New APX models ?

[mbnv992]

Was reading the other forum and it was mentioned that there is supposedly gonna be some new APX models introduced this year. Anyone have any info ? I’m hoping they come out with a redesigned 6000/8000 with a slightly bigger screen ( not cellphone-like with the Next ) and maybe just “refresh” the standard 6000/8000 series ?

I know as it is a lot of people have orders for brand new 6000/8000 models and it’s taking months to get them. Wonder how long it will take to get these new radios when they come out ? Probably at the end of 2023 hahaha

 

[W9WSS]

I don't believe there are any major visible engineering changes with the display. Our County ETSB just shelled out $39 million for a mixture of APX Next, APX8500, APX4500, and I believe APX6000. They sent the *wrong* mobile antenna as they were too thick and long, and ripped the NMO mounts right out of the roof of several pieces of apparatus as they pulled into quarters.

Because of some other "issues," there will be a delay in deploying all these radios. As far as I'm concerned, that is a GOOD thing, as once all new radios are put in service, all law enforcement talk groups will be permanently and 100% encrypted. I don't believe this is a very good representation of transparency.

 

[P25andstuff]

Was reading the other forum and it was mentioned that there is supposedly gonna be some new APX models introduced this year. Anyone have any info ? I’m hoping they come out with a redesigned 6000/8000 with a slightly bigger screen ( not cellphone-like with the Next ) and maybe just “refresh” the standard 6000/8000 series ?

I know as it is a lot of people have orders for brand new 6000/8000 models and it’s taking months to get them. Wonder how long it will take to get these new radios when they come out ? Probably at the end of 2023 hahaha

Motorola will not be releasing any more new P25 radios that aren't cellphone like. It's the new way (well that they believe) its more of a "we claim to listen to our users but we don't care what they say." A vast majority of the officers that I know can barely operate the most basic of radios. An APX next will make them lost. A vast majority of users want something reliable and a PTT lol. Id be very surprised if they redesign the 8000 but it'll never happen. They are trying to push the NEXTs currently they are slowly starting to move away from the 6/8000s, its all a game of money and control.

 

[W9WSS]

Cops hate change. Cops want it simple, as in a term that despises me, K.I.S.S. (keep it simple stupid).

I remember when I was working for a two-way radio shop "back in the day," a law enforcement agency was upgrading their ancient HT-1000s for XTS-5000s. One particular Sergeant REFUSED to "surrender" his HT-1000 which I presume he carried for eons. He shouted that he wasn't giving it up, didn't want a "new-fangled" radio and that his HT-1000 saved his life on several occasions. The catch here was that our deal with this agency was 100% total trade-in current fleet of HT-1000s which was spelled out in the contract. From what I can recall, the cranky Sergeant was facing possible disciplinary action, all the way to dismissal for refusing to comply with the deal they have with our Motorola shop.

He finally agreed, and had nothing but bad things to say about "new technology." We had to "dumb-up" those multi-feature radios to disable all the buttons and switches, and make direct (or talk around) in another channel as opposed to a button. That would only confuse the users because very few of the "troops" had any basic knowledge of radio.

I can just imagine today because that agency is now on a P25 region-wide trunked system, totally encrypted. I would presume the cranky sergeant has long retired.

I just wanted to extoll the duties and disappointments of a two-way radio sales specialist (and programming tech). This example just shows another agency that doesn't train their personnel on the usage of communications devices that would possibly save their own and their fellow colleagues' lives.


Thank you for the bandwidth.

 

[DeoVindice]

Motorola will not be releasing any more new P25 radios that aren't cellphone like. It's the new way (well that they believe) its more of a "we claim to listen to our users but we don't care what they say." A vast majority of the officers that I know can barely operate the most basic of radios. An APX next will make them lost. A vast majority of users want something reliable and a PTT lol. Id be very surprised if they redesign the 8000 but it'll never happen. They are trying to push the NEXTs currently they are slowly starting to move away from the 6/8000s, its all a game of money and control.

You know who's happy to hear that?

Harris and EFWood. The demand for touchscreen radios isn't there. Realistically, a Model 1.5 with voice announcement is sufficient for at least ninety percent of users.

 

[jruta]

You know who's happy to hear that?

Harris and EFWood. The demand for touchscreen radios isn't there. Realistically, a Model 1.5 with voice announcement is sufficient for at least ninety percent of users.

Fact.

 

[P25andstuff]

You know who's happy to hear that?

Harris and EFWood. The demand for touchscreen radios isn't there. Realistically, a Model 1.5 with voice announcement is sufficient for at least ninety percent of users.

