Best HF Receiver

[barchetta]

Tubes can't beat a DSP chip, but the chip does all the tuning for you and that's not much fun. With the tube you have to do the tuning with all the various tuning controls on the radio... much more fun to listen to than today's DSP radios... Very satisfying to dig out a weak SW signal by using all the various tuning dials and selectivity controls on the tube radio; , and they glow in the dark, heat my cold shack, and give a smell that is peculiar only to it. My guess (since I don't own either... yet) is that a Collins R390A or even a Hammarlund SP-600 that have been restored and aligned correctly would easily keep pace with any modern DSP radio in terms of sensitivity and selectivity... perhaps not with an SDR, but thats cheating LOL

SS radios from the 90's on back have to be tuned as well. My point was, if you read through this thread for top receivers, I dont see many tube radios if any. The reason I bought the nrd-525 is for the very reason you mention here. I love tube radios as well but if you want to fiddle with the knobs and switches like I do, based on my research, tube radios cant compete. The being said, its likely if I continue on with this hobby, my next radio will be tube.. if I cant listen to SW with it, it will be nice to DX the AM broadcast MW just to hear the warmth.

Im fully aware that Im going to have a hard time listening to what Im able to with my SDR. Thinking of adding a panadapter to my new radio.. I read the schematics and I know where I need to make the connection, right after the 1st mixer... I know it is cheating but considering the lack of stations able to be heard these days it might really help the old girl out.

I wish I could go back in time and have that shack you mentioned. Not to mention the civil people we back then.

 

[ratboy]

On your "new" 525, the main problem you could have a fair shot at having would be a dim display. Most of the time, all you need to do is enter 88888 as the frequency, so it illuminates all the segments of the flourescent display, and wait a while. I just left my 525 on all the time, with 88888 punched in and avoided having to be in the dark to see the display. DId you get the speaker for it? Don't expect too much from it, but it's light years better than the joke of a speaker inside the radio. I don't even see the point of that sad little speaker, unless it's just to test the radio out. I had two different speakers on my 525, the first was the stock one, then one I bought in Universal's parking lot in Reynoldsburg that had a blown speaker in it. I put a totally superior one in it, and added a high cut filter with a switch on the front. There was a ding in just the right spot for the hole for that little toggle switch to go in. I can't find a pic of my top setup, but it had the 515, the 96 ch memory, the JRC scope, and speaker, 525, the NV-88? speaker, the one I found in my crawl space, the modded one, my Yaesu FRG-8800, Kenwood R1000, a bunch of antenna switches, A Universal/Info-Tech M7000, a printer for that, a couple of monitors, one for my PC, and one for the M7000, an of course, my much missed Kenwood TS450SAT. I had the bug bad for a long time. Universal was a must visit place for me, starting in 1983 when I went in the first time. I was dead meat when I played with the display NRD-515.

 

[Token]

Based on my research, tubes just dont stack up to SS. Im glad it is working for you though. I think this thread is testament to that, you dont see much tube gear mentioned if any. Maybe if you overhaul them and bring them back to spec they are good though.

Re tubes not stacking up to SS, it is not an issue with "tubes", per se, but rather that technology in general and expectations change over time, and tube rigs tend to be _old_ and tired. So it really depends on what you mean by "stack up". A solid state rig is _not_ necessarily / inherently any more sensitive than a good tube radio. For example, the Sherwood list shows that the Collins 51S1 (a very early 1960’s tube radio) has a sensitivity of ~0.13 uV, while the Icom R-71A (a mid 1980’s solid state radio) is ~0.2 uV and the Drake R-8 (an early 1990’s SS radio) is ~0.25 uV (without preamp) or ~0.18 uV (with preamp).

The bigger problem is that features we find desirable today were just not a thing when tubes were king. Digital frequency readout, better frequency stability, limited filter selections (because each one was a physical filter), etc. Shortcomings that you had to put up with in those days because not doing so was not an option, today they are annoying and unnecessary.

This thread started with someone asking a question that included portables as well as desktops, and a specific price cap. While there are definitely tube portables, tube radios are not known for being light, compact, or long battery life. So when you say portable you kind of leave tube radios completely out of the equation. And the price cap mentioned may buy what was a very good tube radio, but not one that has been restored to "as new" performance.

There are more remaining high quality solid state rigs today then high quality tube radios. One is 50 years old and newer, and the other is 50 years old and older. There are fewer (in the same condition) of the older radios.

