Kenwood: Kenwood getting out of Amateur Radio(rumor)
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I'd bet Kenwood stays in the market. I heard the same thing for the last thirty years. They don't make a lot of radio models but discontinuing a couple of radios due to a semiconductor shortage hardly means the end of the road.
MTS2000des
5B2_BEE00 Czar
Yes, but Kenwood hasn't innovated with any new revolutionary product in 20 years. The TS-2000 and TS-2000X were the last gasps of real innovation the way that Icom and Yaesu have been picking up the slack cranking out truly NEW innovative amateur products. Kenwood has NOTHING that holds a candle to products like Icom's IC-7300, IC-705, IC-9700- all of these are BRAND NEW advanced IF DSP designed top tier products. The ID-52 (when it comes out!) shows a real effort of doing something great. Icom's release of their new D-Star repeater that has a built in 4G LTE WAN option for remote standalone operation is innovation.
What does Kenwood have? Some decade old entry level radios (TH-K20A, TM-V71A if you can find them, and TM-281A- all of them are refreshes of designs that came out 15-20 years ago) and the TS-590S and TS-890S. That's it. Discontinued a pretty cool (but no doubt costly to manufacture) tri-band HT (TH-D74) and nothing to replace it. I've heard the same rumors about JVC Kenwood getting out of the ham biz for three decades, but I'm also seeing less and less from them as the years go by, where Icom and Yaesu, The Radio, are innovating and launching new stuff every few years.
So long as Mr. Inoue is breathing, I think Icom will always be king of the hill when it comes to new ham tech.
What does Kenwood have? Some decade old entry level radios (TH-K20A, TM-V71A if you can find them, and TM-281A- all of them are refreshes of designs that came out 15-20 years ago) and the TS-590S and TS-890S. That's it. Discontinued a pretty cool (but no doubt costly to manufacture) tri-band HT (TH-D74) and nothing to replace it. I've heard the same rumors about JVC Kenwood getting out of the ham biz for three decades, but I'm also seeing less and less from them as the years go by, where Icom and Yaesu, The Radio, are innovating and launching new stuff every few years.
So long as Mr. Inoue is breathing, I think Icom will always be king of the hill when it comes to new ham tech.
bill4long
Member
No doubt. I was talking about ham radio innovations like the "other two" have been doing. Kenwood radios are excellent, ham and commercial.
No love for the TS-990S?
Gunnar_Guy
Member
Kenwood (and I think Icom, too) can't quite ignore the amateur market like Motorola nor can they solely focus on it like Yaesu now. My feeling is their LMR and general two-way business needs amateur radio for sales but it also provides marketing and an additional development money stream. It's not easy to measure but it's got to be good exposure having your radios flying on the ISS.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
I'm pretty sure they've had a Kenwood flying around up there for a while now, long before 2020.
As for Kenwood needing amateur radio, I'd disagree. The sales they get on the LMR side would far overshadow what they can get on the ham side. Most public safety agencies have a pretty good refresh cycle that is more often than your average ham. And they'd be buying large numbers of radios at a time. Not single unit sales.
The Kenwood radios used by LMR and the radios sold on the ham side are different, so it's a completely different line. The technology used on ham doesn't make an impact on modern digital radios. With Kenwood ham stuff still stuck on D-Star, and the LMR side selling DMR, NXDN and P25, there's really no comparing the two. On the LMR side, they've all but discontinued analog only radios. And that doesn't even touch the EF Johnson side of the house.
I'm sure the ham market makes enough to pay for itself and a profit, but I don't think the existence of the ham radio product line has anything to do with the LMR product line.
As for Kenwood needing amateur radio, I'd disagree. The sales they get on the LMR side would far overshadow what they can get on the ham side. Most public safety agencies have a pretty good refresh cycle that is more often than your average ham. And they'd be buying large numbers of radios at a time. Not single unit sales.
