G5 max talkgroups and second band antenna

[Anderegg]

Interested in using a G5 for simple locking in on specific talkgroups. Reading 128 zones with 8 talkgroups per channel selector...so that would be a maximum of 1024 independently selectable trunked talkgroups or conventional frequencies? For the secondary band, how is the antenna handled, some sort of internal wire or such...useful at all for voice signal reception or just pager data? Would be interested if the VHF secondary band would be at all usable to monitor comms while *on scene* of a brush fire incident, as they use VHF on wildfires here in California.

Paul

 

[GTR8000]

From @Signal-Zero: The G5 external antenna is always 7/800, and the internal loop antenna is your other band (VHF in your case).

I'm not sure what you mean by "useful at all for voice signal reception or just pager data?" It'll receive whatever signals are within range of it. If you're close enough to a scene for it to receive analog voice transmissions, then that's what it'll receive.

 

[N6ML]

From @Signal-Zero: The G5 external antenna is always 7/800, and the internal loop antenna is your other band (VHF in your case).

I'm not sure what you mean by "useful at all for voice signal reception or just pager data?" It'll receive whatever signals are within range of it. If you're close enough to a scene for it to receive analog voice transmissions, then that's what it'll receive.

"Within range of it" is dependent on the sensitivity of the receiver and the effectiveness of the receive antenna. The OP is asking how good VHF reception is in a G5.

I've never tried to use my G5 on CAL FIRE tac channels at the scene of a fire, because I have various 2m/440 ham transceivers that work well for that purpose, including a Baofeng UV-5R. I'd recommend one of those (~$30 on Amazon) for VHF FM, and use the G5 (or a G4) for 7/800MHz P25.

 

[GTR8000]

"Within range of it" is dependent on the sensitivity of the receiver and the effectiveness of the receive antenna. The OP is asking how good VHF reception is in a G5.

Yes, I'm well aware of all that. What isn't clear is what he specifically meant by "voice signal reception or just pager data". The pager is either going to receive a signal or not, the content of the transmission doesn't really matter. Trunking, conventional, digital, analog, "pager data", etc.

No one can answer his specific question because we don't know what range he's talking about when it comes to VHF reception. He stated "on scene" which could be within a few hundred yard radius, or within a square mile radius. The internal antenna should have no problem receiving nearby VHF transmissions, but for an incident covering a larger area, obviously not having an external antenna is going to limit reception.

 

[APX8000]

I wouldn’t recommend a $30 Baofeng for anything but a garbage can.

 

[N6ML]

Yes, I'm well aware of all that. What isn't clear is what he specifically meant by "voice signal reception or just pager data". The pager is either going to receive a signal or not, the content of the transmission doesn't really matter. Trunking, conventional, digital, analog, "pager data", etc.

No one can answer his specific question because we don't know what range he's talking about when it comes to VHF reception. He stated "on scene" which could be within a few hundred yard radius, or within a square mile radius. The internal antenna should have no problem receiving nearby VHF transmissions, but for an incident covering a larger area, obviously not having an external antenna is going to limit reception.

He's asking if voice will sound all "scratchy", where it might be good enough to detect pager tones. It's a reasonable question. My general impression is that VHF reception in the G5 is not stellar.

 

[N6ML]

I wouldn’t recommend a $30 Baofeng for anything but a garbage can.

Based on what? Anything other than a need to sound snobbish? Mine works reasonably well as a receiver, and it does dual-watch. I don't transmit much from it. If I drop it, I'm only out $30. Given that, it's quite suitable for using at a fire scene.

 

[W8RMH]

Based on what? Anything other than a need to sound snobbish? Mine works reasonably well as a receiver, and it does dual-watch. I don't transmit much from it. If I drop it, I'm only out $30. Given that, it's quite suitable for using at a fire scene.

They are not Intrinsically Safe are they? If found at a fire scene they should be confiscated.

 

[tkowalik]

The G5 receives VHF quiet well in my experience. From Rockport Tx to Tahoe, it has been better than any scanner I’ve had.

 

[Spitfire8520]

Interested in using a G5 for simple locking in on specific talkgroups. Reading 128 zones with 8 talkgroups per channel selector...so that would be a maximum of 1024 independently selectable trunked talkgroups or conventional frequencies?

With the latest firmware and PPS: 64 Zones and 8 Knob positions for a total of 512 zone/knob position combinations that you can program. Each knob position can be programmed with up to 64 talkgroups, 1 conventional frequency, or 16 scanned conventional knob positions.

 

[N6ML]

They are not Intrinsically Safe are they? If found at a fire scene they should be confiscated.

You mean that there's nothing to prevent you from transmitting? I suppose that's true. I'm not sure it's grounds for confiscation, though - unless someone is actually using it to transmit illegally.

