AR5700D First impressions

[vince48]

I just ordered a 5700D. Let the fun begin . It will be interesting to compare it with the DV-1 and the IC-8600.

My friend, I really hope it works out for you. The poor gentleman who deserves better treatment that he has received for AOR so far. The very best of luck to you.

 

[palmerjrusa]

I use a program called Virtual Box to run XP from Windows 10. If you have a old XP disk laying around, virtual box will emulate an x86 system and let you install XP on Windows 10. I use it to run old 16 bit software like Scancat Gold and Butel's original AR8600 software.

Thanks, I may have an old XP disc stored away somewhere and give that a try.

 

[sub101uk]

When you receive your new 5700D please let us know what firmware is installed .If its still got the original Firmware main _912C D9N5D P912A or main_912C D0N1B P912A please get them to change it to the latest which at the moment is Main_101A D0N7B P008B .

If you have any of the old firmware installed get it changed before you receive the radio as this cannot be done by your self it has to be done by importer or AOR in Japan .

I cant speak about the service in the states but in the UK the firmware can be updated by the importer other wise it will be sent back to Japan and since the warranty is only 12 months by my radio going to Japan twice it took about 6 months off due to the radio being sent away twice .

When you have got your radio if you find any bugs please get it sorted out before the warranty expires because once your radio is out of warranty it will cost you .To have new firmware installed and to have my sensitivity checked the total bill including shipping was £175 thats $248 USD .
So we await your return with your 5700D but if I was you I would wait until they sort this out as its very clear there is a problem with some of the 5700D you might get lucky or you might end up with a nighmare like me .

If you are shopping around for the best price I found buying from Asia was about about £1200 cheaper the only draw back in doing the lack of support . As for my 5700D its all boxed up ready for its third trip to Japan . I will let the members know as I am sure AOR will come out with one of there fake news reports regarding the 5700D . All they need to do is up there quality control and if radios have a problem change them out and not attempt to repair it . My problems could have been sorted then if they had done that last year but we are 14 months on and the radio still has problems and now out of warranty I hate to think how much shipping is going to cost .

 

[MStep]

Besides the fact that AOR could potentially makes tons more money but not allowing the consumer to change the firmware on an out-of-warranty 5700 series, is there any other logical reason for this? Does the radio have to be partially disassembled to change the firmware? Perhaps the firmware is contained on a separate curcuit board within the radio, which might be an expensive piece that cannot be discarded and simply replaced? Or perhaps AOR is also changing other parts in the radio at the expense of the consumer? Did anyone ever get a clear handle on this ?

 

[sub101uk]

No the radio is not opened but the ports at the rear are used to load in the new firmware and from what the importer has told me each stage has to loaded next thing I was told was before they can upgrade they need to send a request to AOR in Japan for the firmware that is suitable for your ser number . It took about a week for AOR to reply to the UK importer all this takes time plus if your not under warranty cost. I have spoken to about 4 other AOR agents in Europe and its the same all over , All repairs are sent to Japan . Its a total closed shop and no third party engineers get a look in. Many of the AOR agents also told me that they do no upgrade radios that were not sold by them . Just go to the AOR web site and email some of the agents on there list .

 

[SigIntel8600]

When you receive your new 5700D please let us know what firmware is installed .If its still got the original Firmware main _912C D9N5D P912A or main_912C D0N1B P912A please get them to change it to the latest which at the moment is Main_101A D0N7B P008B .

Will do. I would bet that it will be shipped with the latest firmware, but we will see.

If you are shopping around for the best price I found buying from Asia was about about £1200 cheaper the only draw back in doing the lack of support . As for my 5700D its all boxed up ready for its third trip to Japan . I will let the members know as I am sure AOR will come out with one of there fake news reports regarding the 5700D . All they need to do is up there quality control and if radios have a problem change them out and not attempt to repair it . My problems could have been sorted then if they had done that last year but we are 14 months on and the radio still has problems and now out of warranty I hate to think how much shipping is going to cost .

I purchased from Ham Radio Outlet, HRO is an authorized dealer here. I have seen the 5700's on Ebay for sale that are shipped from Japan. While cheaper, I would be taking a risk and I would have no support if something is wrong.

 

[MStep]

No the radio is not opened but the ports at the rear are used to load in the new firmware and from what the importer has told me each stage has to loaded next thing I was told was before they can upgrade they need to send a request to AOR in Japan for the firmware that is suitable for your ser number . It took about a week for AOR to reply to the UK importer all this takes time plus if your not under warranty cost. I have spoken to about 4 other AOR agents in Europe and its the same all over , All repairs are sent to Japan . Its a total closed shop and no third party engineers get a look in. Many of the AOR agents also told me that they do no upgrade radios that were not sold by them . Just go to the AOR web site and email some of the agents on there list .

