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New APX Control Head

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dmichaels18

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Feb 22, 2018
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Has anyone seen or heard anything about the new control head for APX mobile series?

For those that don't know what I am talking about, a little over a month ago Moto released APX CPS R.21.xx.xx. New CPS listed off a new control head in its features, its called the "E5". In the window where you configure the buttons, it looks to me like an LCD screen/modernized version of the O5. Anyone have more info on this than just what CPS is showing?

*Would attach a screenshot but am currently on my personal computer, will try to get on if enough people want to see it.
 

dgruver911

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Watched a webinar last week on new enhancements for the APX line, as well as some info on the new NEXT line. I don't recall all the details but it is only for the 6500/85000 mobiles, and has the ability to have different channels display in different colors. They also moved some of the buttons around.
 

fxdscon

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Has anyone seen or heard anything about the new control head for APX mobile series?


.
 

radioman2001

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Mind you I like the looks, but that's not a reason to purchase something for P.S. and well they needed something new, and definitly had to improve on the very "Kludgy" O-2 head. I suggested to one of my departments to buy only the "APX brick" when forced to Phase II in a few years and use the original O-5 accy's that came with the XTL-5000 radio. It also would save about $1,500.00 for each radio, plus the re-install.
BTW mother M raised the price of the APX $1,000.00 overnight when they found out these agencies were being told to buy Phase II radios and nothing else.
I told the Chiefs council to publicly state that they were buying Harris and let M know about it. I am waiting for M's reaction when 13 agencies go with Harris after their attempted ripoff. I bet they come back costing less than the origianl price just to maintain their stranglehold.
 

dmichaels18

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Mind you I like the looks, but that's not a reason to purchase something for P.S. and well they needed something new, and definitly had to improve on the very "Kludgy" O-2 head. I suggested to one of my departments to buy only the "APX brick" when forced to Phase II in a few years and use the original O-5 accy's that came with the XTL-5000 radio. It also would save about $1,500.00 for each radio, plus the re-install.
BTW mother M raised the price of the APX $1,000.00 overnight when they found out these agencies were being told to buy Phase II radios and nothing else.
I told the Chiefs council to publicly state that they were buying Harris and let M know about it. I am waiting for M's reaction when 13 agencies go with Harris after their attempted ripoff. I bet they come back costing less than the origianl price just to maintain their stranglehold.
The O2 head has its own market, the ruggedness of potentially being mounted to a pump panel, or maybe on police patrol bikes?? My likening of the E5 is coming from the current usage of the O7. We have been using that with our APX mobiles, but it has been a hell of a time getting any of the seasoned folks in my agency to understand how to use them. We still have some XTL’s floating around, all with an O5, and using something like an E5 would bring back that simplicity for the guys here.

Multiple things in the Moto price raising.

1) Did moto have phase 2 option enabled in their radio on the initial quote? Pricey option- yes, should it be that expensive- probably not. Phase 2 costs a bit of money to get involved in the first place, probably why they charge so much for it in subscriber units.

2) Watch out with Harris. They have great equipment- if you plan to only stick to trunking an never use conventional. I have tested all of their stuff, even have a unity XG100 floating in my fleet, and a licensed copy of RPM2. It is a good unit, but the scanning function as well as ease of use goes out the window if you think you will have trunking and conventional channels in the same “zone”. They will tell you they can create zones that contain both, but then it gets super messy. Furthermore, they (engineers with Harris) didn’t acknowledge this one when I asked, the radios are not capable of scanning trunked channels while on a conventional channel- even if you made a custom scan list telling it to. Will not, however my old XT series fly through everything I need at the moment, with the exception of an incoming phase 2.

All of my Harris testing was on an XL200P, it was a great unit. Just be mindful that if you intend to use both conventional and trunking in the same zone, that my advice would be to stray away.
 

RodStrong

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We still have some XTL’s floating around, all with an O5, and using something like an E5 would bring back that simplicity for the guys here.
We have been buying the 05 on our APX mobiles for several years, specifically for uniformity with XTL 2500 users.
 

radioman2001

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Pricing was for Phase II capable APX 7/800 mobiles. The price only went up after the county mandated the Phase II purchases.
In this Fire service there is no scanning so I don't think that's going to be an issue. Hopefully the mere thought of Mother M losing a large deal will change some minds pretty quick. I have seen it before with my present agency. M dropped the price 40% on the thought of losing the customer.
IMO there should be NO scanning of any type in P.S. service. At my present agency we removed scanning about 5 years ago and now require the person to sign a waiver for peronal injury idemnity if they want it. This is incase they are injured as a result of scanning. It's very hard to dodge a train when you don't know it's coming at 90+ miles a hour. Even my local VFD has no scanning and at a major incident the Chief officer can have up to 4 portables on different channels around his neck at one time.
 

Tech21

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Mind you I like the looks, but that's not a reason to purchase something for P.S. and well they needed something new, and definitly had to improve on the very "Kludgy" O-2 head. I suggested to one of my departments to buy only the "APX brick" when forced to Phase II in a few years and use the original O-5 accy's that came with the XTL-5000 radio. It also would save about $1,500.00 for each radio, plus the re-install.
BTW mother M raised the price of the APX $1,000.00 overnight when they found out these agencies were being told to buy Phase II radios and nothing else.
I told the Chiefs council to publicly state that they were buying Harris and let M know about it. I am waiting for M's reaction when 13 agencies go with Harris after their attempted ripoff. I bet they come back costing less than the origianl price just to maintain their stranglehold.
No need to buy new radios when you can just most likely buy the entitlement for the radios. Unless your radios are completely outdated.
 