I love tube radios. But, if it is a listeners only / first / entry radio and they do not already have the skills to maintain one, a tube radio will not be my recommendation. Not because of any specific performance shortcoming of the tube rig, but because of features and probable remaining life span in the solid state rig.

T!

 

[barchetta]

On your "new" 525, the main problem you could have a fair shot at having would be a dim display. Most of the time, all you need to do is enter 88888 as the frequency, so it illuminates all the segments of the flourescent display, and wait a while. I just left my 525 on all the time, with 88888 punched in and avoided having to be in the dark to see the display. DId you get the speaker for it? Don't expect too much from it, but it's light years better than the joke of a speaker inside the radio. I don't even see the point of that sad little speaker, unless it's just to test the radio out. I had two different speakers on my 525, the first was the stock one, then one I bought in Universal's parking lot in Reynoldsburg that had a blown speaker in it. I put a totally superior one in it, and added a high cut filter with a switch on the front. There was a ding in just the right spot for the hole for that little toggle switch to go in. I can't find a pic of my top setup, but it had the 515, the 96 ch memory, the JRC scope, and speaker, 525, the NV-88? speaker, the one I found in my crawl space, the modded one, my Yaesu FRG-8800, Kenwood R1000, a bunch of antenna switches, A Universal/Info-Tech M7000, a printer for that, a couple of monitors, one for my PC, and one for the M7000, an of course, my much missed Kenwood TS450SAT. I had the bug bad for a long time. Universal was a must visit place for me, starting in 1983 when I went in the first time. I was dead meat when I played with the display NRD-515.

I was reading about the display last night. It can also be bad caps. Never heard of your 888888 idea..great idea! BUt I did read you can resurect a bad fluorescent display by upping the voltage slightly.. In the photo it was very bright so Im optimistic. I think Im gonna order a cap kit and do the caps for it.. it sounds to me based on your 888888 idea, that maybe not having proper voltage might kill them so rather than wait, I think I will just do it.


I have a speaker I want to try, its a old Sony that came with on of those desktop stereos.. only problem is that it has a tweeter.. so might not work well but Im gonna try it. It is in a nice wooden cabinet and about the same size as the JRC speaker you can buy for it.. I could do your switch mod to it to cut the tweeter or add a filter cap in it.

What about upgrading the speaker inside the unit? Something more efficient/sensitive? My desk space is very limited so Id like to get it working without an external. Maybe even a bigger speaker but same holes.. I dunno.. seems like there ought to be a way to make it sound good with the internal only.

So leaving it on with 888888 doesnt kill it? I figured it was an hours thing? I really wonder if your caps were bad.

 

[barchetta]

Re tubes not stacking up to SS, it is not an issue with "tubes", per se, but rather that technology in general and expectations change over time, and tube rigs tend to be _old_ and tired. So it really depends on what you mean by "stack up". A solid state rig is _not_ necessarily / inherently any more sensitive than a good tube radio. For example, the Sherwood list shows that the Collins 51S1 (a very early 1960’s tube radio) has a sensitivity of ~0.13 uV, while the Icom R-71A (a mid 1980’s solid state radio) is ~0.2 uV and the Drake R-8 (an early 1990’s SS radio) is ~0.25 uV (without preamp) or ~0.18 uV (with preamp).

The bigger problem is that features we find desirable today were just not a thing when tubes were king. Digital frequency readout, better frequency stability, limited filter selections (because each one was a physical filter), etc. Shortcomings that you had to put up with in those days because not doing so was not an option, today they are annoying and unnecessary.

This thread started with someone asking a question that included portables as well as desktops, and a specific price cap. While there are definitely tube portables, tube radios are not known for being light, compact, or long battery life. So when you say portable you kind of leave tube radios completely out of the equation. And the price cap mentioned may buy what was a very good tube radio, but not one that has been restored to "as new" performance.

There are more remaining high quality solid state rigs today then high quality tube radios. One is 50 years old and newer, and the other is 50 years old and older. There are fewer (in the same condition) of the older radios.

I love tube radios. But, if it is a listeners only / first / entry radio and they do not already have the skills to maintain one, a tube radio will not be my recommendation. Not because of any specific performance shortcoming of the tube rig, but because of features and probable remaining life span in the solid state rig.

T!

