Motorola CP185 Question

[Merq]

Hey guys! Been doing some lurking here and really like the community. I was hoping someone with good knowledge on two-way radios could help me out here.

I recently bought some radios to work with in the pipeline field and decided to go with CP185. To give an example of what I do, I install flexible pipeline. So basically I might be at the end of the spool of pipe, while someone else is around 2,500-10,000 (maybe more depending on the job) feet away from me pulling it off the spool. The terrain between that footage is in Pennsylvania. Mountainous, hilly, LOTS of trees and woods, downhill or uphill, through curvy ditch paths through the woods, etc. Not "flat" by any means. This is what I need clear communication through.

I'm starting to think I made the wrong frequency choice after a little reading because I needed some fast and was buying them a bit uneducated. I have 3 primary questions I hope someone could educate me on:

1.) I went with UHF. The environment I work in is in Pennsylvania. Mostly wooded and tree filled areas, with lots of mountains and hills. So I might be talking to someone way downhill or uphill, with PLENTY of trees and woods in the way. Is UHF better to penetrate those trees and mountain sides? Or did I go completely wrong and should have gotten VHF instead? I tried calling someone and asking over the phone and they said UHF is better because of the uphill/downhill, many trees, and whatnot. He just didn't sound super confident in his answer so I came here too.

2.) This being said, I bought them from MyRadioMall so they came pre-programmed with short antennas. My next question is, if I buy WHIP antennas for them, do they need re-programming to a different frequency to support to the whip antenna? Or will it just automatically help increase range by just screwing the whip antenna on and keeping it on the same pre-programmed frequency it came on?

3.) And lastly, are the CP185's UHF/VHF compatible in a single unit? Meaning can I just have the frequency changed on my existing radios to "turn them into VHF" radios? Or would I have to buy a whole separate set to support VHF? This only needs an answer if you guys think I messed up with the terrain I work in.

 

[KG4INW]

I'll try to help, at least a little!

1) Generally, VHF works better in terrain and through foliage while UHF works better in buildings/the built environment. However, your stated range is certainly doable simplex.

2) Whip antennas will always work better than stubbies for range but won't necessarily be phenomenally better. They should be programmed for whatever you're licensed for but with those radios, the whip antenna covers all UHF freqs whereas the stubbies are narrower.

3) No, they are either UHF or VHF. If you need the other band, you'll need a separate radio.

 

[Merq]

I'll try to help, at least a little!

1) Generally, VHF works better in terrain and through foliage while UHF works better in buildings/the built environment. However, your stated range is certainly doable simplex.

2) Whip antennas will always work better than stubbies for range but won't necessarily be phenomenally better. They should be programmed for whatever you're licensed for but with those radios, the whip antenna covers all UHF freqs whereas the stubbies are narrower.

3) No, they are either UHF or VHF. If you need the other band, you'll need a separate radio.

Thanks for the reply. I think I'll obviously take the cheaper route and try the whip antennas for now instead of buying a new set of VHF radios. I was getting a little static about half of a mile through the woods with my current setup which is why I'm asking and researching this now.

 

[WA0CBW]

Are you using speaker mics? Curious what UHF frequency you got licensed on?

 

[Merq]

Are you using speaker mics? Curious what UHF frequency you got licensed on?

No, just the regular CP185 radios as they come. I am not sure what frequency they are programmed to. I bought them from an online company called MyRadioMall. They pre-program them for you before shipping them. I just turn them on, pick a matching channel, and hand them out to my guys at work.

 

[WA0CBW]

You had to tell MyRadioMall what frequency to program them to so you do have a license for that frequency don't you? Or you can pick a frequency but you still have to apply for an FCC license for the frequency you pick. For the most part there are only a handful of frequencies that don't require an FCC license.

 

[Merq]

You had to tell MyRadioMall what frequency to program them to so you do have a license for that frequency don't you? Or you can pick a frequency but you still have to apply for an FCC license for the frequency you pick. For the most part there are only a handful of frequencies that don't require an FCC license.

I have no clue about needing licenses for frequencies. They must use one of the frequencies that don't require it. I was never asked nor told about licensing.

 

[KG4INW]

Now that I've had more time to think about it, it's going to be very difficult to reach 10,000' or more using simple handhelds in that kind of terrain. Mobile radios (with licensing, to utilize more power) mounted in vehicles with good roof-mounted antennas would work far better.

As for the legalities, there aren't any frequencies they can program in that don't require a license. They should know that. Yes, there are some frequencies used by FRS that are license free but the CP185 doesn't have certification to be used on them. I'm not the FCC or any kind of enforcement but just wanted to help improve your awareness.

My suggestion is to find a radio dealer near you and consult them for helping you obtain a license.

 

[TampaTyron]

A few things from someone in the radio business:

-You radio vendor should have at least discussed licensing with you. It is a big (and growing) issue in the industry of unlicensed transmitters. It consumes a lot of resources tracking them down when they interfere with licensed systems.

-You may want to rent a handful of VHF radios to see if they might work better for your application.

-Once you get licensing squared away,you may want to look at using a simplex repeater in the middle of the area you are looking to cover. But, have your last channel in your radios programmed with a split (like a repeater would be programmed) and your second to last channel programmed opposite of this split (like a standard radio accessing a repeater). During normal operation one radio is on the last channel and the rest are on the second to last channel. This way, your users do not hear themselves as is common with standard simplex repeater operation. Put the repeater radio in a waterproof box or bag in the center of your coverage area (or hoist it in a tree/light post, etc). The radio doing the repeating will get HOT, so be prepared as they go bad faster than normal radios.
TT.

 

[grem467]

I'll bet a paycheck they just stuck them on an itinerant such as 464.5 and picked a pl. I see shops do that all the time.

 

[WA0CBW]

It is a common misconception that low power or itinerant frequencies don't need a license. It is a shame many on-line radio dealers sell radios and don't tell the customer about the licensing requirements. If you read the manual for the CP185 you will see a section describing that this radio requires an FCC license and gives you an email address to get the appropriate licensing materials.

 

[krokus]

For better coverage in that type of terrain, I would suggest low-band frequencies. One issue will be not having effective antennas in a handheld format, for that frequency range. Low-band should carry through the wooded areas, and provide some fill-in past hills.

One option that could work, if you are staying close to your trucks, would be mobile radios with bluetooth connections to the people. (Pryme makes an assortment BT interfaces.)

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