Please help Salem Fire has disappeared

[chris8997]

Last week I stopped hearing Salem Fire. They are on a Motorolla Type II system. I still hear every body else on the system just fine. When a Salem Fire talk group ID appears there is no sound and when checking to see whick freq. they are on it jumps back and forth between the contol freq. and another one not listed. I cannot even hear bits of them scanning conventionally. I called Uniden without much help. I've even called the fire dept. and they claim that nothing has chaged. I just don't understand why I can hear the building insp., parking enforcement, building maint. all on the same system with no problems just not the fire dept. I have a Uniden BCT8 and any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. If anyone else is having this problem please let me know. Please help! Thank you.

 

[DickH]

Last week I stopped hearing Salem Fire. They are on a Motorolla Type II system. I still hear every body else on the system just fine. When a Salem Fire talk group ID appears there is no sound and when checking to see whick freq. they are on it jumps back and forth between the contol freq. and another one not listed. I cannot even hear bits of them scanning conventionally. I called Uniden without much help. I've even called the fire dept. and they claim that nothing has chaged. I just don't understand why I can hear the building insp., parking enforcement, building maint. all on the same system with no problems just not the fire dept. I have a Uniden BCT8 and any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. If anyone else is having this problem please let me know. Please help! Thank you.

Ask in this group.
AttackORFire : Northwest Fire Radio Oregon/Washington

 

[joescanner]

Salem has recently completed rebanding. Find the (one or two) frequencies above 865.0000 and subtract 15.0000 from them (i.e. if there was a frequency 868.9875, change it to 853.9875) and see what happens.

Your scanner will need to be newer, and capable of being programmed for a rebanded 800MHz motorola system.

 

[joescanner]

And, Chris8997: A rebanding update is available for your scanner, the BCT8. See http://info.uniden.com/twiki/bin/view/UnidenMan4/BCT8FirmwareUpdate if you haven't already done it.

 

[chris8997]

Thanks for the advice. I've already updated the firmware and have the same problem. I'll try the different frequencies and see what happens. The other thing that I've noticed is when a fire talk group id appears, the freq. that it is trying to use 862.1125 is licensed to Nextel. Does that mean they have changed something? Thanks again for the help.

 

[DickH]

Thanks for the advice. I've already updated the firmware and have the same problem. I'll try the different frequencies and see what happens. The other thing that I've noticed is when a fire talk group id appears, the freq. that it is trying to use 862.1125 is licensed to Nextel. Does that mean they have changed something? Thanks again for the help.

Does that mean they have changed something?
That's what REBANDING means!
If you joined the group I reccommended, you would already have all the Salem freqs.

Here is the info.:
There are five 800 MHz licenses in the FCC database. Four are in the city and the fifth is in Marion county.

The trunked system comprises two licenses at 3 locations;
955 Downs Road S, 1895 Lowen St NW and 930 Chemawa Rd NE (Keizer).

WPSJ540
851.1250
851.4250
852.5500
852.8125
853.1000

WPKB609
856.4875
856.7125
857.4875
857.7125
858.4875
859.4875
860.4875

There are three licenses for conventional freqs.;
WQDY702 at Prescott Hill, 5155 Silverton Rd. NE (Marion county).
WQEG605 at two locations, Cottage at Union Streets and 1580 22nd St.
Both locations have the National and State freqs.
851.0125 8TAC90
851.5125 8TAC91
852.0125 8TAC92
852.5125 8TAC93
853.0125 8TAC94
851.3250 OROPS1
851.3875 OROPS5
851.7500 OROPS3
851.7750 OROPS4
851.8000 OROPS2
NOTE: The 8TAC and OROPS designations are the ones used in the Portland area.
They may be the same in Salem.

A single freq., 856.4375 is under license WNRL606.

 

[chris8997]

DickH
I understand the rebanding. What nobody has answered is the 862.1175. I dont see that on anyones lists. I have used ALL of the freqs. listed in the database and the freqs you have listed, but that doesn't change the fact I can't here them, although I can see there talk group id show up on the scanner. When the fire dept id shows up the only freq they're using is the 862.1175 which is licensed to Nextel not the city. I can still here everbody else on the system with the freqs listed just not the fire dept. Thank you.

 

[joescanner]

Thanks for the advice. I've already updated the firmware and have the same problem. I'll try the different frequencies and see what happens. The other thing that I've noticed is when a fire talk group id appears, the freq. that it is trying to use 862.1125 is licensed to Nextel. Does that mean they have changed something? Thanks again for the help.

Chris: Yes.

In addition to updating the firmware, you've got to set up a "custom 800MHz bandplan" for systems that have been rebanded.

I'm not sure exactly what the process for that is with the BCT-8, but the Uniden Wiki http://info.uniden.com/twiki/bin/view/UnidenMan4/BCT8FirmwareUpdate has instructions near the bottom.

 

[chris8997]

Thank for the help guys I think I've got this fiqured out. I'm still new at trunking and and don't quite understand it. Thanks again.