The query was: "What’s the best HF non SDR Donglr radio under $500" -This would exclude any Collins radio, even a basket case Well, that isnt true, you could find one at an estate sale, or garage sale where they dont know what they have. I agree, tube radios kind of exclude their selves for the same reason buying a Harley panhead bike is not realistic unless you know how to fix it on the road

 

[barchetta]

Anyone think these caps are decent?
NRD-525 Caps

 

[Token]

The query was: "What’s the best HF non SDR Donglr radio under $500" -This would exclude any Collins radio, even a basket case Well, that isnt true, you could find one at an estate sale, or garage sale where they dont know what they have. I agree, tube radios kind of exclude their selves for the same reason buying a Harley panhead bike is not realistic unless you know how to fix it on the road

But, in their second post the OP said "Probably a portable but would prefer a desktop".

Yeah, a $500 cap will exclude most good (above entry level), truly refurbished (not just recapped), tube radios, anything that has honestly been returned to "as new" performance.

When I read the OPs questions I never really seriously considered a tube suggestion, even though I like them myself. Realistically, unless you can do the work yourself or have someone you trust that can do the work, tube radios are old enough that they are potentially more effort than many people want. Dealing (correctly) with something like silver mica disease is either tedious or expensive.

Your panhead analogy is pretty much on the money. A few years ago (just pre-COVID) I drove one of my 1961 Triumph TR-4s across country. It turns out that because of my work on the car before the trip I had almost no issues during, but if I was not prepared to address most possible problems I would not done the trip. The next planned trip will be in something a bit older.

T!

 

[RufusDawes]

Seems like the market is softening some for the vintage SS market, prices have come down now around $500 for the R75, 525, R-5000, and R8-A/B.... the higher end tube SW receivers are still up.

 

[barchetta]

Seems like the market is softening some for the vintage SS market, prices have come down now around $500 for the R75, 525, R-5000, and R8-A/B.... the higher end tube SW receivers are still up.

Funny, I noticed that the other day. I bought at the worst time.. oh well, life is short.

 

[ratboy]

I was reading about the display last night. It can also be bad caps. Never heard of your 888888 idea..great idea! BUt I did read you can resurect a bad fluorescent display by upping the voltage slightly.. In the photo it was very bright so Im optimistic. I think Im gonna order a cap kit and do the caps for it.. it sounds to me based on your 888888 idea, that maybe not having proper voltage might kill them so rather than wait, I think I will just do it.


I have a speaker I want to try, its a old Sony that came with on of those desktop stereos.. only problem is that it has a tweeter.. so might not work well but Im gonna try it. It is in a nice wooden cabinet and about the same size as the JRC speaker you can buy for it.. I could do your switch mod to it to cut the tweeter or add a filter cap in it.

What about upgrading the speaker inside the unit? Something more efficient/sensitive? My desk space is very limited so Id like to get it working without an external. Maybe even a bigger speaker but same holes.. I dunno.. seems like there ought to be a way to make it sound good with the internal only.

So leaving it on with 888888 doesnt kill it? I figured it was an hours thing? I really wonder if your caps were bad.

I changed the caps on mine and it had no effect at all. I just started leaving it on all 8's. If I let it sit for a long time, it takes many hours to brighten up to the point you can see it in a daylit room. (The receiver was on for many many years without being turned off. I just disconnected the antennas during storms). I had one of the first run of 525's (had VERY slow fine tuning mode, which was resolved with a chip change) I bought used at Universal in 1987, and sold it to buy my satellite dish. I bought a really late one in maybe 1991, and I still have it.

The speaker is worth a try, it won't hurt anything and you can cut the tweeter off with a switch. The internal speaker is super tiny, and I suppose you could possibly upgrade it, but it's easier to add and experiment with an external one. I don't think there is enough room inside to fit a much bigger speaker, if there is any. I can't remember how much room is in there. Not too much, I would guess. I just assumed the internal speaker was for testing, nothing more.

I guessed right, there isn't much room to go to a bigger diameter speaker without getting real close to the stuff on those PC boards. The speaker is obviously going to go on the left side of the radio as it's backwards. That 525 is loaded with the converter and everything.

My 525 has literally thousands of hours on it. Only mods are the Kiwa "ultimate rejection" filter, and the cap change. I think when I did it, JRC didn't have the caps so I just bought them at Digi-Key.

 

[ratboy]

Nichicon is good stuff.

