ORION ENC Talkgroups

cm205

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Dec 28, 2008
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63
Have noticed a few very regularly active encrypted talkgroups on the ORION system, many in the same 1xx range. Curious if anyone has insight:

109
112
113
114
115
118
211
2009
2510
2553
2586
2687
 

ORION_NE

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Dec 2, 2012
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257
Location
Dodge, NE
211 is or was called Metro Encrypted.
11x talk groups believe to be OPD encrypted dispatch talk groups.
 

jelimoore

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Jul 17, 2018
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I've seen 2586 pop up a lot as encrypted. Doing some basic sluething it looks like not many (if any) of the RIDs are shared between other talkgroups... although I don't have a spare SDR at the minute to tune in with Unitrunker. Need to stock up on a few.
 

topnik

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148
Location
South of Omaha, NE
Have noticed a few very regularly active encrypted talkgroups on the ORION system, many in the same 1xx range. Curious if anyone has insight:

109
112
113
114
115
118
211
2009
2510
2553
2586
2687
Me too. I've got the following:

112 = NW Secure (B01)
113 = NE Secure (B02)
114 = SE Secure (B03)
115 = SW Secure (B04)
118 = W Secure (B05)
2009 = some Washington County Secure channel

Hope that helps.
 

cm205

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Dec 28, 2008
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Thanks, I’ve noticed those precinct secure channels seem to be mostly for tac use instead of a full dispatch group. There seems to be one for the DCSO too. Wonder if OPD could move operations over full time if they decide to go fully encrypted though.

2586 seems to be a discrete user, maybe a special assignment group. 2009 may be WCSO ERU.
 

jelimoore

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Jul 17, 2018
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If OPD moved to secure, I'd be really sad. I get why but it's still annoying as hell. I do think that based on the way it's set up, OPD could easily move to full-time encryption overnight, and in my personal opinion that's what they're going to do within the next year or two. They would use encrypted TGs for normal use, and for interop they can use the metro channels.

However, I have spoken with an officer who is a friend of a friend and as far as he knew the ORION system was far harder to listen to than Lincoln's system where he came from. Then I blew his mind with my RTLSDRs and op25. So there is a potential that the general userbase of the system doesn't know how insecure it is?
 

topnik

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South of Omaha, NE
Thanks, I’ve noticed those precinct secure channels seem to be mostly for tac use instead of a full dispatch group. There seems to be one for the DCSO too. Wonder if OPD could move operations over full time if they decide to go fully encrypted though.

2586 seems to be a discrete user, maybe a special assignment group. 2009 may be WCSO ERU.
Yeah, that's what I've observed too. It's a tac use kind of thing...so far. Looking at my UT logs, seems 2009 is a Secure Dispatch TG, don't know about ERU...to be honest, I don't follow Washington County traffic that much, but my logs remind me of the 1xx OPD usage, as well as the Sarpy LE West/East secure/digital/'2' use. I could be wrong, I have in the past.

2586 is interesting, to be sure. I have logging of that TG back from Nov of last year...RIDs are Washington County, but there seem to be a limited amount of users...RIDs 27377 to 27409 with no apparent Dispatch TGs...maybe some kind of corrections TG? I don't know.

The more the system merges, the more interesting things get!
 

topnik

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South of Omaha, NE
And looking back, TG 109 'appears' to be a DCSO secure channel. But, I've only got 52 hits on it since December 2019. That doesn't mean much because I swap my logger in and out randomly between Douglas and Sarpy County. The RIDs I have logged are between 6025 and 6259 with a singleton at 9956 (which still matches with DCSO). No dispatch related TGs on there, at least to my monitoring...

This kind of exchange is why I'm a fan of trying to ID Radio IDs as much as (if not more than) TG IDs. Sometimes the TGID is easier...but once the TGID is IDd...get those RIDs so we can ID those difficult TGIDs!

Unfortunately, the DB isn't a place for RIDs. That's why the WIKI is there.

If anyone has good confirmation of Radio IDs, slap them in the WIKI! Please!
 

topnik

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Yeah, that's what I've observed too. It's a tac use kind of thing...so far. Looking at my UT logs, seems 2009 is a Secure Dispatch TG, don't know about ERU...to be honest, I don't follow Washington County traffic that much, but my logs remind me of the 1xx OPD usage, as well as the Sarpy LE West/East secure/digital/'2' use. I could be wrong, I have in the past.

2586 is interesting, to be sure. I have logging of that TG back from Nov of last year...RIDs are Washington County, but there seem to be a limited amount of users...RIDs 27377 to 27409 with no apparent Dispatch TGs...maybe some kind of corrections TG? I don't know.

The more the system merges, the more interesting things get!

So I'm quoting myself here because I think I messed up IRT TG 2586...I believe I misidentified the TG and RIDs...looks like they're Pottawattamie County, not Washington County.

Dang it...I hate when I mess up.

I'll get me coat...
 

cm205

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Dec 28, 2008
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And looking back, TG 109 'appears' to be a DCSO secure channel. But, I've only got 52 hits on it since December 2019. That doesn't mean much because I swap my logger in and out randomly between Douglas and Sarpy County. The RIDs I have logged are between 6025 and 6259 with a singleton at 9956 (which still matches with DCSO). No dispatch related TGs on there, at least to my monitoring...
Yes, 109 appears to be the equivalent OPD-like secure tac channel for DSCO. Seems to hint at a new construct to provide a precinct secure tactical channel.

I also saw the OPD secure channels were added to the DB this week, but have now been removed.
 

ORION_NE

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Dodge, NE
Each precinct has had a secure dispatch for 5 years now when OPD purchased APX radios. DCSO and rural LE agencies got secure dispatch channel and secure info, along with other secure talk groups, when they got their APX radios.
 

cm205

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Dec 28, 2008
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Have been monitoring the OPPD sites lately looking for a few outstanding talkgroups, and have noticed 211 (previously noted as 'Metro Encrypted') seems to pop up a lot on those sites on a regular basis, unlike other law enforcement talkgroups. Not quite sure what that means, other than it seems to be used a lot.
 

ORION_NE

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Dodge, NE
Metro talk groups should be able to be used on OPPD sites. Most other public safety talk groups are not allowed on OPPD sites. If a user is using say an LE Event talk group the radios attempt to affiliate to an OPPD site would be denied.
I don't know which talk groups or radios are or not allowed to affiliate to OPPD sites.
I believe on the radio it will say "NO COMMS"
 

cm205

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Messages
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Metro talk groups should be able to be used on OPPD sites. Most other public safety talk groups are not allowed on OPPD sites. If a user is using say an LE Event talk group the radios attempt to affiliate to an OPPD site would be denied.
I don't know which talk groups or radios are or not allowed to affiliate to OPPD sites.
I believe on the radio it will say "NO COMMS"
Thanks, that’s great information. I noticed Metro 1 was being used on the OPPD tower I was monitoring as well, which is consistent with your observations. Would be nice if the OPPD sites were annotated as such in the DB to split them out from the LE sites that carry the bulk of the traffic.
 
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