That is indeed a horrible situation for a radio with such a high price tag. If the firmware updates are somehow keyed to the serial number of the radio, it doesn't necessarily mean that they cannot provide the same information to the consumer; no doubt they have a special tool or device that only the dealers have to access the ports properly.

It would also seem to indicate that they have flip-flopped parts from one batch to the next of 5700's and that there is no standardization from unit to unit.

Have you been able to make any A/B comparisons between the AOR 5700 and the Icom 8600? I'm not sure what other radios you have--- I see SigIntel has both a DV-1 and an 8600, and we are all eagerly waiting for his comparison tests once his 5700 arrives. I certainly hope he has better luck than you.

 

[sub101uk]

Well the build of the IC-R8600 is far better than the 5700D just look at the scope however when it comes to what digital modes it receives the 5700D wins hands down .

It should be interesting to see what they say about the radio going deaf .But they made it very clear that they will not accept the report from the local independent communications pmr workshop because in there words " There not on the AOR approved test/service centres list. " So they will change the rules to sort themselfs .

But any one thinking of buying a 5700D should wait until this radio is more stable and since all repairs go to Japan the warranty should be 24 months and not just 12 because when my radio went to Japan twice before it took a total of 6 months or they reopen there service centries across the world like they did before .

But looking at the DV1 + DV10 facebook sites they are still having problems with these radios and the DV1 came out back in 2015 and the DV10 in 2018 . Not every DV1 or DV10 has problems but a few like me with the 5700D . But the only way forward in my case is change out the radio or just give me a refund .

At the moment on the facebook AOR 5700D we have 9 owners of 5700D a few of them have reported the odd cpu crash but nothing like what I am getting so you might get lucky .As for buying from asia yes its much cheaper when I was looking I contact a few companys and found the best deals were from Hong Kong + Singapore and yes a few are selling it from Japan . If the radio does have problems you may find it has to be returned to the seller . But yes its was about £1200 - £1300 cheaper . Which brings me to seller on ebay with the ID germangir2001 this seller claims to be in Singapore and I did buy a 5700D from him only to have him cancel the purchase 7 days later for no reason ? In doing more research this seller is not in Singapore but in Russia .

So good luck to any one buying a 5700D but its like playing russian roulette at the moment .

 

[MStep]

Well the build of the IC-R8600 is far better than the 5700D just look at the scope however when it comes to what digital modes it receives the 5700D wins hands down .

It should be interesting to see what they say about the radio going deaf .But they made it very clear that they will not accept the report from the local independent communications pmr workshop because in there words " There not on the AOR approved test/service centres list. " So they will change the rules to sort themselfs .

But any one thinking of buying a 5700D should wait until this radio is more stable and since all repairs go to Japan the warranty should be 24 months and not just 12 because when my radio went to Japan twice before it took a total of 6 months or they reopen there service centries across the world like they did before .

But looking at the DV1 + DV10 facebook sites they are still having problems with these radios and the DV1 came out back in 2015 and the DV10 in 2018 . Not every DV1 or DV10 has problems but a few like me with the 5700D . But the only way forward in my case is change out the radio or just give me a refund .

At the moment on the facebook AOR 5700D we have 9 owners of 5700D a few of them have reported the odd cpu crash but nothing like what I am getting so you might get lucky .As for buying from asia yes its much cheaper when I was looking I contact a few companys and found the best deals were from Hong Kong + Singapore and yes a few are selling it from Japan . If the radio does have problems you may find it has to be returned to the seller . But yes its was about £1200 - £1300 cheaper . Which brings me to seller on ebay with the ID germangir2001 this seller claims to be in Singapore and I did buy a 5700D from him only to have him cancel the purchase 7 days later for no reason ? In doing more research this seller is not in Singapore but in Russia .

So good luck to any one buying a 5700D but its like playing russian roulette at the moment .

I think the the thrust of the interest here for comparative purposes in not what the 8600 lacks in terms of digital modes. The question is more which receiver does a better job receiving with the modes that they have in common?

 

[sub101uk]

Cant help you with the the HF performance of the 8600 but I can compare the 5700D with my IC-7800 on HF using the same antenna a KLM36X there is not much difference in the signal strength .
The other good point about the Icom R8600 is its serviced local and does not have to be sent back to Japan plus I understand you can also upgrade your own firmware without having to return the radio .