 

[barchetta]

I changed the caps on mine and it had no effect at all. I just started leaving it on all 8's. If I let it sit for a long time, it takes many hours to brighten up to the point you can see it in a daylit room. (The receiver was on for many many years without being turned off. I just disconnected the antennas during storms). I had one of the first run of 525's (had VERY slow fine tuning mode, which was resolved with a chip change) I bought used at Universal in 1987, and sold it to buy my satellite dish. I bought a really late one in maybe 1991, and I still have it.

The speaker is worth a try, it won't hurt anything and you can cut the tweeter off with a switch. The internal speaker is super tiny, and I suppose you could possibly upgrade it, but it's easier to add and experiment with an external one. I don't think there is enough room inside to fit a much bigger speaker, if there is any. I can't remember how much room is in there. Not too much, I would guess. I just assumed the internal speaker was for testing, nothing more.

I guessed right, there isn't much room to go to a bigger diameter speaker without getting real close to the stuff on those PC boards. The speaker is obviously going to go on the left side of the radio as it's backwards. That 525 is loaded with the converter and everything.

My 525 has literally thousands of hours on it. Only mods are the Kiwa "ultimate rejection" filter, and the cap change. I think when I did it, JRC didn't have the caps so I just bought them at Digi-Key.

Really great info. Received mine last night. First thing I did was take the cover to make sure the cards were seated. I fired it up with a length of wire in the house.. heard nothing. I just moved my magnetic loop (cheap one) to where I want to use it (basically a room where I wont allow myself a computer at the moment) and now Im contemplating how I get the wire into the house. Somewhere I have a 2ft long drill bit for this purpose... I wish I had purchased a crimp on end for it so I could feed it through as I am super anxious.. I guess through the window for tonight with a towel stuck in it.

The look and feel is more or less what I had hoped for. I do wish the tuning knob had a heavier feel to it but it is good enough. It looks like someone added one filter, I assume CW. I need to figure out how to work a tool into the holes so I can remove the card..

I was thankful the seller used UPS rather than USPS.. it arrived in great condition.

 

[ratboy]

I haven't seen much difference in how the stuff arrives. Both USPS and UPS has mangled stuff so badly it's hard to imagine. Hopefully, the filter that was added is useful for something. The only times I used the CW filter was when I was doing narrowishly shifted RTTY in the old Info-Tech 600/6000/7000/8000 days. A couple of them I've seen had the KIWA ultimate rejection filter added, which is an improvement, the stock roofing filter on the 525 is pretty much a junk item.

Get a couple of small Phillips screwdrivers or any small steel rod, and grind off the tips, bend the last 1/4" 90 degrees and it's easy to just lever them out. The tool is on Ebay, if you want to go legit:

Pardon Our Interruption...

www.ebay.com

 

[ratboy]

Just in case you have any mystery issues, where you have squeals or it just seems to go deaf randomly, pull the cards, pinch the contacts with your fingers, and put the cards back in. My first one had the go deaf issue when I first got it, but I soon found out I needed to just barely press on whatever board it was to make it work again. I pinched the contacts and never had another issue with it while I had it, except the dim display. The 515's interconnect cables, something the 525 got rid of, caused me a lot of headaches. The crimped on plugs were a problem, so I soldered them all and the "ghost carriers" went away. Some gold plated sockets and plugs would have been a good thing in a radio as expensive as the 515 was back in '79 when it was first made.

When I sold my first 525 to a friend of mine, he was totally unimpressed. He said his Yaesu FRG-7 blew it away. I thought he was insane, but it was obvious the 525 somehow had a problem as soon as I brought it home to look at it. I never knew where on the one board it was, but I replaced pretty much every part on it, and it would randomly go deaf. Pushing on the bad card would make it work. I looked it over with a jeweler's loupe and founf nothing, resoldered everything, no improvement, so I went half on a used replacement card at Universal, and the radio was cured. He was impressed once it got fixed. Another friend has that 525 today, and it's still going strong at almost 40 years old.

 

[barchetta]

Just in case you have any mystery issues, where you have squeals or it just seems to go deaf randomly, pull the cards, pinch the contacts with your fingers, and put the cards back in. My first one had the go deaf issue when I first got it, but I soon found out I needed to just barely press on whatever board it was to make it work again. I pinched the contacts and never had another issue with it while I had it, except the dim display. The 515's interconnect cables, something the 525 got rid of, caused me a lot of headaches. The crimped on plugs were a problem, so I soldered them all and the "ghost carriers" went away. Some gold plated sockets and plugs would have been a good thing in a radio as expensive as the 515 was back in '79 when it was first made.

