SDS100 Colored Text VS Battery?

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WoodburyMan

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So what is different about the FL vs the DB?
@WoodburyMan can explain it better , it's his list. But as far as I know the only difference is everything except the control channel was removed from each system.

Though I tried creating a list on FreeScan for the 325p2 this way and it still didn't work so maybe something else was also done to the list. If he sees I tagged him here he will respond.
Background:
The problem with CLMRN is we have many many repeater sites in a very very tiny state. There are 17 sites currently (What's in the Database, plus Sharon site that has yet to be mapped and added to database).

The way Radio Reference, and the Uniden Database which it pulls from RR for, it loads any sites it thinks *may* be in range of your Zip. The locations for each site are static locations in their general area of broadcast, extended out in a 25mi radius circle. Roughtly 2,000sqmi. CT is only 5,500sqmi. That's A LOT of overlap. (Likewise, we use Simulcast Sites, so say Troop L has several transmitters in multiple locations broadcasting the same frequencies at the same time, so their locations are a bit more ambiguous are are hard to confine to a circle or square area). Add to that, the terrain. If it was flat, the repeaters all work 25mi range, but the database has no was to figure out what you're *really* in range of due to hills and such. The way the DB works, it thinks you're in range of at least like 8 of the 17 sites any given time. So it tried to scan all of them. Sometimes, if you're not using location, it will scan all 17 sites. THIS IS A LOT OF SCANNING. Each site has anywhere from 6 to 14 frequencies it uses, one is a Control Channel, the rest of voice/data channels. If the scanner doesn't find a siginal on the Control Channel for that site, it will scan ALL other frequencies. Currently, all 17 sites have at least 65 frequencies. So if you're only in range of one site, its scanning 64 other frequencies it doesn't need to, meaning it takes a good amount of time (10 seconds sometimes+) to loop around and scan, so you will miss the majority of transmissions since they're shorter than 10 seconds.

Likewise, most newer Scanners have "Trunk Tracking" meaning, instead of scanning each sites 6 to 14 frequencies, you really only need to scan it's Control Frequency. It can "read" the data being broadcast there to find if a TalkGroup you want to listen to is broadcasting on one of the sites other frequencies, and your radio will tune to that frequency even if its not in your favorite list.

The Fix:
Go through, find out what site is in your currently area. What one picks up the strongest signal, or even just what sites come in. Once you have that, go through and edit your list and "Avoid" or Delete the other sites. This will prevent your scanner from scanning them. Depending on your Model Scanner, you can also go through and delete all but the control channel frequencies for that site (listed in red here Connecticut Land Mobile Radio Network (CLMRN) Trunking System, Statewide, Connecticut - Scanner Frequencies ). This helps, but be aware if something changes, and the site switches over to the Alternate Control Channels (I have seen this when transmitters / antennas get damaged) you will need to update your list. For ease of use.. I keep a copy of the site with all frequencies entered, but avoided, in my favorites list. Then if I dont hear something, I can un-avoid the other site on the fly quick, and hear stuff.

You can see here my list, with all sites but Troop L Simulcast CC avoided. This is for scanning on Home where I just do Troop A and Troop L, as well as a few statewide, Talk Groups. Works for me. I can pickup I and A in Woodbury too, and partial of H and G, but leave those avoided to cut down on scan time. I enable them if I go "Talk Group Hunting" in discovery mode sometimes.


8055180552
 

darkness975

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Background:
The problem with CLMRN is we have many many repeater sites in a very very tiny state. There are 17 sites currently (What's in the Database, plus Sharon site that has yet to be mapped and added to database).

The way Radio Reference, and the Uniden Database which it pulls from RR for, it loads any sites it thinks *may* be in range of your Zip. The locations for each site are static locations in their general area of broadcast, extended out in a 25mi radius circle. Roughtly 2,000sqmi. CT is only 5,500sqmi. That's A LOT of overlap. (Likewise, we use Simulcast Sites, so say Troop L has several transmitters in multiple locations broadcasting the same frequencies at the same time, so their locations are a bit more ambiguous are are hard to confine to a circle or square area). Add to that, the terrain. If it was flat, the repeaters all work 25mi range, but the database has no was to figure out what you're *really* in range of due to hills and such. The way the DB works, it thinks you're in range of at least like 8 of the 17 sites any given time. So it tried to scan all of them. Sometimes, if you're not using location, it will scan all 17 sites. THIS IS A LOT OF SCANNING. Each site has anywhere from 6 to 14 frequencies it uses, one is a Control Channel, the rest of voice/data channels. If the scanner doesn't find a siginal on the Control Channel for that site, it will scan ALL other frequencies. Currently, all 17 sites have at least 65 frequencies. So if you're only in range of one site, its scanning 64 other frequencies it doesn't need to, meaning it takes a good amount of time (10 seconds sometimes+) to loop around and scan, so you will miss the majority of transmissions since they're shorter than 10 seconds.