Tech21

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Pricing was for Phase II capable APX 7/800 mobiles. The price only went up after the county mandated the Phase II purchases.
In this Fire service there is no scanning so I don't think that's going to be an issue. Hopefully the mere thought of Mother M losing a large deal will change some minds pretty quick. I have seen it before with my present agency. M dropped the price 40% on the thought of losing the customer.
IMO there should be NO scanning of any type in P.S. service. At my present agency we removed scanning about 5 years ago and now require the person to sign a waiver for peronal injury idemnity if they want it. This is incase they are injured as a result of scanning. It's very hard to dodge a train when you don't know it's coming at 90+ miles a hour. Even my local VFD has no scanning and at a major incident the Chief officer can have up to 4 portables on different channels around his neck at one time.
That is just plain stupid. If your scan lists are properly setup, they can be of great help. Scanning was removed because somebody didn't know how to properly set up scan lists. Scanning ins public safety is critically important and a huge money saver instead of having to lug 4 radios around.
 

radioman2001

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I don't think the XTL will do Phase II

Scanning is a department decided option. You will never see scanning by NYPD unless it's in an Emergency Service truck that covers an entire NYC borough and a dozen different channels. I have never heard of it on a FDNY radio either. When I worked NYCEMS you stayed on your assigned channel and that is that. We had a separate radio to monitor NYPD.
The only scanning in P.S. I am aware of is NY State Police that have a split simplex system and monitor both base and mobile transmissions. There may be other local agencies that do, but I am not sure that's the norm.
As far as a scan list, you can NOT monitor your main channel while listening to another one. Ie water is calling the Chief "we are out of water" while he is contact with interior crews on another channel all the while monitoring EMS responce and traffic control on another. Passive scanning may work but when you HAVE to hear someone it doesn't.
I think that's enough about scanning, this thread is for the new E-5 head.
 
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GTR8000

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I don't think the XTL will do Phase II

The only scanning in P.S. I am aware of is NY State Police that have a split simplex system and monitor both base and mobile transmissions. There may be other local agencies that do, but I am not sure that's the norm.

As far as a scan list, you can NOT monitor your main channel while listening to another one.
The XTL/XTS series is not capable of Phase II. That has been common knowledge for years, hence them being replaced with the APX series a decade ago.

You can't seriously believe that the NYSP are the only public safety agency in the area who scan. Take a ride across the river to Rockland, where every radio on the trunked system is scanning other talkgroups. Priority is enabled, obviously, which takes care of the puzzling "you can't hear your main channel when scanning" statement you made. Sometimes I seriously wonder if some of you are still using radios from the 50s the way you talk about this stuff, seemingly having little awareness of how modern radios and modern radio systems function. :unsure:

Oh and yes, none of this has anything to do with the new E5 head. Unfortunately, some of the things that were said that took this thread off topic are worthy of rebutting, for the sake of others reading and trying to actually learn something.
 

Project25_MASTR

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Mind you I like the looks, but that's not a reason to purchase something for P.S. and well they needed something new, and definitly had to improve on the very "Kludgy" O-2 head. I suggested to one of my departments to buy only the "APX brick" when forced to Phase II in a few years and use the original O-5 accy's that came with the XTL-5000 radio. It also would save about $1,500.00 for each radio, plus the re-install.
BTW mother M raised the price of the APX $1,000.00 overnight when they found out these agencies were being told to buy Phase II radios and nothing else.
I told the Chiefs council to publicly state that they were buying Harris and let M know about it. I am waiting for M's reaction when 13 agencies go with Harris after their attempted ripoff. I bet they come back costing less than the origianl price just to maintain their stranglehold.
The O2 is literally the replacement for for the XTL1500's control head (I've heard it called the M2 head but a certain software doesn't refer to it as that). I don't think I had ever seen the O2 available until the APX1500 and APX4500 hit the market (with the APX1500 being the direct replacement for the XTL1500). That's what it is really aimed at...budget and integrated audio. O2's are also a pain to convert from remote to dash mount.

If you look at Motorola's history, they typically carry over heads. For example, towards the end of production, you could use an A or W series head on a Spectra. Then the Astro's hit the market with the W series which were carried over to the Astro 25 line. Astro 25 also introduced the Odyssey head (the O series) which was carried over to the APX. Only makes sense this new E series will be carried over to the APX's successor.
 

jeepsandradios

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Pricing was for Phase II capable APX 7/800 mobiles. The price only went up after the county mandated the Phase II purchases.
So you said the pricing was for P2 Capable. An APX is P2 capable. That doesn't mean it has the flash for it. I assume when the county said it must be phase 2 they added that option and the price went up. We have seen that in the SAR quotes we have gotten over the years for P25 "compliant" gear. As long as there is a way to add P25 in the future our grants allow for the radio. We order without unless we need P25. Unless you have a before and after quote with the same options its a different radio changing the cost.

Just food for thought.
 

62Truck

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Quote:

In this Fire service there is no scanning.

The only scanning in P.S. I am aware of is NY State Police that have a split simplex system and monitor both base and mobile transmissions. There may be other local agencies that do, but I am not sure that's the norm.
As far as a scan list, you can NOT monitor your main channel while listening to another one. Ie water is calling the Chief "we are out of water" while he is contact with interior crews on another channel all the while monitoring EMS responce and traffic control on another. Passive scanning may work but when you HAVE to hear someone it doesn't.


To me this sounds like operator error and the person doing the programming doesn't have a clue on what they are doing...
 

radioman2001

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I have seen the quotes, there were for the same radio and optioned the same before and after.

I beg to differ, you CANNOT listen to 2 or more different channels at the EXACT same time from a single radio no matter how it's programmed. Motorola's solution in the 60's and 70's was dual front end receivers, I have a Motran with one. A bit confusing when both RF channels are active.
 

CommsTruck

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you can when set up right. priority is given to the selected channel.
 
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