Anyway, my point was that the G4/5 excel on 7/800MHz P25. There are lots of inexpensive alternative options for receiving VHF FM.

 

[W8RMH]

You mean that there's nothing to prevent you from transmitting? I suppose that's true. I'm not sure it's grounds for confiscation, though - unless someone is actually using it to transmit illegally.

Anyway, my point was that the G4/5 excel on 7/800MHz P25. There are lots of inexpensive alternative options for receiving VHF FM.

No, I'm talking about 'Intrinsically Safe'. They can cause an explosion in a environment with fuel fumes, etc. It has nothing to do with transmitting. Even fire pagers have to be Intrinsically Safe.

 

[N6ML]

No, I'm talking about 'Intrinsically Safe'. They can cause an explosion in a environment with fuel fumes, etc. It has nothing to do with transmitting. Even fire pagers have to be Intrinsically Safe.

Ahh, interesting. I was not familiar with that (have done some reading since). When I go to fire scenes, I'm typically not "right in the middle of it", but close enough to follow simplex tac traffic. I wonder about cellphones, cameras (press), etc... are they "intrinsically safe" ?

 

[nyscan]

They are not Intrinsically Safe are they? If found at a fire scene they should be confiscated.

I think the distinction needs to be made between a firefighter operating at the scene and a buff monitoring radio traffic from a safe distance.

 

[KevinC]

Enough with the Baofeng stuff, this is the Unication forum.

 

[kg4edy]

I've used my G5 to monitor marine, Civil Air Patrol, and VHF fireground channels, and the audio was clear with no issues. I have added a longer Motorola 800mHz antenna to increase range on that band. All in all, I'm very happy with mine.

 

[W8RMH]

Someone referred to using one at a fire scene, I assumed they were a firefighter.

 

[Anderegg]

Someone referred to using one at a fire scene, I assumed they were a firefighter.

News media here...I would monitor the incident on a real radio in the car with a roof antenna, but when I hop out, it would be convinient to use the little G5 for listening to the fire tac stuff. Hanging the small G5 on clothing is about the same as hanging a speakerm mic. I was just not sure how well the internal VHF antenna would work...I mean, I know a VHF pager has an internal antenna, which works for RXing the data well enough to receive a page, but the signal level necessary to decode a pager squawk must be much much lower than to RX an inteligable voice transmission. I am thinking maybe the G5 on VHF has the same RX as if you put an 800 stubby on a VHF Motorola? :-\

With the latest firmware and PPS: 64 Zones and 8 Knob positions for a total of 512 zone/knob position combinations that you can program. Each knob position can be programmed with up to 64 talkgroups, 1 conventional frequency, or 16 scanned conventional knob positions.

So did they reduce the number of zones in newer firmware? I thought I read an old post where the OP put over 1000 talkgroups in his G4/G5 and it slowed it down and made the menu very unresponsive.

Paul

 

[LEH]

I am still experimenting with my G3 and its internal VHF antenna. So far, I have been somewhat disappointed in the VHF reception, even on a large VHF P25 P1 trunked system at the fringe signal range, I get numerous 'out of range' conditions.

Several fire departments on 800 trunked systems nearby still simulcast their dispatch over their old VHF or UHF channels. These are working very well, even in my car. The P25 P1 VHF conventional for the National Park Service I have yet to pick up. They don't transmit a lot so setting up the proper pager configuration is still hit or miss.

Though not VHF specific, I have compared the internal and external reception. I have a G3 (VHF and UHF C band) and a G5 (UHF B band and7/800). There is an overlap for one system (UHF P25 P1) between the G3 UHF with external and the G5 UHF with internal antenna. I have set them side by side, turned on diagnostics for both in the PPS, and read the signal strength when I bring up the 'diagnostics' on the pager. The G3 is usually at least 10dB stronger than the G5. With a signal bouncing between -110 to -125 dB (much below -125 dB and on the trunked systems, I get "OOR") on the G3, that 10dB difference can be the difference between receiving and seeing 'out of range'.

I have no doubts the G5 would work quite well for VHF simplex if the transmitter is nearby, but would be better if there there were an external antenna capability. Exact range, will depend on a lot of variables.

Personally, I have misgivings on a radio with an internal antenna, especially for lower frequencies (below UHF) where antenna length becomes a bit more critical (IMHO). I also like being able to switch out antenna depending on circumstances.

 

[kruser]

The dual band G5s do well on VHF but only when sitting in the amplified charging cradle for our statewide VHF P25 system for me.
The charging cradle does allow for an external antenna for both bands using its rear BNC Jack.
If it were not for this, my G5 will not hear any of our statewide VHF sites from my home location. When I take the G5 mobile and get just a mile or two down the road, its VHF reception picks up two of the statewide VHF sites just fine.