Amateur Radio in Niagara Region: New MotoTRBO CAP+ System

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XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
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Mar 17, 2018
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80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
Hey Everyone,
I see that there's a lot of people posting pick-ups from their scanners of new/unidentified CAP+ systems in the Niagara Falls area. Though I know most of you are probably scanning for commercial purposes, I would like to let you all know that I myself and 4 other people are in the process of setting up an amateur radio multi-site CAP+ system with a total of 8 different frequencies. All the repeaters are currently operated under my callsign "VA3UEC" until further notice.

Currently, we are only testing the system between 3 locations which are as follows:
  • Site: 01 - Niagara Falls
    Frequencies:
    442.9875, 443.0125, 443.0375
  • Site: 02 - Hamilton
    Frequencies:
    443.0625, 443.0875, 443.1125
  • Site: 15 - Rapid Deployment
    Frequencies:
    443.1375, 443.1625
There are many reasons for us choosing Capacity Plus over conventional DMR. The biggest deciding factor was timeslots. As some of you may know, on a conventional system you are limited to 2. On a capacity plus system, the more repeaters on one site, the higher your count goes. For example, you can see 3 frequencies on "Site: 01". That's 6 different timeslots! In a dumbed-down version, this will allow 6 different channels (talkgroups) to talk at one time on the system. This will become extremely noticeable if someone is talking on say... Worldwide, North America, and the Ontario Crosslink but you want to have a conversation on Niagara Falls local.

Speaking of Talkgroups... there will be linked talkgroups that will allow people to talk across all repeaters in the system. There will also be local talkgroups for each site. We think that this is pretty self-explanatory as to why this could be useful.

However, there is one "downfall" to all of this. You will need a Motorola MotoTRBO radio in order to communicate on the system. However, I'm hesitant on calling this a downfall. If you've been on the BrandMeister servers before, you know how annoying it can be as there's no consistency in audio. You will find yourself constantly adjusting your volume. There's a possibility that this could prevent some of that. That was not me bashing BrandMeister either, as we do play on linking some of their talkgroups into the system.

Now you may notice the site titled "Rapid Deployment"... This site is a configuration of currently 2 SLR-5000 repeaters that can be deployed for emergencies, events, or event training purposes. This will stop us from utilizing up 2-4 timeslots on say "Site: 01" during an event within the city. These repeaters will be utilized a few times a year, but will not be on the air 24/7.

Although the system will eventually be opened to the public, during the testing phase of these repeaters, they will be locked down with full encryption. If anyone is interested in helping with testing, I would encourage you to email me at VA3UEC@Outlook.com. You must hold a valid amateur radio license issued by Innovation Science and Economic Development Canda (ISEDC) or the Federal Communications Commission (FCC).

ALL TALKGROUPS BELOW ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE AS WE WORK ON DEVELOPING THE SYSTEM!

System-Wide Talkgroups
DEC​
Mode​
Alpha Tag​
Description​
248TSYS: Wide-01General Use Talkgroup: 01
249TSYS: Wide-02General Use Talkgroup: 02
250TSYS: NetsAmateur Radio Nets
251TSYS: ARESAmateur Radio Emergency Services
252TSYS: CANWARNCanadian Weather Amateur Radio Network
253TeSYS: Emerg.System-Wide Emergencies
254TESYS: AdminsRepeater Administrators
255TESYS: BroadcastSystem-Wide Broadcast (All Call)

For those scanning, you should see the following talkgroups pop-up:
  • System-Wide: 254
  • System-Wide: 255
  • Niagara Falls: 01
  • Hamilton: 01
Anyways, that's all I have for now. I just thought some of you may be interested... especially if you see this randomly pop up. Merry Christmas to everyone and Happy Holidays to those who don't celebrate it. I will keep this thread updated as things go on and hopefully we will be able to submit this information into the database as an amateur radio trunked system in the near future.