Likewise, most newer Scanners have "Trunk Tracking" meaning, instead of scanning each sites 6 to 14 frequencies, you really only need to scan it's Control Frequency. It can "read" the data being broadcast there to find if a TalkGroup you want to listen to is broadcasting on one of the sites other frequencies, and your radio will tune to that frequency even if its not in your favorite list.

The Fix:
Go through, find out what site is in your currently area. What one picks up the strongest signal, or even just what sites come in. Once you have that, go through and edit your list and "Avoid" or Delete the other sites. This will prevent your scanner from scanning them. Depending on your Model Scanner, you can also go through and delete all but the control channel frequencies for that site (listed in red here Connecticut Land Mobile Radio Network (CLMRN) Trunking System, Statewide, Connecticut - Scanner Frequencies ). This helps, but be aware if something changes, and the site switches over to the Alternate Control Channels (I have seen this when transmitters / antennas get damaged) you will need to update your list. For ease of use.. I keep a copy of the site with all frequencies entered, but avoided, in my favorites list. Then if I dont hear something, I can un-avoid the other site on the fly quick, and hear stuff.

You can see here my list, with all sites but Troop L Simulcast CC avoided. This is for scanning on Home where I just do Troop A and Troop L, as well as a few statewide, Talk Groups. Works for me. I can pickup I and A in Woodbury too, and partial of H and G, but leave those avoided to cut down on scan time. I enable them if I go "Talk Group Hunting" in discovery mode sometimes.


View attachment 80551View attachment 80552

I knew you would be able to better explain it haha.

Truth be told I haven't had the time to try and create a list that mimics it for the 325p2. It might work if I ever got around to it...
 

WoodburyMan

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Dec 9, 2017
Messages
378
Location
Southington, CT
I knew you would be able to better explain it haha.

Truth be told I haven't had the time to try and create a list that mimics it for the 325p2. It might work if I ever got around to it...
Yeah.. the 325P2 I don't think has the same Trunk Tracking the SDS100/200 have. I have to program my Home Patrol II, which I think is the same generation(?), to scan all the frequencies in the site. I still Avoid all other sites, but it's not as good scanning large P25 trunked systems as the ones with good trunk tracking like the SDS series. I also leave those lists with the "All Frequency" listings in it so I can export them out of Sentinal for my SDS's, and import it into the Sentinel for my Home Patrol II, and just reverse the avoids in my list and be done with it! Although these days, my HP II is used to just monitor Southington analog. It works better on Analog than my SDS's by far although I can pick up their analog VHF even with the short Remronix 800/700 MHz antenna just fine on my SDS100 indoors which in theory shouldn't work that well.
 

darkness975

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Yeah.. the 325P2 I don't think has the same Trunk Tracking the SDS100/200 have. I have to program my Home Patrol II, which I think is the same generation(?), to scan all the frequencies in the site. I still Avoid all other sites, but it's not as good scanning large P25 trunked systems as the ones with good trunk tracking like the SDS series. I also leave those lists with the "All Frequency" listings in it so I can export them out of Sentinal for my SDS's, and import it into the Sentinel for my Home Patrol II, and just reverse the avoids in my list and be done with it! Although these days, my HP II is used to just monitor Southington analog. It works better on Analog than my SDS's by far although I can pick up their analog VHF even with the short Remronix 800/700 MHz antenna just fine on my SDS100 indoors which in theory shouldn't work that well.

My HPII only monitors a small amount of analog sites, like Southbury , Woodbury, Newtown, and a few others. Even LCD Dispatch comes in poorly on it so I locked it out and just use the SDS200 and BCD325P2 for that. It might be the antenna, it's a diamond srh789, but it's more likely just that it does not handle the systems as well and the topography in my location does not help either.

I have a Comet BNCW100RX on my SDS200 , fully extended, and LCD Dispatch and CMED come in a lot better.
 
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which I think is the same generation(?),
The 325P2 came out after the HPII and does an excellent job of Control Channel only Trunk Tracking (If programmed properly)

"This scanner became available to the market in April 2015. "

I'd put the 325P2 up against ANY scanner for reception.
 
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jonwienke

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The way Radio Reference, and the Uniden Database which it pulls from RR for, it loads any sites it thinks *may* be in range of your Zip. The locations for each site are static locations in their general area of broadcast, extended out in a 25mi radius circle.

Actually that's not true. You can set any value for a site range between 1 and several hundred miles. 25 miles may be the default site range value, but it is certainly NOT the only one allowed. Instead of locking out sites manually, the correct fix is to decrease the site Range settings to match their actual coverage areas. The scanner will quit looking for sites out of reception range, and Location Control will still work when scanning from a vehicle. Manually locking out sites is a kludge.

If you're referring to the scanner Range setting, 25 miles is not the default, and you should never set it that high under normal circumstances. You should set the scanner Range value to zero to not add to the site ranges if the scanner is scanning too much stuff. Having the scanner Range set to 25 miles will scan stuff out of range pretty much everywhere. Just don't.

Yeah.. the 325P2 I don't think has the same Trunk Tracking the SDS100/200 have. I have to program my Home Patrol II, which I think is the same generation(?), to scan all the frequencies in the site.