1000000% the VP8000 fully featured is about $5300. If its a good radio thats going to kill motos business, and it also will have dmr and nxdn. A user just needs something rugged and the ability to check what channel they are on

 

[chrismol1]

I've always wondered what the grand schemes is for the NEXT. I mean we're talking about a radio that spends maybe 12 hour shifts inside a pouch on their vest or a holster and doesn't get removed at all, if ever tac channel is needed its voice announcement and a knob change. Cops don't like changing channels and losing dispatch. And if they plan on CAD apps and such, I wonder how that is going, not that some cops would like unstrapping their NEXT from the holster every time on scene instead of using the car computer, maybe they do

I've heard back in the day they wanted to do fancy things the XTS displays for info. The APX7000 screen for mapping apps. Now the Fire Dept guys I see a bunch of cool stuff. Mapping and info of incidents and units, fire ground accountability stuff on display for command, apps for maybe hazmat and info easily accessible on screen for recall, an I am responding app, etc EMS has mapping and medical data maybe, instead of the tablets they have now. Maybe that was the plan....I don't know...

 

[jruta]

Let’s be honest, a simple, rugged radio is FAR better suited than any of this NEXT crap for police or fire;

Shots fired? Building collapse?

Not a single one is gonna be impressed by a smartphone screen. Simplicity and seconds count. Anyone who disagrees doesn’t do that job.

Moto has lost its direction.

 

[nikronzo]

its really such a shame that a company that's name is synonymous with public safety, durability, and life-saving is headed down this path. Not trying to insinuate that they're going bankrupt tomorrow morning, but the company seems to be headed down a bad path after already suffering blows in recent years with their split and so on. If mother M's "head up their ass" decisions make them lose market share to Harris, Kenwood, and so on they have no one to blame but themselves.

Who just wants to see a Motorola Motrac in 1-Adam-12 like the old days lol!

 

[chrismol1]

What's the real cost of of a NEXT? I know moto does contract pricing anywhere from 25% to 40% off. Then again, moto likes to give them federal grant funding forms already filled out ready to go

A trick I often use is googling the model or model number such as "APX NEXT" and "pdf" and you'll get cities who upload their contract quotes. There's some that, single band next lists for 4600, sale for 3400, some sale prices at $2700 for a NEXT....All band some show around 5k, who really needs all band? depending on quantity but man, of course it depends on the area in the country, deals and everything else. They're not 10 grand, and I bet they would undercut the competition just to get the contract

 

[Giddyuptd]

Reminds me of a few dinosaur deputies who favored their ht1000 with same attitude. Prior to those they were happy with the bendix kings. One got into a debate over the air end of shift in morning over turning in his unit and portable for new radios. He replied my radios work fine. Then a long debate occurred. In end he dropped it off and lost the argument.

Cops hate change. Cops want it simple, as in a term that despises me, K.I.S.S. (keep it simple stupid).

I remember when I was working for a two-way radio shop "back in the day," a law enforcement agency was upgrading their ancient HT-1000s for XTS-5000s. One particular Sergeant REFUSED to "surrender" his HT-1000 which I presume he carried for eons. He shouted that he wasn't giving it up, didn't want a "new-fangled" radio and that his HT-1000 saved his life on several occasions. The catch here was that our deal with this agency was 100% total trade-in current fleet of HT-1000s which was spelled out in the contract. From what I can recall, the cranky Sergeant was facing possible disciplinary action, all the way to dismissal for refusing to comply with the deal they have with our Motorola shop.

He finally agreed, and had nothing but bad things to say about "new technology." We had to "dumb-up" those multi-feature radios to disable all the buttons and switches, and make direct (or talk around) in another channel as opposed to a button. That would only confuse the users because very few of the "troops" had any basic knowledge of radio.

I can just imagine today because that agency is now on a P25 region-wide trunked system, totally encrypted. I would presume the cranky sergeant has long retired.

I just wanted to extoll the duties and disappointments of a two-way radio sales specialist (and programming tech). This example just shows another agency that doesn't train their personnel on the usage of communications devices that would possibly save their own and their fellow colleagues' lives.


Thank you for the bandwidth.

 

[GlobalNorth]

..I remember when I was working for a two-way radio shop "back in the day," a law enforcement agency was upgrading their ancient HT-1000s for XTS-5000s. One particular Sergeant REFUSED to "surrender" his HT-1000 which I presume he carried for eons...

You say that as if it were a bad thing.

