Yagi for WX radio

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philkoz

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I live in a fringe NOAA Wx radio area & am thinking about a beam to increase reception. My only real problem is that I'm in an attached condo, but I DO have limited attic access (which is where my other 2 antennas are). I've researched dozens of sites with antennas ranging from $70-$250. Any suggestions on an effective antenna (assembled or homebrew) not too large (over 5 ft longest element) ??
 

Al42

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djeplett

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Cool links, Al42. They didn't say what the gain is on a 2 el quad. What is the typical gain?

I think I may build something like the first link.
 

philkoz

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Wow, thanks again for the help. Looks like I'll be busy this weekend !! :lol:
Forgive my ignorance, Al42, but could you briefly explain what formula you used for your measurements ? I'm coming up with some outrageous numbers so its obvious I have something switched..... :shock:
 

kb2vxa

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Hi guys,

A 2M Yagi will NOT perform properly on VHF WX frequencies or any other outside the band it's designed for. ONLY when the elements are cut to proper length and spaced properly acording to the frequency it's intended for all of it's electrical characteristics, most importantly gain and directional pattern become extremely unpredictable.

Commercial Yagis made for the purpose are available at a price (;->) so your best bet is to get a Radio Amateur Handbook and do the math. There are several construction projects in the antenna section and in the VHF Antenna Handbook but they're for the ham bands, what you want to look at are the formuli for calculating the proper dimensions. I'll bet you can make one with a wooden dowel and some coat hangers, it's been done before. Since the band you want is extremely narrow you don't have to use tubing to broaden it. (The larger the diameter the broader the bandwidth.)

Then again you can always use the Internet and get all the info on the weather you want, every TV station, the NWS, NOAA, weather.com and many others give you the current outlook, forecast and radar images. On the other hand they won't sound an alarm like a Weatheradio does so then you'll need a good antenna.

Now here's a thought, why don't you have a transmitter within range of an ordinary receiver and antenna? NOAA has been filling the holes in the coverage areas with more transmitters on more VHF frequencies, some at the top of the AM broadcast band and various frequencies in the standard FM broadcast band too. Maybe you should tell the boffins at NOAA that your area is without proper coverage.
 

philkoz

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Thanks 'vxa'.....

I actually messed around building a 3 element beam cut for the WX freq (thanks again 'djeplett'). Works well, but still having a problem I don't think 'I' can solve. I'm in a northern suburb of Detroit. about 40 miles from the WSO xmitter that only pushes 330W. I'm in a pretty low area, near Lake St.Clair. The beam actually picks up the 500W WSO in Cleveland on the same freq better than my local xmitter. My local NWS Coordinator says they have been fighting for years (our gov't ??) to up the power, but can't because of our close proximity to Canada causing interference....???? They have added a few add'l xmitters but my co. isn't covered. Any other ideas ????? :shock:
 

djeplett

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Can you pick up any of the others near you, like maybe Flint on 162.475?

Are you trying to catch the closest station so you can use the S.A.M.E. alerts? Maybe stations a little farther away will still work...

Maybe you could ask this question in the Michigan forum also as there might be someone near you who had the same problem.
 

philkoz

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Actually, I can more easily pick up Flint, Sandusky & Angola, IN. Problem is my county is only covered by the Southfield xmitter, which is the only 1 I'm really having trouble with. I think if I get the beam up in the attic, I may be ok. Alot of it just involves interference from the 500W Cleveland xmitter just across Lake Erie from me. I may have to go with the 2 element quad that Al42 mentioned. If I can get a little more directional toward Southfield & away from Cleveland I should be fine. Of course theres always the option of moving closer to the transmitter... :?

And yes, it's mostly for the SAME alerting. I'm also subscribed to stormnow.com, which is a very good alphapaging service, so the Wx radio isn't real critical, it's just a personal quest now.... :D
 

Al42

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If you consider the Southfield transmitter to be at 0 degrees from you, what's the bearing to the Cleveland transmitter? It might be easier to drop Cleveland into one of the antenna's nulls than to get enough directionality to increase Southfield's signal enough to wipe Cleveland out. (There will be 4 nulls with a Yagi - 2 at 45 degrees off the front and 2 at 45 degrees off the rear. Or somewhere close to those angles for real antennas.)
 

MacombMonitor

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Here is an antenna calculator that will assist you in designing a diapole, a 3 element yagi, or a vertical.

http://bfn.org/~bn589/antenna.html

Experiment! Then when you get it all figured out, make me one too! I live not too far from you, and I have the same problem. Sometimes I listen to the weather from Selfridge Air Base. I'm thinking about putting up a few antennas outside in the near future.

Map of Michigan's NOAA Weather Stations:
http://www.michiguide.com/weather/noaa.html
 

philkoz

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Al42, funny you mention that. I was messing around with that this morning. Looked like maybe 30deg ?? Altho it looks closer to 40-45 deg on the map. Mornings are always interesting anyway, like WxDX... :eek: I was actually fading from Detroit to Cleveland to Grand Rapids on .550.
Each dropped off as u mentioned. Maybe this weekend I'll climb into the attic w/it and my R-5 and see if it'll do the trick.

Mac Mon, I wil definitely do that. I've got enough wire to build lots of antennas, and I'm in 'full experimental mode'. Glad I'm not the only 1 with this problem. I'm also considering going to my city and asking for a little space on the water tower for an antenna.....I WILL NOT BE DENIED !!!!! :wink:
 

philkoz

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Wx Radio Update

I received an e-mail from the WSO Coordinator yesterday & found out a couple of interesting things about our beloved Southfield Wx transmitter site....

Somewhere around a year ago, $$$ was supposed to be provided to replace the country's older transmitters. We were around 10th or 15th on that list (DTX is around 30 yrs old now). Given the speed at which Fed Gov't moves, that timeframe isn't too unusual. If in fact a new transmitter gets installed, problem should get better. The ACTUAL ERP is only 180W now, so replacing it and cleaning up the feedline/antenna should get it back up closer to normal. NWS says they've met their 95% coverage goal, so no new transmitter locations will be added.

So for now I guess we deal with it & keep our fingers crossed. More if I get it....
 
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