jakes_tornado
Member
Or will I have to have the radio programmed? Because I Could just scan the 800 mHz band right? I am just wondering because it has a simple concept.
If I buy a Harris radio used by Public Safety System, will I be able to listen?
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teufler
Member
since your island is on edacs pro voice, you could getr a uniden 436 or 536 scanner and with the recent upgrade, they will plat provoice. Probably cheaper in the long run, and they scan much faster, an d you can make changes to the scanners yourself without visiting a radio shop.
From personal experience, I can second the fact that the scanner is going to be a lot cheaper than the Harris radio. Then there is the licensing of the radio programming software,or paying a radio shop to do it for you instead.
Harris tends to be more expensive than Motorola these days, and then you have to find a vendor and shop for the programming. Or buy it all yourself.
I still use my scanners as my main means to monitor radio traffic. SDR USB devices for other monitoring in the area, and Harris radio is only if I have a need to transmit. I used to work emergency response and needed the inter-operability with many different agencies. With no multi or even dual band Motorola available at the time, I bought a Harris XG-100P handheld. This worked well, but it makes a poor scanner. I also never needed the GPS function.
Get a scanner instead.
Harris tends to be more expensive than Motorola these days, and then you have to find a vendor and shop for the programming. Or buy it all yourself.
I still use my scanners as my main means to monitor radio traffic. SDR USB devices for other monitoring in the area, and Harris radio is only if I have a need to transmit. I used to work emergency response and needed the inter-operability with many different agencies. With no multi or even dual band Motorola available at the time, I bought a Harris XG-100P handheld. This worked well, but it makes a poor scanner. I also never needed the GPS function.
Get a scanner instead.
fmulder13
Member
Just out of curiosity, what makes the XG-100 a poor scanner?
jakes_tornado
Member
The thing is I have a BCD436HP, and I was just wondering if I WOULD be able to do that. It just hit me as a thought, and this forum is the only thing I know that knows about radios. I just don't want to pay for the upgrade haha!
Blackswan73
Active Member
It would be a whole lot cheaper to get the upgrade, than buy another radio
jakes_tornado
Member
That is totally true. But, is it possible?
Of course it is possible in theory....what folks are saying is that it is not the path to go down unless:
1) You have a lot of experience programming public safety grade radios
2) You have a lot of expendable money just laying around.
No offense meant but programming public safety grade radios is not for the casual hobbyist. Both Motorola and Harris Public Safety grade radios have hundreds of settings that have to be set just right or else.
Marshall KE4ZNR
jakes_tornado
Member
I totally understand. I was just wondering because it seemed like a simple concept to me.
ecps92
Member
See post #8 :evil:
Key words to live by :roll:
1) Unless You have a lot of experience programming public safety grade radios
2) Unless You have a lot of expendable money just laying around.
No offense meant but programming public safety grade radios is not for the casual hobbyist. Both Motorola and Harris Public Safety grade radios have hundreds of settings that have to be set just right or else.
Key words to live by :roll:
1) Unless You have a lot of experience programming public safety grade radios
2) Unless You have a lot of expendable money just laying around.
No offense meant but programming public safety grade radios is not for the casual hobbyist. Both Motorola and Harris Public Safety grade radios have hundreds of settings that have to be set just right or else.
In this particular case if he wants to monitor an EDACS system the XG100 / Unity does not support EDACS. The mobile version will (with a specific control head if I recall).
So in this case it would be a very poor choice of a radio to monitor an EDACS system.
n5ims
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It does sound simple, doesn't it. Just program in a few settings and listen away, right? Well, not so right. Programming a commercial radio for a trunking radio system requires many settings that may not appear obvious to the casual user. Getting them wrong may also not be obvious to that user, but will probably be important to the system owner who may get alarms from their system about things not being right. Depending on the system, they may be slow to respond or they may be quick to send a "kill" command to the radio triggering those alarms, causing that radio to stop working and requiring a trip to the manufacturer (along with detailed explanations on why that kill should be reversed).
The simple thing that's really easy to understand is that a scanner will never transmit, by accident or on purpose. This is the #1 reason why a scanner is the safest option for non-system users to use one to monitor a system. The next thing to think about is that a $500 radio (even with a $50 upgrade) will be cheaper than a several thousand dollar commercial radio (plus several hundred for the programming software and more for the cables, etc.). This will continue to be true even if you can find a used one.
