Jackson County P-25

[KE4ZNR]

The plot thickens as the admission is public, the pager issue is getting worse, even in other parts of the county, which is 100% an encryption issue.

This appears to be yet another example of where Unication pagers have trouble with encryption. Encryption itself is not to blame. Look in the Unication forum here at RR and you will see several posts on Unication pagers having trouble with encryption. If Unication ever fixes their pagers then I would bet this issue would go away. I know folks want to blame encryption itself but the fault here appears to lie totally at the feet of Unication.

 

[MTS2000des]

Yep, we tried Unications and they didn't play well at all with both ADP and AES. Sounds like a subscriber issue with these and not poor coverage.

 

[1268]

5% coverage in Nicholson??? There’s a site sitting right in the dead middle of Nicholson right beside 441. A 250’ self supporting tower if I remember correctly. Something isn’t right with this whole ordeal. There’s no reason they shouldn’t have 99.9% coverage of that county with the amount of sites they have.

It's a real mess... no other way to say it. 13 towers and we have the South and East end with almost nothing, a couple of other areas have intermittent issues, it's just not "out there." They just hired a really top-notch radio person and a new EMA director so hopefully it gets sorted soon.

 

[1268]

This appears to be yet another example of where Unication pagers have trouble with encryption. Encryption itself is not to blame. Look in the Unication forum here at RR and you will see several posts on Unication pagers having trouble with encryption. If Unication ever fixes their pagers then I would bet this issue would go away. I know folks want to blame encryption itself but the fault here appears to lie totally at the feet of Unication.

You are 100% correct. I think it was sold as being "no problem" on the front end in the bid, and of course, now it's a problem. Folks are frustrated and rightfully so.

 

[DanRollman]

If I'm following the above correctly, isn't the fix simply turning off encryption on the FD dispatch TG, or putting the Unications on a different unencrypted alerting TG, at least until the subscriber issue is rectified? Not sure why ISSI with Athens-Clarke County or other system-focused solutions would solve the problem anyway if the cause is encryption and Unications not playing nice together.

But it seems like it would be easy to detect that this isn't a system issue because, if the Unications are the issue, then the subscriber radios from other brands ought to be working fine in these areas.

Can't help but think there is more to this. Maybe I am giving some people too much credit.

 

[1268]

If I'm following the above correctly, isn't the fix simply turning off encryption on the FD dispatch TG, or putting the Unications on a different unencrypted alerting TG, at least until the subscriber issue is rectified? Not sure why ISSI with Athens-Clarke County or other system-focused solutions would solve the problem anyway if the cause is encryption and Unications not playing nice together.

But it seems like it would be easy to detect that this isn't a system issue because, if the Unications are the issue, then the subscriber radios from other brands ought to be working fine in these areas.

Can't help but think there is more to this. Maybe I am giving some people too much credit.

No, that has been a fix I pitched to several people, which is this:
Page on an unencrypted talk group and after the call is received, switch them to an encrypted TAC channel for patient updates, etc. I was told, and the company line is that "dispatching " in the clear would be a violation of HIPAA.
My counter to that was dispatch EMS on an encrypted talk group and FIRE in the clear.... same answer.

While the paging fire dispatch is one issue, the lack of coverage in South and East Jackson is a completely different one. The portables (Motos) are having issues there and in the far NW corner at times. ( Garbled transmissions) I can't say this enough, users reported issues for 18 months and got stonewalled, now the admission that " Yes, your problem is real " .... well, you can see how that would make folks feel.
( That quote is from the local paper published yesterday)

I think the system has some configuration issues and needs some radio techs to put in the field work to really zero in on everything. Just my opinion.

 

[MTS2000des]

I think the system has some configuration issues and needs some radio techs to put in the field work to really zero in on everything. Just my opinion.

Sounds like a certain ST who has the same first name as I needs to come in and work his magic.

 

[DanRollman]

I was told, and the company line is that "dispatching " in the clear would be a violation of HIPAA.

It's frustrating, but there is really not a lot you can do about public safety leaders who chose to remain willfully ignorant about the scope of HIPAA and what it means (and more importantly, what it doesn't mean) for radio communications. Here's a decent summary pulled together by NAEMSP from legal opinions they solicited in part out of frustration that their member-professionals continue to perpetuate false myths now more than 20 years after HIPAA's privacy rule went into effect.

If I had a nickel for every time a public safety communications professional asserted that HIPAA required or prohibited something that HIPAA neither requires nor prohibits...

 

[MTS2000des]

I If I had a nickel for every time a public safety communications professional asserted that HIPAA required or prohibited something that HIPAA neither requires nor prohibits...

The concern more is when people show up at fire training scenes because they thought they heard a MAYDAY.
The concern more is when firefighters being held hostage names get posted on social media.
The concern more is when doing a training drill, names of SWAT officers get put out on social media.

See a pattern here? It isn't the good radio people, it's the moronic masses ruining it for everyone.

 

[DanRollman]

The concern more is when people show up at fire training scenes because they thought they heard a MAYDAY.
The concern more is when firefighters being held hostage names get posted on social media.
The concern more is when doing a training drill, names of SWAT officers get put out on social media.

See a pattern here? It isn't the good radio people, it's the moronic masses ruining it for everyone.

Exactly. That list could be a lot longer. The legitimate concerns are practical, not legal. The "legal" arguments are a distraction. If someone's rationale for implementing or maintaining encryption on dispatch channels is "we have to because of the [insert random acronym] law," they are either ignorant or dishonest. Possibly both. And they are either lazy or conflict-avoidant, for not expressing their real rationale.

 

[1268]

If I'm following the above correctly, isn't the fix simply turning off encryption on the FD dispatch TG, or putting the Unications on a different unencrypted alerting TG, at least until the subscriber issue is rectified? Not sure why ISSI with Athens-Clarke County or other system-focused solutions would solve the problem anyway if the cause is encryption and Unications not playing nice together.

But it seems like it would be easy to detect that this isn't a system issue because, if the Unications are the issue, then the subscriber radios from other brands ought to be working fine in these areas.

Can't help but think there is more to this. Maybe I am giving some people too much credit.

To follow up on your question, it is NOT just the pagers, confirmed by Moto techs in the field in that East/South zone, low to no signal and garbled audio issues. The radio techs are in the field, working to identify the full scope of the issue and find a fix. So, some good news.