It uses the same algorithms as any other Uniden scanner to scan P25 systems.
 

WoodburyMan

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Actually that's not true. You can set any value for a site range between 1 and several hundred miles. 25 miles may be the default site range value, but it is certainly NOT the only one allowed. Instead of locking out sites manually, the correct fix is to decrease the site Range settings to match their actual coverage areas. The scanner will quit looking for sites out of reception range, and Location Control will still work when scanning from a vehicle. Manually locking out sites is a kludge.

If you're referring to the scanner Range setting, 25 miles is not the default, and you should never set it that high under normal circumstances. You should set the scanner Range value to zero to not add to the site ranges if the scanner is scanning too much stuff. Having the scanner Range set to 25 miles will scan stuff out of range pretty much everywhere. Just don't.



It uses the same algorithms as any other Uniden scanner to scan P25 systems.
I wouldn't say it's not true. It's another way going about it. Much EASIER way for sure. For other systems with larger Simulcast ares, sure.

I have tried messing with Location Aware lists, using GPS on my HP II and SDS100. It doesn't well well, and even if you could get it to work well, It's way to much effort for one system. Maybe just this particular system, cramming 17 sites into 5,000mi² with overlapping zones and random towns.. doesn't work. Our counties here are tiny, the size of single towns elsewhere, and each one has at least 2 simulcast sites, some 5+. Using RR or Unidens Square/Circle settings just plain don't work unless you set them to large areas. There's weird notches and lines for coverage areas where certain sites have primary simpler coverage area, but then sticks out 30mi to cover a particular set of highway state police from one area covers. Then there's several fill in site repeaters that overlay onto Simulcast sites to cover in some hilly terrain. By design any one location has SEVERAL sites in range which slows down scanning. It also depends on your traffic. There's fill in sites for specific towns on this system, that only carry specific TG's. Ex on CLMRN "Naugatuck" overlays into Troop I Simulcast Site, but only carries Metro Transit Authority Talk Groups, "Oly Lyme" just carries DEEP and one State Police group. So I ignore those mostly completely if I want State Police only. Basically by design even with Location Aware lists, you're covering way to many sites to be useful. For mobile usage for this system I just resort to making a list with all primary sites, with CC's only in the list, and let it scan. Just looping 12 or so frequencies is VERY fast as opposed to 65+. Set it, forget it. And even if you didn't want to knock out all but the CC's, simply clicking "Avoid" on all sites but your primary, or using Site Lock, is way easier than having to edit and figure out the correct Radius settings for each site.. which the DBA's for RR decided to hard to do as well.

For home stationary use, completely different story. For that, you really really should do it this way with killing off all sites but your local, and killing all frequencies but the CC's and maybe ACC's. Fastest loop time and you can really design your lists around what you want to cover.
 

jonwienke

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If you use rectangles to define site coverage, you can define multiple rectangles per site, and account for weird-shaped coverage areas that way. It's more hassle to set up, although ProScan lets you draw/edit location/coverage rectangles and circles on a Google map, which makes the process a lot faster and more intuitive. And then Location Control will work properly when scanning mobile.
 

WoodburyMan

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If you use rectangles to define site coverage, you can define multiple rectangles per site, and account for weird-shaped coverage areas that way. It's more hassle to set up, although ProScan lets you draw/edit location/coverage rectangles and circles on a Google map, which makes the process a lot faster and more intuitive. And then Location Control will work properly when scanning mobile.
I was unaware ProScan allowed you to do that... I use their editor to make live remote changes to my SDS200 via FTP but that's about it. Was unaware it had that map feature. That MAY be worth looking into if its a simple click on a map deal with multiple zones vs entering data manually like in Sentinel, which was totally not worth the time trying to do. I'll give it a go and dust off my GPS for fun. For stationary though.. a set list/site with a specific single site is still the best though, unless you need access to multiple sites for specific talk groups each one has that the other doesn't.
 

jonwienke

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That MAY be worth looking into if its a simple click on a map deal with multiple zones vs entering data manually like in Sentinel, which was totally not worth the time trying to do.
It's well worth it. Dragging circles/rectangles on a map is a lot faster, easier, more intuitive, and user friendly than filling out the spreadsheet in Sentinel.
 

K9DUO

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I seem to get a little more time using the black and white display.
My question is, how long is everyone getting out of a full charge. I have the new larger battery and Im only getting 4 or 5 hours before it dies. Is this pretty normal?
 

RandyKuff

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SDS100 - Large battery... Color display... Display backlight on...
A little over 7 hours runtime... Depending on activity...

FYI - The display is running all the time. You just don't see it without the backlight or the sunlight hitting it
just right...
 

KK4JUG

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SDS100 - Large battery... Color display... Display backlight on...
A little over 7 hours runtime... Depending on activity...
That's about what I get. And, if the previous numbers are right, you will get more time from the battery with the B/W display. Probably a minute or two.
 

RandyKuff

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When mine is used indoors... It's powered from USB too...
Outside... 7 hours is more than enough for me...
If I need longer time I plug a USB powerbank into it...

Powerbank I use...

 
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KevinC

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