 

[WayneH]

What nobody has answered is the 862.1175.

FWIW, when you see a scanner trunking out to some frequency around 862MHz and it's not tracking properly it's because the system is using rebanded frequencies.

Since a system sends out a number code instead of an actual frequency in the case of rebanding the "codes" for frequencies around 862+ have been reused for the new rebanding frequencies.

 

[DickH]

... I can still here everbody else on the system with the freqs listed just not the fire dept. Thank you.

That seems strange. Perhaps its not really trunk-tracking, just scanning the freqs.
Anyway here are 4 things you can try. Make sure you use a new bank or delete everything from a bank before trying each thing.

First. If you have entered the Custom Band Plans previously suggested, try this set of freqs. These are the original freqs. rebanded, plus the 5 new freqs. that were licensed last October.
851.1250
851.4250
852.5500
852.8125
853.1000
856.7125
857.7125c
859.4875c
860.4875c

If it still doesn't work, try using the following band plans. These are used by the people
in Utah. Their state-wide system has many sites with various configurations of control
channels and these 3 configurations work there.
It is possible that the Salem system is somehow different from those in Utah. Let's hope not.

"NORMAL" CONTROL CHANNEL
Lo Chan Hi Chan Offset Base Freq Step
PLAN 1 0 439 0 851.012500 25.000
PLAN 2 440 559 440 851.025000 25.000

The control channel in some systems may somehow be different. If the above "NORMAL"
plans do not work, try entering them as below.
"ODD" CONTROL CHANNEL
Lo Chan Hi Chan Offset Base Freq Step
PLAN 1 440 559 440 851.02500 25.000
PLAN 2 0 439 0 851.01250 25.000

If the above two configurations do not work, try the following THREE Custom Band Plans.
Custom range 1 Lo base freq 851.3125 Hi base freq 854.0000 Offset 560 Spacing 12.5
Custom range 2 Lo base freq 851.0125 Hi base freq 861.9875 Offset 0 Spacing 25
Custom range 3 Lo base freq 851.0250 hi base freq 854.0000 Offset 440 Spacing 25

 

[GregFromOregon]

This is what Uniden put on their site as a band plan for standard rebanded systems.

Band Plan Base Freq (Lower) Base Freq (Upper) Offset Polarity Spacing
1 851.0250MHz 854.0000MHz 440 + 25 kHz
2 851.0125MHz 868.9875MHz 0 + 25 kHz

Dick, what do you mean by "normal" & "odd" control channel?

 

[DickH]

This is what Uniden put on their site as a band plan for standard rebanded systems.

Band Plan Base Freq (Lower) Base Freq (Upper) Offset Polarity Spacing
1 851.0250MHz 854.0000MHz 440 + 25 kHz
2 851.0125MHz 868.9875MHz 0 + 25 kHz

Dick, what do you mean by "normal" & "odd" control channel?

ODD, as in NOT normal or NOT standard (as in Uniden's band plans, above). There is something in the data in some control channels that is odd.
Also, if the Uniden "STANDARD" band plans do not work, simply enter #2 before #1.

 

[chris8997]

I got it to work! After updating the custom band plans from Uniden's web site it finnaly worked. Thanks again to every one who replied. I really appreciate the help. As I said I'm still new to this and was a bit confused when everything went crazy. It was very frustrating hearing everybody except the fire dept. Thank again for the help.

 

[joescanner]

Chris, glad to hear it.

Just because I had nothing really better to do today, I came down to Salem, and as I sit in front of the Amtrak depot, I am getting very good reads on both A Tower and B Tower and am verifying the listed frequencies.

 

[joescanner]

Last week I stopped hearing Salem Fire. They are on a Motorolla Type II system. I still hear every body else on the system just fine.

Just as follow-up/closure to this thread, the reason you can/could hear everyone except for Salem Fire is because the fire talkgroups are "steered" to a channel that is not tunable without the custom band plans required for rebanding (i.e. the frequency ends in '0' instead of '5'). If that frequency is already busy, then comms will filter out to the other freqs.

 

[8675309]

hi... i too am a little new to this trunk tracking. I followed your guy thread here, and a little confused. does applying the band updates below cure the problem in Salem? which band update do I use? thanks.

Band Plan Base Freq (Lower) Base Freq (Upper) Offset Polarity Spacing
1 851.0250MHz 854.0000MHz 440 + 25 kHz
2 851.0125MHz 868.9875MHz 0 + 25 kHz

 

[DickH]

hi... i too am a little new to this trunk tracking. I followed your guy thread here, and a little confused. does applying the band updates below cure the problem in Salem? which band update do I use? thanks.

Band Plan Base Freq (Lower) Base Freq (Upper) Offset Polarity Spacing
1 851.0250MHz 854.0000MHz 440 + 25 kHz
2 851.0125MHz 868.9875MHz 0 + 25 kHz

Which model scanner do you have?