the Ellsworth PD from what I heard but can't confirm. Everyone else is pretty much analog unless otherwise noted. It helps to build and maintain your own database. Thats what I did, but sadly, haven't had time to keep up on it in a couple of years.
The scanner is a bit pricey, but seeing as how Maine has a mix of different digital voice modes, I got the BCD 996p2 scanner. It has P25 Phase 1 and 2, DMR, NXDN, and some others not used in Maine. You can load the whole entire state of Maine into it and I do have the file. Some of the stuff in the file needs some updating because I don't live in southern or northern Maine, so I can't confirm what I have programmed. Most of Maine is still analog but P25 and DMR are two standards entering into the communications world up here with P25 being more dominant.
if there is something missing or in error and you are aware of it, you need to make a DB submission, data comes from members (Subscribers and Non-Subscribers) Only YOU can make the DB Better from actual over-the-air verifications and submissions.
 

WRQI583

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if there is something missing or in error and you are aware of it, you need to make a DB submission, data comes from members (Subscribers and Non-Subscribers) Only YOU can make the DB Better from actual over-the-air verifications and submissions.
I have done that many times over the past couple decades and a few times information was never put up. Not sure if it was that my information didn't match up to the FCC or what. Many times the old stuff was never taken down and left up in addition to the new stuff. I know I don't just go submitting information before confirming it. I know when I post something, I check, double check, triple check, and sometimes, if needed, go out and physically confirm, and that includes confirming it with what the FCC site has. Researching transmitters and frequencies and what entity is using it is something I have been doing since my teen years in the 90's when I first got into scanner monitoring. I am very familiar with how radio systems work. I have several programs on my computer that track trunked systems, decode many different digital modes, and I own a digital scanner that I can program stuff into to confirm what I find. I see a lot of people make mistakes with things like the input frequency to a repeater and submitting it as a talk around channel. I have tried to get the moderators in the past to change that stuff and it was never done. I haven't done much in the past two years though with monitoring things due to my personal schedule. I would love to get back into it at some point though.
 

ecps92

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Moderators handle the message board
DB Admins handle the Database

And with Maine so much of the statewide TRS is Part 22 and will not be completely found in the FCC
 

AK9R

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Moderators handle the message board
DB Admins handle the Database
This.

Forum moderators are not the same as DB admins.

Users can talk all they want in forum posts about the information they've provided, but DB admins need to see DB submissions with credible information.
 

WRQI583

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DB admins need to see DB submissions with credible information.
Well, I know I have always submitted credible information. I know there are some that hear something on the scanner and submit it without researching it. I don't. Even in my own personal databases, I am very strict as to what I keep record of. I guess now, if the FCC is shut down, it is probably impossible to prove any new transmitting stations.
 

W1KNE

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I have done that many times over the past couple decades and a few times information was never put up.
I wouldn't call three submissions (one of which entirely duplicated what was already there), "many" submissions. I also don't see any submissions about Waterville from you, after you clearly state it is not in the DB. Don't see one over at my site either.
Well, I know I have always submitted credible information. I know there are some that hear something on the scanner and submit it without researching it. I don't. Even in my own personal databases, I am very strict as to what I keep record of. I guess now, if the FCC is shut down, it is probably impossible to prove any new transmitting stations.
And we do thank you for that. But honestly , I'd say 90-95% of what we get submitted is accurate. As far as removing information from the database, we have a pretty strict guideline that we follow here. If there is 100% assurance that the frequency has been removed from radios and not used, then it gets removed. Otherwise, it stays. If information needs to be updated, it needs to be clearly marked that it is updated, and what is updated. Just copying the line from the DB, and changing one field, hoping we can find it, not only leads to us wasting time to figure out what the change is, but also the risk of missing it. If something simple needs to be changed, just clearly identify it.
Researching transmitters and frequencies and what entity is using it is something I have been doing since my teen years in the 90's when I first got into scanner monitoring. I am very familiar with how radio systems work. I have several programs on my computer that track trunked systems, decode many different digital modes, and I own a digital scanner that I can program stuff into to confirm what I find. I see a lot of people make mistakes with things like the input frequency to a repeater and submitting it as a talk around channel. I have tried to get the moderators in the past to change that stuff and it was never done. I haven't done much in the past two years though with monitoring things due to my personal schedule. I would love to get back into it at some point though.
You make an assumption that none of the "moderators" (which you mean DB Admins) here have any knowledge of the local systems, and you couldn't be any farther from the truth if you tried. Most of the DB administrators here are quite competent at their ability to not only decode systems, but decode tickets submitted to us as well. In my case, at both sites I maintain DBs at, both SNE (which I own) and here on RR (I don't handle Maine, just the remainder of New England), I don't just blindly put things into the DB. We know both enough about the systems, and frankly, about the submitters to take our time to vett out what needs to be vetted. And if a user submits too much incorrect information, they normally will be blocked from submitting.