The only thing in my opinion that lets the R8600 down is the lack of decoding digital modes if your happy with that then the IC-R8600 is the radio to buy . In the end its down to what your going to use the radio for , Listening on HF or monitoring digital signals on VHF+UHF the choice is yours .

 

[marlbrook]

The only thing in my opinion that lets the R8600 down is the lack of decoding digital modes if your happy with that then the IC-R8600 is the radio to buy . In the end its down to what your going to use the radio for , Listening on HF or monitoring digital signals on VHF+UHF the choice is yours

Sorry, still confused.

You say the Icom IC-R8600 cannot monitor digital signals on VHF+UHF?

You have posted more than once that the Icom IC-R8600 lacks the ability to decode Digital Modes.

It might make people wonder how Icom gets away with advertising that it has:-

Coverage: 10 kHz to 3000 MHz
Analogue Modes AM, USB, LSB, CW, FM, S-AM (AM synchronous detection mode)
Digital Modes: Baudot RTTY, D-STAR, NXDN, dPMR™, DCR (Digital Communication Radio) and Project 25 Phase I
and you say the (the R8600) User's choice is just "listening on HF , as it cannot monitor digital signals on VHF and UHF".

Certainly it 'lacks' DMR (a serious omission), and TETRA (often totally encrypted of course), but I was really under the impression one could 'decode' the Digital modes mentioned above.

Without a doubt AOR offer more Digital Modes on the 5700, AR-DV1 and AR-DV10, but the R-8600 has those shown above, and they seem to work?

I have been reading (and sometimes making supportive comments) on several Forums regarding your posts about your experiences with the 5700, and AOR's abysmal lack of support to you. I seriously wonder how anyone could even contemplate buying a 5700 in its present form, and all the dangers and costs of having to send it away for updating, servicing or even Firmware upgrades, not to mention its reliability.

However it is only right that anyone following these threads are aware that the Icom IC-R8600 does support several Digital Modes, as well as many Analogue ones.

 

[sub101uk]

Sorry your getting confusing but look at the attached spec of the R8600 and other scanners yes it lacks DMR and the rest just look at the rest that you cannot receive with the R8600 .

As for the problems with my 5700D its not all 5700D but I agree the R8600 is a far better receiver just look at the build however it lacks the digital modes that I and many other in the UK require as you said the R8600 dont even decode DMR let alone Tetra . Just look at the list what the R8600 will decode and wont compared with the DV1 , DV10 + 5700D .

 

[G7HID]

I wrote this a couple of weeks ago:
"To be honest if you are in the UK what other unencrypted digital modes are in regular use apart from DMR, NXDN, DStar and on USAF bases P25 ?"
An 8600 and a Whistler TRX1 or 2 would fill the DMR gap.

Mike

 

[marlbrook]

Thanks for the 'voice of reason' Mike. I totally agree with your comments regarding the un-encrypted Digital Modes in regular use in the U.K., and with the exception of DMR the R8600 covers them.

I am not 'pushing' the R-8600. Impressive as that Receiver is in many respects, Icom's obstinate refusal to add DMR is quite mad from a Retail perspective, and also contrary to Customers wishes.

Of course AOR also have their additional special 'Denial Mode' as well, when it comes to not admitting problems with any of their current Receivers.

What concerns me is anyone reading and believing posts that say the R8600 does not decode Digital Modes, and when comparing AOR and the Icom, especially intimating the User's choice is just "listening on HF , as it (the IC R-8600) cannot monitor digital signals on VHF and UHF". It does.

AOR's list of Digital Modes is impressive, however I wonder just how many people in Europe are ever likely to find and listen to un-encrypted signals from most of them. Still a nice achievement nevertheless, and all credit to AOR for including them.

I have no doubt adding TETRA was their cleverest 'ploy'. Indeed there are some un-encrypted TETRA signals, but the ones people want to hear will never be anything but 'Klingon', lol. Although I read someone (who actually owns a 5700) stating they had seen/heard TETRA being de-crypted. Since the base and mobile TETRA radios constantly check they are registered on the System before decryption can take place, that is not just a question of coming up with a clever algorithm, but also constantly fooling the Base that the Mobile receiver is and remains correctly registered.

Nevertheless, the Icom IC-R8600 is indeed an Analogue and Digital Receiver, irrespective of how many Digital Modes other Receivers might have.

 

[Ubbe]

Since the base and mobile TETRA radios constantly check they are registered on the System before decryption can take place, that is not just a question of coming up with a clever algorithm, but also constantly fooling the Base that the Mobile receiver is and remains correctly registered.

