SDS100/SDS200: NOISE indicator

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rbuxton

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My numbers for the NOISE indicator are jumping all over the place when the scanner is stopped on a channel or scanning.



Is this how it's supposed to work?


No matter what numbers I see the scanner receives fine.
 

Ubbe

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The actual noise indicator are supposed to work like that, it indicates the amount of noise you have. If it jumps around a little, like 100-500 it is normal but if it jumps between 100-5,000 then you have some transmitter nearby that when it starts it interferes with the signal you are trying to receive. In some cases you can solve that be using the IFX setting to that frequency.

/Ubbe
 

mike1988

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The actual noise indicator are supposed to work like that, it indicates the amount of noise you have. If it jumps around a little, like 100-500 it is normal but if it jumps between 100-5,000 then you have some transmitter nearby that when it starts it interferes with the signal you are trying to receive. In some cases you can solve that be using the IFX setting to that frequency.

/Ubbe



Ubbe where is the ifx settings? I have the same issue.


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N6ML

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It jumps around wildly on 770MHz P25 sites for me, all the time - from low 3-digit numbers to 5 digits. With a 50ohm dummy load connected to the antenna input, it jumps around as much, but seems the numbers are even higher - all 4 or 5 digits, as high as ~40,000. I have yet to see a good description of what the number actually represents.
 

Ubbe

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In the old days when you had a new scanner you set it to search all frequency bands with a dummy load attached or without any antenna. The carriers it detected would then be self quieting frequencies that needed to be locked out as that was comming from the scanners own electronics.

In professional radios you often have clock shift that alters the CPUs frequency that would move the interference to another frequency. In some Uniden scanners you can switch one of the IF frequencies to be plus or minus on a channel that might help in some cases.

/Ubbe
 

Boatanchor

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It jumps around wildly on 770MHz P25 sites for me, all the time - from low 3-digit numbers to 5 digits. With a 50ohm dummy load connected to the antenna input, it jumps around as much, but seems the numbers are even higher - all 4 or 5 digits, as high as ~40,000. I have yet to see a good description of what the number actually represents.

The above comment about the dummy load is a huge red flag and concern, if true!

Reading comments from others about the noise levels increasing on 700Mhz as the unit heats up, sounds to me like one of the RF/IF/SDR sections is becoming unstable and noisy/spurious at high internal temperatures.

If this is the case, expect another recall because the punters wont be happy about one of the major bands becoming unusable after only a few hours of operation.

We wont really know for sure until someone actually puts an SDS100 on the bench, feeds it with a calibrated signal generator and logs the receive performance over time. Sadly, while I have the P25 test equipment, I don't have an SDS100. After my last (bad) experience with the 436, I doubt I'll be buying one either ;-)

Trying to quantify receive performance from varying off air signals is just a waste of time. Unless you can back it up with meaningful lab results, its unlikely the manufacturers will take you seriously.

Out of interest, compare noise numbers with a dummy load connected, when the unit is cold and again after a few hours.
 

jonwienke

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It jumps around wildly on 770MHz P25 sites for me, all the time - from low 3-digit numbers to 5 digits. With a 50ohm dummy load connected to the antenna input, it jumps around as much, but seems the numbers are even higher - all 4 or 5 digits, as high as ~40,000. I have yet to see a good description of what the number actually represents.

That's to be expected. Noise is basically a measurement of the background static. The weaker the signal, the greater the amount of static.

boatanchor said:
The above comment about the dummy load is a huge red flag and concern, if true!

Why? What would you expect to hear if you connected a dummy load to any other radio, and opened the squelch? Full quieting, or a lot of noise?
 

rbuxton

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So, since my NOISE numbers are all over the place and there is no noticeable degradation of my receiver then what are we to make of that?
 

jonwienke

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As long as the signal-to-noise ratio remains higher than the minimum level needed for accurate digital decode, it can fluctuate significantly and have no effect on the quality of decoded audio. It only is an issue when it starts affecting decode accuracy, and pushing D-ERROR above zero.
 

UPMan

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Wherever you want to put it. It is a user-configurable item.

Note that NOISE is the absolute value of the output of the digital audio high-pass filter. There is no "unit" associated with it. Basically, it is a level corresponding to the amount of high-frequency audio present in the demodulated signal. The higher the number, the more high-frequency audio is present.
 

N6ML

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That's to be expected. Noise is basically a measurement of the background static. The weaker the signal, the greater the amount of static.

Huh? That doesn't make sense ... unless you're factoring in some sort of AGC action. Presence of a signal doesn't change the absolute level of the background noise otherwise.
 

N6ML

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Note that NOISE is the absolute value of the output of the digital audio high-pass filter. There is no "unit" associated with it. Basically, it is a level corresponding to the amount of high-frequency audio present in the demodulated signal. The higher the number, the more high-frequency audio is present.

What is the bandwidth sampled when receiving P25 ? I've been wondering if it's wide enough to be seeing activity on adjacent channels....
 

UPMan

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Presence of a signal absolutely affects the AF background noise. Turn on any CB and listen with squelch open to a channel w/no signal and one with a nearby strong signal...
 

jonwienke

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What is the bandwidth sampled when receiving P25 ? I've been wondering if it's wide enough to be seeing activity on adjacent channels....

Depends on whether you have NFM, FM, etc selected.
 

N6ML

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Presence of a signal absolutely affects the AF background noise. Turn on any CB and listen with squelch open to a channel w/no signal and one with a nearby strong signal...

Yes, because the signal invokes the AGC - gain reduction => noise level reduction. Perhaps that's what's happening in my dummy-load case - maybe it's just measuring receiver internal noise with the RF gain on max. This doesn't explain why it dances around so much, though, especially in the dummy-load case. It also still doesn't really make the numbers particularly meaningful....
 
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