I recall when the HT-1000 hit my department and we got rid of the old GE MASTR PE radios that we rotated from officer to officer. We each got issued a HT-1000 and kept it until I left for the Feds and their Sabers. The Saber was a good radio, but it wasn't the HT-1000. When I quit the Feds and returned to my old agency, I got my old portable back and kept it until I retired.

It was ugly, basic, had no bells, no whistles, no encryption, was old technology in the 2000s, and occasionally made a decent impact weapon, but it was mine and it always worked. A lot of family members worked for Motorola over the years, including my mother, and she took immense pride in the fact that I loved and respected that radio.

When engineers like Bob Galvin ran that company, they produced the best two way gear on the planet. Now... not so much.

They really need a Gen III Saber with basic features and a rock simple OS.

 

[ElroyJetson]

I have asked most policemen and deputies that I've encountered how many channels (or talkgroups) they really actually use in their radios, and in every case, it's been less than ten channels. (Or talkgroups)

A basic radio with a 16 position rotary knob and an LCD channel display on the radio is all that most officers seem to have any real use for, with the possible exception of supervisors and command staff.

And they don't need a large touch screen display that is probably going to get broken before the week is out.

A model 1.5 APX is all the radio that most any LEO or EMS needs. Other than a few supervisory and command staff that might actually use the additional features.

If it weren't for P25 Phase II requirements, an XTS5000 would still be what I'd pick as the workhorse of choice. Or a mythical non-UHF version SSE5000. (UHF T-band only, good luck getting NYPD to sell one to you, even though they bought 10,000 and never put them in general issue.)

The AXPX NEXT is quite a gadget but it's not a patrolman's radio. Unless they found a way to make the display unbreakable.

The APX NEXT is exactly what I predicted the portable radio would evolve to as soon as I saw the first iPhone. That was in 2007.
Smartphone touch screen functionality, installable applications, mated to conventional portable radio ergonomic controls. Rotary volume, rotary knob, PTT.

 

[jruta]

Reminds me of a few dinosaur deputies who favored their ht1000 with same attitude. Prior to those they were happy with the bendix kings. One got into a debate over the air end of shift in morning over turning in his unit and portable for new radios. He replied my radios work fine. Then a long debate occurred. In end he dropped it off and lost the argument.
[/

You’ve never worked that job. Clearly.

 

[18bravo]

I love the NEXT XE currently I have 2 but I agree not sure if it’s the right radio for police and fire.

 

[Giddyuptd]

You’ve never worked that job. Clearly.

You don't know me so take your personal hits somewhere else.

 

[ElroyJetson]

I've had to deal with people who didn't want to give up their old radios which worked well for them, but it wasn't difficult for them to eventually figure out that the new radio was much better...simply because the new system was different enough from the old system that the old radio would not work on it AT ALL. "You can keep your old radio...good luck talking to anybody on it." LOL.

And then...they'd bring in a radio and ask if they could make it work on the system they use. "No, nothing on this earth will make your old UHF Kenwood wideband radio work on this new VHF DMR system no matter how much you pay me." And they just don't get it. They think I'm DENYING them, and that it could work if I just typed in the magic numbers on the programming computer.

There were always a couple who would try to bootleg their own radio into the system because "the old one works better" even when their manager tells them directly, "Use that radio instead of the one you were issued and you'll be suspended for a week without pay" .

It was stuff like that which is one reason why I don't really miss being a radio tech very much. I've never had a lot of patience for dumb people and as the job of radio tech automatically makes you the "smart guy with all the answers", you tend to attract dumb people like a moth to a flame.

 

[NVAGVUP]

Cops hate change. Cops want it simple, as in a term that despises me, K.I.S.S. (keep it simple stupid).

Thank you for the bandwidth.

The only folks who hate change more than cops are fire firefighters! (FF's spend tons of time training with equipment [between fires]) Anything new, they hate.

One observational comment about APX Next vs regular APX line. I am an old, nerdy curmudgeon. I am a "keep it simple" guy. But the newer generations in public safety have seen the "latest/greatest technology" their entire lives. These folks are now becoming decision makers in public safety. "Sticks in the mud" people like me are retiring/dying off. Motorola is courting/catering to this generational change. (IMHO)

 

[MTS2000des]

Try changing zones while doing 90mph in a chase from a touch screen. Oh I know, you're supposed to say VIQI ZONE FC CITIES, VIQI CHANNEL CITY DISPATCH, only to have her bonk and "unrecognized command" on the display you shouldn't be looking at. I can operate an APX6000/8000 by feel, and with channel announcement enabled, don't even have to LOOK at the radio.