Brightline Train

[batdude]

spent a few minutes and came up with this.

CAVEAT: I AM NOT VERY FAMILIAR WITH TRAIN MONITORING.

This chart shows the BRIGHTLINE ONLY (Not AAR freqs) that are exclusively licensed to Brightline.

I do not know if these are ALL of the Brightline freqs, but it's probably a very good start. Each freq is licensed for both analog and NXDN. I have only heard them operating in ANALOG (for now).

160.485 and 160.71 seem to be the only frequencies licensed for high power (base) operations.

This file is hyperlinked to the FCC website.

Enjoy.

 

[Bote]

I am very familiar with railroad monitoring.

As an operational necessity, all trains must use the same channel, whether freight or passenger or maintenance-of-way. Just imagine the chaos if they couldn't warn each other of approaching trains or dangerous conditions!

So monitoring BrightLine passenger trains is identical to monitoring FEC freight trains.

I've listed the important frequencies at the top of this railfan guide that is a schematic of the FEC Railway line between Jax and Miami.

FEC Railfan Guide

Track chart and notes to guide the railfan along the Florida East Coast Railway.

www.botecomm.com

They only talk when there's someone to address. FEC does not call signals as some other roads do, but they do announce their speed and which track they're on when approaching another train. You will also hear the defect detectors announce the status of a train after it has passed; some DDs are programmed to announce the number of axles which is helpful in knowing which freight rain it is. BrightLine trains all have 24 axles so that's a dead giveaway right there.

There is a good FB group called FECRS for the Florida East Coast Railway Society, which is the hobbyist group. You can pick some info there, although they spend an inordinate amount of time posting photographs of the same old trains.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

I would be interested in learning what mode they operate in Orlando because they have analog and various digital modes licensed.

 

[Bote]

They're still narrowband analog FM, although there's a strong rumor that they will switch to digital next month. So I need to figure out the best NXDN decoder that I can slap onto SDRsharp or else switch to something like OP25 if it will decode NXDN. I haven't really started that whole search in earnest, so suggestions are welcomed.

I'm hoping to set up some more feeds along the FEC once I figure that out.

 

[sflmonitor]

I have monitored 160.245 in Broward and 160.425 in Miami-Dade in NXDN mode. I don't recall specifics but both are Brightline-licensed frequencies. I was told that Brightline will be using two systems, one will be the regular analog railroad channels and the other will be a "company system" using railroad channels but in NXDN mode. This makes sense as there are two separate VHF antenna systems, located side by side, along the line, easily visible from State Road 528.

 

[Bote]

One set of antennas is for PTC (Positive Train Control) which operates in the 220MHz band, not too much shorter than antennas tuned for the 160MHz railroad band, so at a glance they might appear similar.

BrightLine might very well have "company" channels that they use for onboard services, but the actual railroad traffic must be on the road channel.

 

[W4KRR]

I monitored a couple of VHF high rail band frequencies in NXDN mode at the Fort Lauderdale Brightline station. Also, when the train pulled into the station, they talked to the station in NXDN mode on 160.530, which is the FEC road channel. Out on the road they used the same frequency in analog mode.

 

[sflmonitor]

One set of antennas is for PTC (Positive Train Control) which operates in the 220MHz band, not too much shorter than antennas tuned for the 160MHz railroad band, so at a glance they might appear similar.

BrightLine might very well have "company" channels that they use for onboard services, but the actual railroad traffic must be on the road channel.

OK, I can see there is a difference between the two antennas. Thanks for the update. It will be interesting to see how exactly they will be using the NXDN side of the house. Perhaps for onboard comms as well as comms with the stations when they are in range, similar to what Ken just mentioned?

 

[Bote]

The word I have from a couple reliable sources is that the whole railroad will switch to Icom radios presumably running in NXDN mode along the whole line, everywhere. That's all I know until we actually monitor them in use whenever it happens..

Seems like a needless expense and trouble to go through to "save" spectrum for...somebody? Cellular companies sure are not interested in 160MHz.

 

[Bote]

I have both FEC and CSX/SFRTA feeds in the Fort Lauderdale area on my streaming page. You can get a taste of the traffic now before they switch.

Bote's Streaming Audio

Bote's streaming Internet radio station feeds of railroad, fire, EMS, and police scanner audio from south Florida.

www.botecomm.com

 

[N4KVL]

The word I have from a couple reliable sources is that the whole railroad will switch to Icom radios presumably running in NXDN mode along the whole line, everywhere. That's all I know until we actually monitor them in use whenever it happens..