- 73 de VA3UEC.
 

jaspence

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
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Messages
3,041
Location
Michigan
You must have a lot more repeater traffic in your area. I live within contact range of at least 4 DMR repeaters, and they are silent except for nets and infrequent other traffic.
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
You must have a lot more repeater traffic in your area. I live within contact range of at least 4 DMR repeaters, and they are silent except for nets and infrequent other traffic.

Sadly there isn't much traffic out this way either. We lost the very well-known VA3XPR machines due to inappropriate behaviors from other operators. However... we know there are many hotspots out there locally and it would be nice to have a decent system for people to use across the area. Especially for tourists who may want to come over and utilize DMR.

And we were ultimately planning further down the road when it comes to this system. We didn't want to set up a conventional system with only 2 timeslots if we ended up needing 16. Better to be prepared than to wish you did something a different way in the end. In fact... we even threw around the idea of MotoTRBO Capacity Max (DMR Tier III)... But talk about overkill?!
 

R0am3r

Salt Water Conch
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Joined
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Messages
727
Location
Oneida County, NY
A Capacity Plus system using full encryption on the amateur bands? Is encryption normally allowed (on the ham bands) in Canada?
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
A Capacity Plus system using full encryption on the amateur bands? Is encryption normally allowed (on the ham bands) in Canada?

We will be using full encryption until the system goes public… once the testing is complete.

However... There are currently DMR systems all around our area "on the ham bands" using encryption... Down here no one really seems to care.

We are just utilizing encryption for the time being so we can test the links on all the repeaters, then the links to BM and some TGIF which we plan on doing down the road too.

We didn’t want to have people jumping onboard thinking everything was operational and therefore putting unneeded stress on the administration team that work full time too. Or worse… we didn’t need some of the locals jamming or tying up talkgroups preventing us from being able to test. That’s literally the only reason.

Merry Christmas to you and your family from mine!
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
I received an email update from our self-titled "Talkgroup Coordinator" he has provided me with some up-to-date information that I figured I would share here.

We haven't bothered creating any "Rapid Deployment" talkgroups last as it's literally last on our priority list.​

Cap+ Talkgroup Updates-04.png
DEC​
MODE​
Alpha Tag
Description​
248DTSW: Wide-01General Use Talkgroup: 01
249DTSW: Wide-02General Use Talkgroup: 02
250DTSW: NetsAmateur Radio Nets
251DTSW: ARESAmateur Radio Emergency Services
252DTSW: CANWARNCanadian Weather Amateur Radio Network
253DTeSW: Emerg.Emergency Response
254DTESW: AdminsSystem Administrators
255DTESW: BroadcastSystem-Wide Broadcast (All Call)

Cap+ Talkgroup Updates-02.png
DEC​
MODE​
ALPHA TAG​
DESCRIPTION​
1DTNF: LocalNiagara Falls Local
2DTNF: TAC-01Niagara Falls Tactical: 01
3DTNF: TAC-02Niagara Falls Tactical: 02
4DTNF: TAC-03Niagara FallsTactical: 03
5DTNF: TAC-04Niagara Falls Tactical: 04

Cap+ Talkgroup Updates-05.png
DEC​
MODE​
ALPHA TAG​
DESCRIPTION​
1DTHM: LocalHamilton Local
2DTHM: TAC-01Hamilton Tactical: 01
3DTHM: TAC-02Hamilton Tactical: 02
4DTHM: TAC-03Hamilton Tactical: 03
5DTHM: TAC-04Hamilton Tactical: 04

NOTE: The only talkgroups IDs that can't overlap from system to system are the ones on the system-wide table. Other than that, each site will utilize the same number scheme to help cut down on the number of "Group Calls" created within the radios. For example, if I create a "Group Call" contact with the name "Talkgroup: 1" and the ID of "1", I can then assign that contact to both the "NF: Local" and the "HM: Local" channels.