When I sold my first 525 to a friend of mine, he was totally unimpressed. He said his Yaesu FRG-7 blew it away. I thought he was insane, but it was obvious the 525 somehow had a problem as soon as I brought it home to look at it. I never knew where on the one board it was, but I replaced pretty much every part on it, and it would randomly go deaf. Pushing on the bad card would make it work. I looked it over with a jeweler's loupe and founf nothing, resoldered everything, no improvement, so I went half on a used replacement card at Universal, and the radio was cured. He was impressed once it got fixed. Another friend has that 525 today, and it's still going strong at almost 40 years old.

Im impressed that all the pots are like new.. not a crackle or anything out of them. They must have used some serious pots. I have any no issues that I know of so far.. all seems to work perfectly on HF. I dont have any antenna's yet for VHF UHF but not much interest at the moment.

Im really happy the display is bright. Im trying to understand if I should be leaving it on once in awhile or if it is best off. The idea the punching in 888888 and letting it run makes it brighter has my head spinning at the moment.

So far it has exceeded my expectations. its picking up anything my SDR does. I didnt expect that. Much to learn about it.

 

[pjxii]

Im impressed that all the pots are like new.. not a crackle or anything out of them. They must have used some serious pots. I have any no issues that I know of so far.. all seems to work perfectly on HF. I dont have any antenna's yet for VHF UHF but not much interest at the moment.

Im really happy the display is bright. Im trying to understand if I should be leaving it on once in awhile or if it is best off. The idea the punching in 888888 and letting it run makes it brighter has my head spinning at the moment.

So far it has exceeded my expectations. its picking up anything my SDR does. I didnt expect that. Much to learn about it.

I'm very happy with my 525 as well. Like yours mine has no pots that need cleaning and the display is nice and bright. I heard that these were very hiss heavy and was kind of expecting an ICOM IC-R70 experience but I also heard that later ones were not like that. Mine has a serial number over 52000 and sounds great.

 

[ratboy]

The first one I had was a lot more hissy than the later one I still have. There is a hiss, but I can't really hear it anymore, but when I still had a functioning right ear, I would just turn the speaker off axis and that got rid of it. I added the filter to the stock speaker half to cut treble/hiss and half to do something to cover up the ding in the front of it. The 525 is a great receiver, not the tank the 515 was, but it's performance is better than most of the competition in the same price class. Of all the recievers I've had, the only ones that equaled the 525 was my Gilfer modded 515, and the Shottky diode detector and associated circuits R71a, which won hands down for quiet background noise. It was kind of spooky hearing voices in the background clearly that the 515 and 525 couldn't hear well at all. You could tell they were there, but copy was about impossible. That R71a sounded fantastic, the changes made in the detector circuit cleared up all the grunge that R71a's were noted for, and with the FL44 filter, PBT was truly worth using as a tone control alone.

 

[pjxii]

Of all the recievers I've had, the only ones that equaled the 525 was my Gilfer modded 515, and the Shottky diode detector and associated circuits R71a, which won hands down for quiet background noise. It was kind of spooky hearing voices in the background clearly that the 515 and 525 couldn't hear well at all. You could tell they were there, but copy was about impossible. That R71a sounded fantastic, the changes made in the detector circuit cleared up all the grunge that R71a's were noted for, and with the FL44 filter, PBT was truly worth using as a tone control alone.

The R70 I had was an awesome receiver but that hiss just drove me to sell it. Would those R71A mods work for the R70? Do you remember what you did?

 

[RufusDawes]

yep the market is coming down, just picked up a Drake R8A for $375 on eVilbay... supposedly "works good", I'll post some pics after I put it through it's paces to determine if it is a keeper or going back to the seller...

the Drake R8 series is one of the best of the 1990s SW receivers. IMO the R8A is the best value of the R8 series, the R8B gets lots of praise but there is not much difference in the circuitry with A and B models, outside they look different.

 

[pjxii]

yep the market is coming down, just picked up a Drake R8A for $375 on eVilbay... supposedly "works good", I'll post some pics after I put it through it's paces to determine if it is a keeper or going back to the seller...

the Drake R8 series is one of the best of the 1990s SW receivers. IMO the R8A is the best value of the R8 series, the R8B gets lots of praise but there is not much difference in the circuitry with A and B models, outside they look different.

Awesome! I hope all is good with it, that's a great deal if so. I was always curious how the R8A did with NDBs on Longwave. Could you please give a report on that of you can?