That's only related to how the system are supposed to work. I had a company demonstrate a tetra listener to me that had a special firmware in a tetra radio and it only monitored the signal and never transmitted. When loaded with the key for the national police they could listen to the decrypted TEA2 transmissions. But there has to be at least one actual tetra radio registrated to the same site that you are monitoring and that radio has to be in scan mode with that TG or have the actual TG selected.

/Ubbe

 

[SigIntel8600]

I'm hoping the 5700D will give me some relief from squinting at the tiny DV-1 display. I use the IC-8600's band scope to hunt down digital signals and then input the frequencies and decode them on the DV-1. The 5700D will give me the ability for stand alone bandscope work on the 5700D while utilizing the IC-8600 for simultaneous HF/VHF/UHF monitoring. The AR-IQ-III software that is INCLUDED as standard looks to be a plus. I also am also intrigued by the cyber search feature. I never in a million years thought a 5 kilobuck receiver would be in my wheelhouse, but it's on order and I'm waiting in anticipation to evaluate the 5700D. Can the IC-8600 decode unknown digital signals on the fly? Maybe, if you cycle through the digital modes that the 8600 has and get lucky while the signal is still active. The AOR auto decode mode beats the IC-8600 hands down for RF investigation.

 

[sub101uk]

At the end of the day yes I agree that the IC-R8600 is a far better build than the 5700D . The icom can be serviced in the UK , The firmware can be updated by the owner .Unfortunately the IC-R600 does not decode DMR , Tetra , Alinco , Yaesu Digital , D-CR P25 Phase 2 , NXDN Scrambled , 4800 , Yes I know that most of the above maybe not used in the UK but it still will decode them . For me without DMR its a none runner as most of the traffic in my area is DMR . So what would be the point in buying a radio that does not decode DMR . Like I said before its what are you buying for , Its a bit like buying a leatherman multi tool one tool does it all ,You want to get the most tools in one package .

Anyway the UPS man just picked up my 5700D and once again its heading back to Japan for repairs , If it was a Icom it would be just heading back to Herne Bay in Kent here in the UK . Where the average turn round time is about 7 days .

I wonder how many people bought a 5700D in the states and how are they finding it ? So far I only know of 9 owners most only get the odd crash of the CPU but nothing like me if you read this whole topic " First Impreessions of a 5700D " Your see what I mean ,So if you were thinking of buying a 5700D I should wait if you cant wait please get one that has the latest firmware installed .Dont forget you cant update the firmware yourself it will need to be returned .

 

[G7HID]

You would be better off with a separate DMR scanner as the AOR series have one major drawback with DMR - you receive all or nothing, with the only selectable parameters being Colour Code and Slot, no Talkgroup filtering, no way to lock out or monitor a specific Talkgroup.. Other makes with DMR have the Talkgroup filtering as standard..

Mike

 

[sub101uk]

Sorry Mike but the 5700D when working its fine on DMR I see no reason to buy a separate DMR receive .But fully understand its nice having a separate radio for each mode or freqs in the same was I have a 275H for 2m + a 475H for 70 cms , But in the case of the 5700D it does decode alot more than the 8600 or I could connect the 8600 via the I.F. on the 5700D or DV1 and decode DMR that way but after speanding £4.500 on a radio it should do the job without buying a second radio other wise what is the point in buying it .

 

[marlbrook]

I'm hoping the 5700D will give me some relief from squinting at the tiny DV-1 display. I use the IC-8600's band scope to hunt down digital signals and then input the frequencies and decode them on the DV-1.

Are you aware that with a single BNC cable you can connect the DV1 to the IC-R8600?

The Icom has a 10.7 output socket, and you connect the cable from that to the AR-DV1's aerial socket. Then you just tune the DV1's VFO to 10.7MHz.

From then on everything found by the Icom when you tune it is processed by the AR-DV1 as just another received signal. So all the AOR Modes and Bandwidths are available, including the DV1's 'AUTO' Digital Mode selection.

With just one antenna switch you can select a real aerial for the DV1 and both Radios will then work individually, however whilst connected you have the best of both worlds if and when you want them. The Icom's larger display, Band Scope, signal finding abilities etc, and the AOR's multiple 'extra' functions.

Personally I would try that before deciding whether to keep the 5700D and taking advantage of AOR's 30 day trial policy. The two Radios in combination will do almost all that the 5700D can do, but with the R8600's real time Scope and superior build quality etc. Of course having the extra room on your desk available whilst the 5700D is having to be sent backwards and forwards to Japan might be useful sometimes, lol.