Seems like a needless expense and trouble to go through to "save" spectrum for...somebody? Cellular companies sure are not interested in 160MHz.

I'd bet on the motivation being able to utilize encrypted voice well before them being concerned about spectral efficacy.

 

[Bote]

The F.C.C. wants spectral efficiency, I have no idea what the Radio Shop wants, other than to shirk its duty. For example, it would be nice if they knew how to set audio levels properly. Encryption is always on the table these days.

 

[RadioDitch]

The word I have from a couple reliable sources is that the whole railroad will switch to Icom radios presumably running in NXDN mode along the whole line, everywhere.

Icom F-3261DT RR portables and F-5400D RR mobiles. Icom actually engraved and programmed too many for FEC, and now has slashed the unit price to dump them on dealers as B-stock.

I'd bet on the motivation being able to utilize encrypted voice well before them being concerned about spectral efficacy.

Encryption will never happen as it's already been ruled out by the American Association of Railroads. It would create too many issues with interchange and run-through. It's a dead issue. The reasoning for using NXDN (or IDAS in Icom terms) is because a digital protocol is the only viable option for effectively operating at 6.25kHz voice, which the AAR originally was told would be the next step after narrowbanding. That's now not happening, but some railroads are choosing to take advantage of the additional features of NXDN in some cases anyway.

 

[Bote]

Encryption will never happen as it's already been ruled out by the American Association of Railroads. It would create too many issues with interchange and run-through. It's a dead issue.

Good to know. I can see where basic key management would become a stumbling block, although for interchange they could just as easily communicate in the clear.

And although this particular radio shop claims that all radios are "compliant" I have heard quite a few that are obviously deviating to the full 5KC, so...not fully compliant. I guess they kinda gave up on that effort?

Upon further review, that 160.245MHz channel mentioned above is 15KC down from Tri-Rail's 160.26MHz dispatcher channel, so that was a poor choice out of the other 95 channels available. A real head-scratcher there. Elbow room for splatter, anybody?

 

[RadioDitch]

``

Good to know. I can see where basic key management would become a stumbling block, although for interchange they could just as easily communicate in the clear.

And although this particular radio shop claims that all radios are "compliant" I have heard quite a few that are obviously deviating to the full 5KC, so...not fully compliant. I guess they kinda gave up on that effort?

Upon further review, that 160.245MHz channel mentioned above is 15KC down from Tri-Rail's 160.26MHz dispatcher channel, so that was a poor choice out of the other 95 channels available. A real head-scratcher there. Elbow room for splatter, anybody?

Bote, you show me a railroad's radio shop anywhere in the United States that keeps their stuff actually aligned and I'll eat my shorts. I've still yet to ever see a CSX wayside base that was actually ON FREQUENCY.

 

[bravo14]

Look like yesterday someone got killed by a brightline train in st luice county. I saw this on the news a hour ago.

 

[Bote]

Yep, an apparent suicide.

I wonder how they expect to deliver **express** service when trains routinely have to stop and wait for hours for the Medical Examiner to get to the bottom of each and every train incident? I'd bet he has one of those comically large magnifying glasses to inspect every inch of rail for clues.

 

[bravo14]

Yep, an apparent suicide.

I wonder how they expect to deliver **express** service when trains routinely have to stop and wait for hours for the Medical Examiner to get to the bottom of each and every train incident? I'd bet he has one of those comically large magnifying glasses to inspect every inch of rail for clues.

I was reading on seems this is weekly with BL. I remember in the 90 into early 2000s people getting hit by FEC trains, either a person sitting on the tracks or a car/truck. I think they person operating the train(s) if a person or car/truck gets hit they send a crew out and take over not sure if BL does this.

 

[Bote]

Each operating employee can choose to continue or be relieved. I don't know if there are incentives for BL employees since I just learned they are not union; FEC freight are, of course, and I think can get the equivalent of "bereavement leave" for like 2 days off.

You can always tell where the trains will be: on the tracks.

Anyone on the tracks should expect the movement of trains from any direction, on any track, at any time - NS Operating Rule G.

 

[RadioDitch]

Anyone on the tracks should expect the movement of trains from any direction, on any track, at any time - NS Operating Rule G.

Not all minds are equal. -Darwin