New scanner question

[trentbob]

Th

Thanks for the info Bob.
I’ve been a ham about 15 years. I do know and understand roofing and bandwidth filtering. My KX3 has the best filtering in a radio that I’ve ever used. Especially down in the CW area, I can filer out and pull in the weakest CW signals!

As I once told a fellow, you can have the best of the best in equipment. If you don’t know your rig, you might as well turn it off. The manual is there for a reason.

73!
W5KYP

Yep I hear you. Unfortunately the filters were added as firmware updates after the manual was published and there is nothing in the manual about proper usage of filters. The basic thing to remember is global filters affect every object on the radio and are only to be used to sample real-time results RSSI, noise level and error rate while actually listening. Avoid Auto filters, they slow scanning down. Once you find a better filter return Global to normal which affects every object on the radio and you would not want to compromise anything.

You go into site options and apply the filter there to the one or two sites you were listening to. On conventional objects you don't use error rate of course but when you find an optimal filter on global, return Global to normal and then apply the proper filter to Department options of that conventional frequency, you can't add it to a single Channel just a department of channels, usually works out fine. People get frustrated with filters and just apply them willy-nilly. You have to be consistent and use real-time results while listening so it must be done on the radio itself. It's most important that you hook up to the computer and transfer the information from the radio to your profile right away as that will save any changes you made on the radio itself.

Very few people do it this way LOL. By the way you can put the filter indicator on the display of the radio which helps you keep track. 73's... Bob.

 

[darkness975]

SDS200

 

[bob550]

Yes. And real-world experience from users provides valuable info that isn't necessarily included in the manufacturer's press releases.

But if it did, you might see something like: "For proper operation and complete product enjoyment, an engineering degree is recommended. Degree sold separately."

 

[natedawg1604]

I would just reiterate what others have already pointed out- there is no single "best" scanner for all modes/bands.

Many folks who get really absorbed into this hobby acquire numerous scanners, commercial radios and/or ham radios for various purposes. I have all 3.

For monitoring p-25 at home, you may wish to consider a few $25 SDR RTL dongles and applicable software programs that support P-25 such as DSD+ Fastlane, Unitrunker (for logging), or OP-25 (Linux based) or SDR Trunk. Those are the major ones.

 

[fredva]

It appears that Avoyelles Parish uses the statewide LWIN system for public safety. It also appears that the local LWIN transmitter PROBABLY isn't simulcast. I say probably because the information attached to the FCC license that I'd normally use to confirm simulcast or not is missing from the database. I believe that LWIN may only have simulcast sites in the major metropolitan areas.

 

[iMONITOR]

Scanner Master and Industry News | Scanner Master

Stay up to date in the scanner radio world with industry breaking news and updates.

www.scannermaster.com

Information is from five years ago.

 

[bob550]

Information is from five years ago.

In the world of electronics, that would be the Mesozoic era.

 

[W5KYP]

It appears that Avoyelles Parish uses the statewide LWIN system for public safety. It also appears that the local LWIN transmitter PROBABLY isn't simulcast. I say probably because the information attached to the FCC license that I'd normally use to confirm simulcast or not is missing from the database. I believe that LWIN may only have simulcast sites in the major metropolitan areas.

According to the DB, there are two (LWIN) tower sites in my location. One listed as Avoyelles, the other listed as Vick.
I can hear both however, On my Grecom PSR-500, about 25% of the audio is garbled and not understandable and often miss the second side of the conversation but the units display is showing that it should be receiving, but no audio.
I am assuming....that this is multicast/data issues or something of the sort. I have an antenna 35' up my tower, running LMR-400 as the coax. I'm confident its not an antenna issue....

I'm purchasing a new scanner hoping that these issues will clear up!

 

[trentbob]

According to the DB, there are two (LWIN) tower sites in my location. One listed as Avoyelles, the other listed as Vick.
I can hear both however, On my Grecom PSR-500, about 25% of the audio is garbled and not understandable and often miss the second side of the conversation but the units display is showing that it should be receiving, but no audio.
I am assuming....that this is multicast/data issues or something of the sort. I have an antenna 35' up my tower, running LMR-400 as the coax. I'm confident its not an antenna issue....

I'm purchasing a new scanner hoping that these issues will clear up!

If you purchase any Whistler product you will get the same exact results as you are with the psr-500. The SDS series has an SDR chip and is designed to handle simulcast issues.

 

[W5KYP]

If you purchase any Whistler product you will get the same exact results as you are with the psr-500. The SDS series has an SDR chip and is designed to handle simulcast issues.

I am really leaning to the SDS200 however, I have read somewhere that the Uniden SDS series units are often returned for repairs...
Not sure if this is still the issue......

 

[WA0CBW]

Simulcast sites can be identified by looking at the site frequencies. Simulcast sites have exactly the same frequencies, control channels and talk groups all working as one virtual site with a large coverage area.
BB

 

[bob550]

You stated that your antenna is 35' up your tower. What type of antenna are you using for scanner reception? If simulcast distortion is the source of your problems, your antenna height may be making matters worse. I know that in the world of radio reception/transmission, height is usually your friend. But that's not necessarily the case with 800 MHz simulcast. Try using only the OEM antennas supplied with the radios and see if that reduces or resolves the reception problems.

