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GMRS-M Canada

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RFI-EMI-GUY

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Interesting.
My guess is that it a authorization to incorporate data mode into a GMRS radio. The Garmin Rhino has been sold using a data mode for GPS location here in the US and the rules here don't seem to adequately address or permit such operation .

It is interesting that both the US and Canada permit SSB and AM DSBSC in GMRS yet no manufacturer has made a radio like that, thought AM was prevalent in the very earliest years. (Class B CB)
 

cmdrwill

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snip}

It is interesting that both the US and Canada permit SSB and AM DSBSC in GMRS yet no manufacturer has made a radio like that, thought AM was prevalent in the very earliest years. (Class B CB)
Benton Harbor 'Lunch Box' Heathkit Class B CB transceiver. 1960. Or was that Class A. AM on 462 mHz.
 

alex5774

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Mystery solved! After some searching I came across SP 462/467 MHz which states:

Furthermore, these provisions allow for the introduction of General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS‑M) devices in Canada. GMRS-M devices have similar technical specifications to existing GMRS devices but provide for different applications, including dog tracking devices, pet containment units, and intercom systems. These devices are permitted to operate on a licence‑exempt basis on specific frequencies in the 462 MHz frequency range.
In recent years, users and manufacturers of licence‑exempt MURS devices have voiced their interest and need for these devices in Canada. Although functionally similar to FRS and GMRS radios, MURS devices may also provide for specialized two‑way communications such as dog tracking devices, pet containment units, intercom systems, and various other communication systems. In the U.S. these devices, which have been in operation since 2002, operate on five specific frequencies in the VHF band. Recognizing the need for similar operational provisions in Canada and recognizing the current usage of the VHF band by Canadian incumbent services, including public safety services, the Department has identified five frequencies in the 462 MHz frequency range and appropriate technical specifications for the operation of similar types of devices and applications. Furthermore, the Department is establishing the term "GMRS‑M" to distinguish these devices and their applications from the traditional two‑way handheld GMRS radios introduced in Canada in 2004.
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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Benton Harbor 'Lunch Box' Heathkit Class B CB transceiver. 1960. Or was that Class A. AM on 462 mHz.
That technology was a bit before my time, though from what I read the Class B was a simpler super regenerative design like the Walkie Talkie Al Gross patented. The Class A radios were more powerful. I have not seen a Class A radio in years. I think my friends dad had one. I used to see it in the basement with a weird old call sign in Dymo Tape.
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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Mystery solved! After some searching I came across SP 462/467 MHz which states:
"Removing the channels in the 467 MHz range which were reserved for possible future use as repeater input channels for GMRS."

This is too bad. The US FCC had an NPRM a few years back that would have decimated high power GMRS and eliminated individual licenses (license by rule). That NPRM received more responses than the FCC anticipated and instead of addressing the concerns, simply shelved the discussion until they feel the time is right. Unfortunately GMRS is met with increasing apathy and illegal (unlicensed) use.

Looks like Canada will never have GMRS repeaters.
 
D

DaveNF2G

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I think somebody at the FCC thought to "poison the well" of GMRS by introducing hordes of unlicensed transmitters that would eventually lead to illegal GMRS usage and give them a reason to crack down. They did not think it through, of course. How do you get the poison back out of the well when you decide to reallocate the frequencies?
 

Hans13

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I don't think that much thought was even put into it. My guess is there was a successful (money?) lobby by those in industry who stood to profit.
 

alex5774

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I don't think that much thought was even put into it. My guess is there was a successful (money?) lobby by those in industry who stood to profit.
Uniden is actively petitioning the FCC with regard to GMRS.

On 22-channel radios, channels 1-7 and 15-22 all operate under GMRS rules (i.e. an explicit license is legally required). 8-14 operate under FRS rules.

Even though 1-7 can be either FRS or GMRS, since the radio transmits at a power level > 0.5W, it makes them GMRS.

We've petitioned the FCC to make some changes to the rules to make:

1) All channels operate under the same technical standards with maximum 2W ERP for all 22 and same bandwidth for all 22.
2) All channels license-by-rule (i.e. "if you follow the rules, you have a license", which is how FRS, CB, and MURS licensing works).
3) Redefine all 22 channels as FRS (with the above rules).

I've visited the FCC twice for this matter. Both times, they were very receptive. However, this rulemaking has been in process for most of this decade. They estimated some action this Summer (but today is the first day of Autumn, and I've still seen nothing).
http://forums.radioreference.com/gmrs-frs/179111-gmrs-vs-frs-2.html#post2645133
 

KD8DVR

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Interesting.
My guess is that it a authorization to incorporate data mode into a GMRS radio. The Garmin Rhino has been sold using a data mode for GPS location here in the US and the rules here don't seem to adequately address or permit such operation .

It is interesting that both the US and Canada permit SSB and AM DSBSC in GMRS yet no manufacturer has made a radio like that, thought AM was prevalent in the very earliest years. (Class B CB)
Garmin has a waiver to send gps data.

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KD8DVR

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You can thank the bubble pack radio loophole for the majority of that problem.
No...you can thank people in general for failing to get licensed.

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KD8DVR

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So... This GMRS-m looks to be the Canadian answer to MURS.

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12dbsinad

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No...you can thank people in general for failing to get licensed.

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This is true, however it still equates to the majority of unlicensed users. A radio comes pre-loaded with both FRS/GMRS frequencies and you think the user is going to say "give that back to me son! We can't use channel 17!"

I don't think so... But you're right it is up to the user. It just never happens.
 

iamjimmy86

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For the OP: Your best bet is to just contact Industry Canada directly and ask for further clarification in more direct terms as to the exact explanation of GMRS-M and what specific product(s) it is in reference to for the proposed frequencies/emissions.

My $0.02 is it would be nice if just for those 5 frequencies, the average Canadian citizen could utilitize a consumer grade radio for simplex only operation on low power. Doubt that will ever be the case but one can only dream.
 

KD8DVR

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This is true, however it still equates to the majority of unlicensed users. A radio comes pre-loaded with both FRS/GMRS frequencies and you think the user is going to say "give that back to me son! We can't use channel 17!"

I don't think so... But you're right it is up to the user. It just never happens.
I always instruct my kids on proper procedures. It is called responsible parenting.

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12dbsinad

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I always instruct my kids on proper procedures. It is called responsible parenting.

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I am the same way. Unfortunately we are the minority.
 

12dbsinad

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Looks like I am making my exit from GMRS to digital w/FHSS on 900MHz just in time.
Unfortunately 900MHz just can't compete with 50 watt mobiles and repeaters. Although they do work good for what they are.
 

n1das

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Unfortunately 900MHz just can't compete with 50 watt mobiles and repeaters. Although they do work good for what they are.
That all becomes moot when the FCC makes GMRS license by rulle and eliminates high powered operation and repeaters and renders GMRS a bubble pack only service. I still have 50W UHF mobiles and a GMRS repeater and I'm keeping those. I suspect that when the FCC makes GMRS license by rule, the new rules will more or less mirror Canada's rules. When that happens my GMRS repeater will get re-purposed as 440 ham repeater.

900MHz is replacing my use of GMRS for local on-site simplex type use where I tend to use GMRS the most. My Motorola DTR series and DLR series 900MHz FHSS digital radios have been greatly exceeding all expectations so far.

Have fun! :)
 
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