I am not going to spam this thread with updates to the talkgroups and such, however... I will provide a link to a Microsoft 365 link where you can view all the changes and further information. We are in the process of setting that up now and will provide the link when the document is put together.
 

R0am3r

Salt Water Conch
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Messages
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Location
Oneida County, NY
Thanks for the feedback. I look forward to hearing about your progress with this project. I noted the most recent talk group post and the future MS 365 link. Maybe some day we can chat when I cross through from the Lewiston-Queenston bridge over to Sarnia to visit my son in Detroit.

Merry Christmas to you and your family.
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
Thanks for the feedback. I look forward to hearing about your progress with this project. I noted the most recent talk group post and the future MS 365 link. Maybe some day we can chat when I cross through from the Lewiston-Queenston bridge over to Sarnia to visit my son in Detroit.

Merry Christmas to you and your family.

Once it’s up and running you’re more than welcome to come on anytime you’re in the area. I have family and friends in Sarnia… in fact… I spend almost all of last summer out there with them at the Canatara Park.

It might not be out of the realm of possibilities to put a site out there. ;)
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
If you have an issue with what the OP is doing I suggest contacting the proper regulatory agency and discuss it with them.

I agree with this... please feel free to contact Innovation Science and Economic Development Canada (ISEDC) about this issue. They have my home address, phone number and email address they can reach me at if need be.
 

Muxlow

Super Secret
Joined
Aug 16, 2005
Messages
1,648
Location
Middlesex County
Once it’s up and running you’re more than welcome to come on anytime you’re in the area. I have family and friends in Sarnia… in fact… I spend almost all of last summer out there with them at the Canatara Park.

It might not be out of the realm of possibilities to put a site out there. ;)

We have a DMR repeater in Sarnia (444.7125 CC7) now on the DMR-MARC network. Linked on local to Chatham-Wallaceburg-Essex-Leamington-Windsor-McGregor and a back up repeater.

Most of our system is XPR83/8400's with 1 MTR3000 and a Hytera RD982. Only downside to your CAP+ system is that you HAVE to use Motorola gear. So that sucks as I've ditched all my Moto junk years ago for the better Hytera's :)
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
We have a DMR repeater in Sarnia (444.7125 CC7) now on the DMR-MARC network. Linked on local to Chatham-Wallaceburg-Essex-Leamington-Windsor-McGregor and a back up repeater.

Most of our system is XPR83/8400's with 1 MTR3000 and a Hytera RD982. Only downside to your CAP+ system is that you HAVE to use Motorola gear. So that sucks as I've ditched all my Moto junk years ago for the better Hytera's :)

That is also true. It's just like Apple and Android... once you're in their ecosystems... you're kinda' locked in there. Motorola has been doing that for many years now. I personally like their equipment and that's what I use almost daily over here... however, I work in hospitality and we use Hytera radios and they are slowly starting to grow on me that's for sure.

Thank you for letting me know about the DMR system out in Sarnia! The next time I am out that way I would love to check it out.
 

XBrandonEdwardX

Telecommunications
Joined
Mar 17, 2018
Messages
80
Location
Niagara Falls, ON
Good news this morning. We have been given access to put a site in Fort Erie and a site in Jordan Station. These won't be done until approximately the end of February or even March depending on how this new COVID-19 pandemic continues. I am looking forward to everyone who reached out to assist with testing.

So far things are on the right path and each site has a minimum of 4 timeslots. For those who may be curious, each site can have up to 16 total. We are still working on preparing a spreadsheet that will list all the areas, coverage, equipment, talkgroups, and the encryption codes will be on there too.

Once we have these other two sites up, I will resubmit the CAP+ system to the database administrators and hopefully, it will be put up there for all to use. However, I need your help! If you guys could suggest network names that would be great. We know that there's CanTRBO, Escarpment Repeater Association, DMR MARC, and so on... Any idea what we could call this network?
 
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