 

[trentbob]

I am really leaning to the SDS200 however, I have read somewhere that the Uniden SDS series units are often returned for repairs...
Not sure if this is still the issue......

Yep this was bound to come up of course. Best thing I can do so I don't get tied into where I think this thread is going to go, I've been down that road many times just like the rest of us, is to say investigate it yourself. In the Uniden forum you will see multiple threads addressing multiple problems. In a nutshell the designer and Uniden product manager that introduced the SDS radios passed away in late 2019 from cancer before he was able to address everything he would have liked to have addressed.

That combined with the virus resulted in nothing really being addressed until Uniden hired a new product manager about seven or eight months ago? At least that's when he introduced himself. There is a 1000+ posts thread that crashed and burned and was closed recently.

I am not going to personally get involved in this here but there are basically two scanner companies, one of them has simulcast capable radios, the other doesn't. You also have an option of a commercial radio being programmed in such a way that you would not transmit and it would simply be a receiver, this is costly. There is a company that makes a pager called Unication, it's not exactly a scanner but gives superior simulcast performance just as a professional commercial radio would.

The bottom line is if you purchase an SDS 200 make sure to buy it from a reputable company like Scanner Master or Bearcat Warehouse, there are a few others, like Maine Trading Company that have a return policy. If you have an issue you simply pack it up and send it back for another radio or a refund.

 

[W5KYP]

You stated that your antenna is 35' up your tower. What type of antenna are you using for scanner reception? If simulcast distortion is the source of your problems, your antenna height may be making matters worse. I know that in the world of radio reception/transmission, height is usually your friend. But that's not necessarily the case with 800 MHz simulcast. Try using only the OEM antennas supplied with the radios and see if that reduces or resolves the reception problems.

I have tried everything from the OEM antenna that came with the unit to a Diamond X510, to an antenna cut and tuned to the center of the frequency. All the same.

 

[W5KYP]

Yep this was bound to come up of course. Best thing I can do so I don't get tied into where I think this thread is going to go, I've been down that road many times just like the rest of us, is to say investigate it yourself. In the Uniden forum you will see multiple threads addressing multiple problems. In a nutshell the designer and Uniden product manager that introduced the SDS radios passed away in late 2019 from cancer before he was able to address everything he would have liked to have addressed.

That combined with the virus resulted in nothing really being addressed until Uniden hired a new product manager about seven or eight months ago? At least that's when he introduced himself. There is a 1000+ posts thread that crashed and burned and was closed recently.

I am not going to personally get involved in this here but there are basically two scanner companies, one of them has simulcast capable radios, the other doesn't. You also have an option of a commercial radio being programmed in such a way that you would not transmit and it would simply be a receiver, this is costly. There is a company that makes a pager called Unication, it's not exactly a scanner but gives superior simulcast performance just as a professional commercial radio would.

The bottom line is if you purchase an SDS 200 make sure to buy it from a reputable company like Scanner Master or Bearcat Warehouse, there are a few others, like Maine Trading Company that have a return policy. If you have an issue you simply pack it up and send it back for another radio or a refund.

Agreed 100%

 

[trentbob]

I have tried everything from the OEM antenna that came with the unit to a Diamond X510, to an antenna cut and tuned to the center of the frequency. All the same.

When dealing with the issue that you described which is very typical with a GRE, Radio Shack, Whistler radio... They're all the same radios, the trick is to have compromised reception, the more efficient your antenna is the more simulcast distortion will be a problem hence, people used to use paper clips, comet CH 32 Miracle babies, they would even drill holes in paint cans and stick the rubber duck in the hole just to try to reduce and compromise reception. Unfortunately if there's other things that you want to listen to, especially conventional frequencies you miss out on the great performance of your rooftop antenna.

 

[bob550]

For several years, I had a heck of a challenge trying to receive my local P25 simulcast system on my non-SDS Uniden digital scanners. No antenna, not my discone mounted 20' up, or any others that I attached directly to the scanners resolved the problem. Only my Unication G5, a handheld, gives me perfect reception on this and other regional simulcast systems.

 

[bob550]

Unfortunately if there's other things that you want to listen to, especially conventional frequencies you miss out on the great performance of your rooftop antenna.

An imperfect solution would be two antennas, one for the LWIN and the other tower-mounted, connected through an antenna switch. That can give you the best of both worlds (almost). You just can't monitor the simulcast and conventional or analog at the same time.

 

[W5KYP]

An imperfect solution would be two antennas, one for the LWIN and the other tower-mounted, connected through an antenna switch. That can give you the best of both worlds (almost). You just can't monitor the simulcast and conventional or analog at the same time.

Which brings to mind a fan dipole. Not this it would work for this application but..

I’ve made many of them over the years but for HF bands.

 

[trentbob]

Which brings to mind a fan dipole. Not this it would work for this application but..

I’ve made many of them over the years but for HF bands.

Yep, completely on the other side of the spectrum LOL. I really think it's your psr-500. It was after all, produced in 2007 and it's the same exact radio that Whistler still sells today LOL, simulcast issues and all. If you have the money you will have a blast with the sds200. Plenty of experts here who can help you with questions or issues but it is a lot of fun, great display, lots of stuff to play with. I customize my display to clear off all the clutter so I can easily see what I'm listening to.