To address the "can it be done" question. Point blank answer is Yes. Then again, it is also possible for someone to fly a plane without any real instruction, just lots of time using a computer flight simulator. To put that in perspective, the chances of total success are very small and the chances of serious failures are quite large, but sure, it "can be done".
Some of the non-obvious things that make it hard (think doctoral thesis hard) to correctly program an unauthorized radio for invisible access to a trunking radio system vs. programming a scanner for the same system (think high school term paper hard there) are these:
*) Most trunked radio systems require their radios to report to the system when they turn on, change channels, move to another site, and several other things. These communications are generally what will cause an unauthorized radio to be noticed by the system operator. Programming the radio to never do this reporting requires some very specialized programming techniques and is the really hard part. Get one little thing wrong and you're illegally transmitting, being noticed by the system operator, perhaps causing issues on the system, and maybe even causing the system to kill your radio.
*) A scanner will never need to do this since it can't transmit so those settings won't need to be configured.
*) Reputable dealers will never attempt to program unauthorized radios onto a system. They make their money by selling equipment and services to system owners and their business will suffer if they assist in placing unauthorized radios on agency's systems.
*) Programming a scanner may not be super easy, but it isn't all that hard and being off by just a bit may not matter. If it does matter, it will never cause issues with the system, only with the scanner's reception.
jakes_tornado
Member
Haha, thanks for everything.
Just getting back to this thread.....I don't check in often.
One reason a scanner is better than a radio has already been mentioned. It does not allow you to transmit on channels/frequencies that you are not authorized to do so.
Another big thing for me is the Close Call function of many scanners. You do not need to know what is in use in your area, let the radio find it for you. A Harris Unity radio will never do that for you.
Also, my Unity radio is for inter-operability between local and Federal users. I have time to program and load new "Mission Plans" as needed. A scanner you can easily program from the front panel, or PC if needed. The Unity radio is PC first and limited front panel capability.
Then, for transmitting and scanning, you tend to miss certain critical transmissions while scanning. So using a scanner for listening is still the best method, and much cheaper, with less hassle.
One reason a scanner is better than a radio has already been mentioned. It does not allow you to transmit on channels/frequencies that you are not authorized to do so.
Another big thing for me is the Close Call function of many scanners. You do not need to know what is in use in your area, let the radio find it for you. A Harris Unity radio will never do that for you.
Also, my Unity radio is for inter-operability between local and Federal users. I have time to program and load new "Mission Plans" as needed. A scanner you can easily program from the front panel, or PC if needed. The Unity radio is PC first and limited front panel capability.
Then, for transmitting and scanning, you tend to miss certain critical transmissions while scanning. So using a scanner for listening is still the best method, and much cheaper, with less hassle.
There's so much misinformation in this thread it's sad.
You can pick up a commercial radio these days pretty cheap - I've seen P7100 radios (that can do EDACS and ProVoice) go for less than $100.
It'll work better than any scanner ever could.
You can pick up a commercial radio these days pretty cheap - I've seen P7100 radios (that can do EDACS and ProVoice) go for less than $100.
It'll work better than any scanner ever could.
jakes_tornado
Member
Yeah, I have a Uniden BCD436HP, but I haven't been using it much because 1, I don't have the programming software because I have a mac. 2, I don't want to buy the $50 dollar upgrade for theProvoice just yet. 3, there isn't much that happens here.
teufler
Member
well check witrh a local radio shop on the price of a harris radio, then to program it, what do they charge. I'm guessing they charge more than $50.00 to program. Since you already have a 436, $50.00 is not much to pay compared to what it will cost getting another radio and then programming it. I assume Sentinel software, which is free, will handle the programming on a 436. I think you will have to send the scanner off for the scanner gods to sprinkle fairy dust on it to listen to ProVoice.
How old is your Mac? You don't have Win7 installed and set up to dual boot?
You can also load Windows via Parallels, VMWare Fusion or VirtualBox which is free. That way you don't even have to reboot your Mac. Virtual machines are great.
I'm not up to speed on Mac's but would not every one of your options at least require a licensed copy of Win7 that you would have to pay for?
Or is there a Mac VM that comes with a licensed copy of Win7?
I recall Microsoft having the XP mode for Win7 that gave you a free copy of XP but I did not think that was ever offered for those with Macs or going to Win8 or higher.
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