This is my first "adventure" with using LCN Finder. Are the results I got typical? I was thinking they'd be more on the order of 1-11 or something like that.
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LCN Finder results
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Yep, if you ran LCN Finder and then when it finished you actually saved the results, those would be correct.
As often as you might see sequential 1-11 type LCNs, you are much more likely to see LCNs like you've displayed in your screenshot.
That particular system is using a standard UHF bandplan.
freq = 453.5875
450 bandplan (12.5 khz)
LCN = ((freq - 450.000) / .0125) + 1
LCN = ((453.5875 - 450.000) / .0125) + 1
LCN = (3.5875 / .0125) + 1
LCN = 287 + 1
LCN = 288
freq = 460.6375
460 bandplan (12.5 khz)
LCN = ((freq - 460.000) / .0125) + 401
LCN = ((460.6375 - 460.000) / .0125) + 401
LCN = (.6375 / .0125) + 401
LCN = 51 + 401
LCN = 452
The LCN finder is working. You found the LCNs. Nice job! And if the database doesn't have that information, please submit it!
Thanks
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Incidentally, did you start out scanning more frequencies than that (like all of the frequencies on the licenses - 14 of them) and then just input the frequencies into the system that you knew were active? Or did you actually run LCN Finder with all 14 frequencies programmed into the system and it only found 11? Certainly it's possible that all 14 aren't in use. Just wondering.
I know the system in the DB lists a lot more frequencies (but it also doesn't have any LCN information).
At any rate, you did a great job, and I'd ask that you submit that info to the DB so that somebody will update it. They might not remove frequencies that you don't have listed there, but at least they will modify the LCNs for the frequencies you have listed so that they are reflected correctly in the DB.
Along with your submission you might want to ask them to (a) set the Site RAN to 1 and (b) add the WQNQ250 callsign.
FYI: For the three frequencies you don't have listed but which the DB has listed, IF they are actively part of the system their LCNs would be:
102 451.2625
302 453.7625
686 463.5625
In this case it is convenient that the LCNs can also be figured by formula, because that is often not the case.
Mike
I know the system in the DB lists a lot more frequencies (but it also doesn't have any LCN information).
At any rate, you did a great job, and I'd ask that you submit that info to the DB so that somebody will update it. They might not remove frequencies that you don't have listed there, but at least they will modify the LCNs for the frequencies you have listed so that they are reflected correctly in the DB.
Along with your submission you might want to ask them to (a) set the Site RAN to 1 and (b) add the WQNQ250 callsign.
FYI: For the three frequencies you don't have listed but which the DB has listed, IF they are actively part of the system their LCNs would be:
102 451.2625
302 453.7625
686 463.5625
In this case it is convenient that the LCNs can also be figured by formula, because that is often not the case.
Mike
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Thanks Mike! The encouragement is appreciated. I'm still doing some experimenting (one site without the 3 other frequencies, then one site with them). Once I get a better comfort level, if there are changes to offer, I'll submit to KY DB admin.
I'm interested in this system because they give the best real time traffic reports around.
This is kind of weird because they have same number of frequencies as talkgroups. Why they didn't go with a conventional versus trunk system is puzzling.
What I did was create a conventional system with all the frequencies for the licensee I could find on FCC search. Then I let the scanner run for a day or two with logging software. The frequencies I got "hits" on that showed a RAN code I presumed to be associated with their trunked system. Then I loaded those and did the LCN finder thing.
This evening it looks like its doing some type of trunk following, but at this time of day only security units are on the air. Will see what Thursday's bus runs have to offer. (Ironically most of the talkgroups are named for bus compounds. One of the compounds is named for their retired transportation director, who is in a golf league with me. I was telling him of the challenges I'd been having programming their radio system. Then it starts working - go figure.)
I'm interested in this system because they give the best real time traffic reports around.
This is kind of weird because they have same number of frequencies as talkgroups. Why they didn't go with a conventional versus trunk system is puzzling.
What I did was create a conventional system with all the frequencies for the licensee I could find on FCC search. Then I let the scanner run for a day or two with logging software. The frequencies I got "hits" on that showed a RAN code I presumed to be associated with their trunked system. Then I loaded those and did the LCN finder thing.
This evening it looks like its doing some type of trunk following, but at this time of day only security units are on the air. Will see what Thursday's bus runs have to offer. (Ironically most of the talkgroups are named for bus compounds. One of the compounds is named for their retired transportation director, who is in a golf league with me. I was telling him of the challenges I'd been having programming their radio system. Then it starts working - go figure.)
You are welcome. There are definitely changes to offer, as the DB lists no LCNs and you have the LCN info. You did extremely well. It may be that the other three channels just never became active during your LCN Finder session, or it could be simply that they don't have all 14 frequencies in use on the system at this time.
If you put those frequencies in as a trunked system and ran LCN Finder (which you did), if it discovered LCNs for 11 of those frequencies then those frequencies are absolutely part of the trunked system. A conventional channel would not be sending LCN information.
Please do consider submitting the update. You have accurate data.
It sure does seem like overkill to me for them to have so many active frequencies, but they might use that system for much more than just buses and security.
You did it the right way -- I mean, it was very effective, so I can't argue with how you did it.
Be glad it's not summertime, or you may not have picked anything up all summer !
Mike
As others have said, you got it! If you happen to have ARC or ProScan, upload and save so you don't lose it all...lol! You should be all set to monitor it now, and thanks for staying patient.
Thanks to all! I'm feeling pretty comfortable now after monitoring AM bus runs. Got traffic on all listed talkgroups and saw they must do some private calls too (ID Search shows some "i" talkgroups.)
Still want to see if this is an 11 or 14 frequency system. More logging ahead.
Still want to see if this is an 11 or 14 frequency system. More logging ahead.
If you program in the talk groups at a later time, and run ID scan mode, add talk group i0 if you still want to hear Private Calls like all other trunking systems.
Yeap, it looks like they work great. I used the LCN information here and updated a few things on my Calculator, so attached is V2. It requires you to have 2 known channel and frequency pairs in the same band plan, and then it will calculate the Base freq, step size, and any other channel or frequency in that same bandplan. It works for bandplans 1-400 and 401-800, but anything higher than that I don't know because I have no data to test. Hope you find the calculator useful!
Thank you!
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