The Kenwood radios used by LMR and the radios sold on the ham side are different, so it's a completely different line. The technology used on ham doesn't make an impact on modern digital radios. With Kenwood ham stuff still stuck on D-Star, and the LMR side selling DMR, NXDN and P25, there's really no comparing the two. On the LMR side, they've all but discontinued analog only radios. And that doesn't even touch the EF Johnson side of the house.
I'm sure the ham market makes enough to pay for itself and a profit, but I don't think the existence of the ham radio product line has anything to do with the LMR product line.
MTS2000des
5B2_BEE00 Czar
Used to be the Kenwood LMR radios "started" out as ham variants. For example, the TK-240/340/240D/340D were originally sold as the TH-26/46AT. They came from the same factories. Similar parts, different firmware. Kenwood ham gear of today are completely unrelated to any of their LMR gear. Different design team. JVC Kenwood is focusing on what makes them money. Selling a small number of radios to cheap hams who whine and cry if something isn't perfect or costs too much doesn't seem to be high on their priority list. The low rent CCRs aren't helping either.
My guess is when Mr. Inoue passes on, Icom will probably evolve away from ham gear. So long as he is there, they seem to be leading the way in investing in amateur radio, and their product line proves it. The IC-7300/9700 and 705 are innovative products. The R8600 is an innovative product. The ID-52a (if we ever see it) promises to be an innovative product. The new D-Star repeater with 4G LTE network support on board is an innovative product.
Someone tell me how Kenwood is innovating. Not bashing them, I LOVE my Kenwood stuff- but I don't see them doing anything spectacular, let alone much at all.
My guess is when Mr. Inoue passes on, Icom will probably evolve away from ham gear. So long as he is there, they seem to be leading the way in investing in amateur radio, and their product line proves it. The IC-7300/9700 and 705 are innovative products. The R8600 is an innovative product. The ID-52a (if we ever see it) promises to be an innovative product. The new D-Star repeater with 4G LTE network support on board is an innovative product.
Someone tell me how Kenwood is innovating. Not bashing them, I LOVE my Kenwood stuff- but I don't see them doing anything spectacular, let alone much at all.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
On the ham side? I don't think they are. The last innovative thing they had was the integrated APRS setup.
Yeah, they've had some new equipment since then, but nothing cutting edge.
I think there isn't much business in ham radio, at least not enough to keep a company like Kenwood going on it's own. Kenwood/EF Johnson makes a ton of money off their LMR products.
Gunnar_Guy
Member
I know they have. Just saying that it's nice marketing to be able to say "We're on the ISS." There's not a lot of places where you can acknowledge and trumpet this publicly. Kenwood's support for AMSAT might only be a hobby by their engineers but they had to customize the firmware for the TM-D710GA they just put up to be flight qualified and running it through testing isn't free. So there has to be some actual corporate support and I can't imagine them putting forth the effort for no reason.
Speaking of the TM-D710, when they introduced it in 2007 Kenwood said the global amateur radio market was about 16 to 17 billion Yen, which at the time would have been about $140 million.
KENWOOD : News Release
If Alinco can remain in the market with a few models then perhaps Kenwood must be alright. Alinco doesn't have the business and manufacturing infrastructure to leverage. Kenwood can run a batch of ham radios periodically on lines paid mostly for by public service and LMR. Not being a core business probably is exactly why it's not been axed. It just needs to break even with minimal product development attention.
If that 2007 press release is true then it's not been a big market comparatively for a long time. What are Motorola's numbers, a few billion in annual revenue? What's the market as a whole, probably around a hundred billions of Dollars? Why shouldn't the ham market then be conceded to Yaesu? Maybe because a hundred million dollars is still a lot of money and when you're faced with ruthless competitors it's costs a lot to cut your piece of the bigger pie. In the current reality Kenwood would not decide to get into the ham market as a new competitor. But staying in a market has different business requirements.