Look, I totally get your frustration, but I don't see any evidence , other than your 2.5 tickets, that you're doing anything to actually help things. Your tickets are very detailed, and I do thank you for that, but there is also a lack of information about what to do with it.

Also tagging @ME343 so he is included in this conversation as the Maine DB admin.

Also , if you have the premium RR membership, you'd have access to their FCC database.
 

GTR8000

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I wouldn't call three submissions (one of which entirely duplicated what was already there), "many" submissions. I also don't see any submissions about Waterville from you, after you clearly state it is not in the DB. Don't see one over at my site either.
I noticed the same, only 3 submissions to his username. I suspect he created a new account after getting his GMRS call sign in early 2022, rather than requesting a username change for his original account.

Also seems like he's rehashing 'old' gripes, yet oddly after he made that thread he hasn't submitted anything since. I guess some people are more interested in complaining than actually participating. 🤷‍♂️

 

WRQI583

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I noticed the same, only 3 submissions to his username. I suspect he created a new account after getting his GMRS call sign in early 2022, rather than requesting a username change for his original account.
You are correct. I have had other accounts on here over the years because I have been in and out for various reasons. So, if you only saw a couple of submissions under this current username, that is why. I don't remember the other usernames I used.
 

WRQI583

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As far as removing information from the database, we have a pretty strict guideline that we follow here. If there is 100% assurance that the frequency has been removed from radios and not used, then it gets removed. Otherwise, it stays. If information needs to be updated, it needs to be clearly marked that it is updated, and what is updated. Just copying the line from the DB, and changing one field, hoping we can find it, not only leads to us wasting time to figure out what the change is, but also the risk of missing it. If something simple needs to be changed, just clearly identify it.
I do understand the need to confirm that it was removed from the radios. There is that and the way certain frequencies are listed, such as the input to a repeater being a talk around channel when it may have been misheard by the person submitting the information not realizing that if you listen to the input to a repeater, it will sound like you are listening to two units on simplex talking, thus being mistaken for being a talk around channel. Not sure if that is what has happened, but it seems that way from at least one listing I have seen. This is referring to the Waterville and Winslow PD. Gotta wait until the FCC opens up but it took me quite a few years and making random trips out to the Waterville area to figure out who was on what and what channel Winslow PD was actually on.
As for the submissions, as I stated farther down on here, I have had times I left radio reference over the years for whatever reason and made another account later on when I came back, so other submissions would have been under other names, I just cant remember what they were. But I didn't delete one account and then make another after I got my GMRS license. There was another reason I had left.

I am not in any way trying to ruffle anyone's feathers here. I just have had a hard time before I did my own research to get the correct information in a scanner on some agencies. That is why I would use this site among others just to confirm what I saw here. I had a friend come up for a visit about a week ago and he mentioned Waterville PD being on 155.7, because that is what he saw in radio reference. I knew they had moved and were no longer using that and I let him know. I know they are still licensed to their old frequency among a few other new ones, but the current one they use they are not licensed to. Not sure what that is about, obviously a radio service thing.
 
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