And it's not about being cheap necessarily. Yaesu sells plenty of FTM-400 radios. The mid grade HF and all mode HF/VHF/UHF radios (thinking FT-991, IC-7300, etc.) seem to sell fine. It's about offering something worth buying. I'd be in line if Kenwood would put DMR into a TM-D710 or TM-V71. But there's plenty of analog FM radios out there so all that's left is price and CCRs are going to win that dive to the bottom every time.
Even Motorola knows that and they had the FCC to step up enforcement when those were starting to make a noticable dent in sales a few years ago. Despite illegality of them, they must have been on the ground otherwise why bother? It's because finding revenue and hopefully profit from every niche is important.
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2004
- Messages
- 132
The FTDX-101D ate it for breakfast.
I bought both a TS-990 and an FTdx-101MP, intending to try them both for a while and keep the one I preferred.
They are both outstanding, but the 990 is so much more enjoyable to operate. The 101 is barely perceptibly better on receive in rare moments, but the 990 has, to my taste, a dramatically better human interface.
N6JPA
A Ham Radio Operator With too much frequency.
I always insist on a dime when I hear a rumor. It doubles the amount of money I have to buy a new radio!
O-B-1
KJ7WUZ
Maybe Carver needs to get in on the Amateur market. Perhaps what is needed is super high quality audio, 20Hz to 20kHz, with gold contacts, vacuum tubes, and a price tag of around $25k. Oh, it should do everything in a box, too, including heating my frozen pizza
Any takers? If so, I'll go to Shark Tank with a small royalty if $100 per unit sold.
LoL....
Any takers? If so, I'll go to Shark Tank with a small royalty if $100 per unit sold.
LoL....
El_Kabong
Member
Hi Rick!
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
Where to start on JVCKENWOOD...they don't tell us much about what's going on in terms of the amateur radio side. All we really get let in on is what's going on with the LMR side. The audio division is mainly aftermarket products (car stereo's as JVCKENWOOD is not an OEM like some of their competitors currently) and personal wireless accessories (Bluetooth headphones, etc). Amateur really felt some serious effects with chip shortages and the fact when comparing to the LMR product lines, not a lot was common. For example, a NX-5000 portable and a Viking VP5000 portable are the same hardware...one runs NX firmware and the other runs Viking firmware.
Is Kenwood innovating? They currently have a lineup of some of the most innovative products in the LMR space and currently the industry is waiting on the announcement of new hardware which by itself, isn't that innovative but when coupled with what can be done in software could start out as a ripple in a pond and become a tsunami in the amateur and LMR markets but will the amateur division run with it. Unfortunately, if you are a JKUSA, JKCA , EFJ, Radio Activity, etc AFCO...you really don't find out about some of the goings on in Japan until after the decision to do something has been made (which is just Japanese business style) and it's probably a good thing in the long run.
Is Kenwood innovating? They currently have a lineup of some of the most innovative products in the LMR space and currently the industry is waiting on the announcement of new hardware which by itself, isn't that innovative but when coupled with what can be done in software could start out as a ripple in a pond and become a tsunami in the amateur and LMR markets but will the amateur division run with it. Unfortunately, if you are a JKUSA, JKCA , EFJ, Radio Activity, etc AFCO...you really don't find out about some of the goings on in Japan until after the decision to do something has been made (which is just Japanese business style) and it's probably a good thing in the long run.
smason
Member
Having done a fair amount of electronics repair, I've been fairly impressed with Kenwood.
I have a friend who used to buy JVC stuff. Stereo gear, TVs. I swear I fixed them all, one more than once. Oddly enough his TS-440S is still going strong and didn't suffer from the dot problem. I have a Kenwood TR-7950 that still works great, only a memory battery replacement. Can't say the same for most of my Yaesu gear...
I have a friend who used to buy JVC stuff. Stereo gear, TVs. I swear I fixed them all, one more than once. Oddly enough his TS-440S is still going strong and didn't suffer from the dot problem. I have a Kenwood TR-7950 that still works great, only a memory battery replacement. Can't say the same for most of my Yaesu gear...
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