P25, AES, Private Mode and Sq Mode…

[BMDaug]

I’ve sent it to two people already, but I’m about to send it to a couple more. I’ve experimented with a bunch of things since sending it but none of them have affected anything so I’m going to just send the same one so that everyone is looking at the same thing. Thanks you for all of the responses!

-B

 

[rjschilder]

I’m creating a new key set with a key set ID of 4. The set will have one key. That key ID will also be 4…

Do the TX and RX NACs need to be different?

Is there a place to define a key number other than in a system and in a group set?

Key set # you shouldn't have to mess with. Leave it default, just load one key set per radio for now.

When you enter the Key ID in RPM (either in the system default, or strap it per talkgroup) it's referencing the Storage Location Number (SLN), not the KID itself. Remember, you need the Traffic Encryption Key (TEK) Material (i.e. the hex key), Algorithm, and Key ID (KID) to match. The radio needs to be told where that key exists (SLN). You can have one radio with an SLN of 100, another radio with an SLN of 999. As long as the key material and KID match, and the radio is programmed accordingly, it doesn't matter what the SLN is.

Also, check the color of the TX light when you PTT. I believe orange on TX is encrypted (vs red in the clear).

As far as the NAC, the TX of radio 1 needs to match the RX of radio 2 (so it un-squelches when it hears the desired NAC)

 

[BMDaug]

Thanks for this! So the Tx light is orange and all of the NACs match. In fact, the personalities are identical between the six 7100 radios. I just use ‘override and program’ in RPM to increment LIDs. The encryption works, but squelch is not functioning properly. I can be transmitting on a radio and seeing a greed RX led and an antenna (busy) icon, but hear nothing. Then switch out of private mode or hold the clr/mon button and hear the transmission. It’s like the NAC, TGID, and Unit ID aren’t being decoded.

Is the SLN the key set ID? I’m not sure where to define a hex TEK. In RPM, it just uses the generic ‘Key Number’ term. I’m assuming that’s the key ID not the key SET ID… All of this is in decimal right? I’m just doing P25 CAI in simplex so as far as I can tell, the ‘max key bank’ setting in rpm is unnecessary. It’s not even an available option for unity portables and I believe it only applies to aegis and provoice.

I’m wondering is the encryption isn’t properly ‘linking’ to the personality so when using private mode, it’s not finding the keys, but if I open it up to ‘all traffic’ it’s finding the keys in the ‘wrong location’ but still using them to decode… I got the radio to display SYS KEY NO KEY 1 instead of 4 but there is a key set 1 and a key 1 so I’m not sure what it’s problem it. I’m trying to find documents and a compatibility matrix for the firmware and dsp I have loaded so I can see if there is some mismatch… I’m also thinking about loading a master key set file with multiple keysets, each with multiple keys. I’m really starting to think it’s a dsp code issue that is looking for particular keys and key sets…

-B

 

[TDR-94]

The Flash and DSP code are the correct combinations.

 

[rjschilder]

Thanks for this! So the Tx light is orange and all of the NACs match. In fact, the personalities are identical between the six 7100 radios. I just use ‘override and program’ in RPM to increment LIDs. The encryption works, but squelch is not functioning properly. I can be transmitting on a radio and seeing a greed RX led and an antenna (busy) icon, but hear nothing. Then switch out of private mode or hold the clr/mon button and hear the transmission. It’s like the NAC, TGID, and Unit ID aren’t being decoded.

Is the SLN the key set ID? I’m not sure where to define a hex TEK. In RPM, it just uses the generic ‘Key Number’ term. I’m assuming that’s the key ID not the key SET ID… All of this is in decimal right? I’m just doing P25 CAI in simplex so as far as I can tell, the ‘max key bank’ setting in rpm is unnecessary. It’s not even an available option for unity portables and I believe it only applies to aegis and provoice.

I’m wondering is the encryption isn’t properly ‘linking’ to the personality so when using private mode, it’s not finding the keys, but if I open it up to ‘all traffic’ it’s finding the keys in the ‘wrong location’ but still using them to decode… I got the radio to display SYS KEY NO KEY 1 instead of 4 but there is a key set 1 and a key 1 so I’m not sure what it’s problem it. I’m trying to find documents and a compatibility matrix for the firmware and dsp I have loaded so I can see if there is some mismatch… I’m also thinking about loading a master key set file with multiple keysets, each with multiple keys. I’m really starting to think it’s a dsp code issue that is looking for particular keys and key sets…

-B

You're using Harris KeyAdmin to create the keys and load them right? It's completely separate from RPM. You need to create a new keyset, create a new Key (regular key or interop key). If you just create a key it will randomly create the key material for you, like "77217A24432646294A404E635266556A586E3272357538782F413F442A472D4B " (and no this isn't an active CKR), if you do a manual key, or manual interop key you'll be required to type in the key material yourself. There is no other way to load a p7100. It doesn't support single key des or aes due to the 40 bit feature string (and firmware).

Edit: you also need to load the key into the p7100 in addition to loading the personality from RPM. Two steps.

 

[BMDaug]

You're using Harris KeyAdmin to create the keys and load them right? It's completely separate from RPM. You need to create a new keyset, create a new Key (regular key or interop key). If you just create a key it will randomly create the key material for you, like "77217A24432646294A404E635266556A586E3272357538782F413F442A472D4B " (and no this isn't an active CKR), if you do a manual key, or manual interop key you'll be required to type in the key material yourself. There is no other way to load a p7100. It doesn't support single key des or aes due to the 40 bit feature string (and firmware).

Edit: you also need to load the key into the p7100 in addition to loading the personality from RPM. Two steps.

Yes, that’s exactly what I do but there’s no reference to SLNs or TEKs in key admin that I can find and by default, all values appear in dec unless I change the options in keyadmin to display hex. In RPM, all key number values are in dec as far as I know. The encryption is working, though I’m still getting the SYS KEY NO KEY X (where X is a key number) even though there is no reference to that key number in the personality AND I have to hold clr/mon or change Sq Mode permanently to MON to hear an encrypted transmission…

-B

 

[rjschilder]

Yes, that’s exactly what I do but there’s no reference to SLNs or TEKs in key admin that I can find and by default, all values appear in dec unless I change the options in keyadmin to display hex. In RPM, all key number values are in dec as far as I know. The encryption is working, though I’m still getting the SYS KEY NO KEY X (where X is a key number) even though there is no reference to that key number in the personality AND I have to hold clr/mon or change Sq Mode permanently to MON to hear an encrypted transmission…

-B

PM me a screenshot of what you're looking at. I'm not sure were on the same page here. There's no way the key material is in decimal, and by default it won't show you the key at all (its little circles).

 

[BMDaug]

Thanks to everyone who helped me over the course of several days to work on a solution to this very baffling problem. I’m still waiting on my dealer, but I do have a few new things to try. I had to take some time to think and work on some other radio related projects before going at it again, but tomorrow is the day for yet another attempt at cracking this.

I’ll report back as soon as possible but I wanted to let everyone know that I really appreciate all of the help and hands-on work some of you put in to confirm that it’s not me…

Regards,
Brian

 

[lexmedic157]

So having dealt with this issue recently, in my case AES, was only able to get the P7100 to unmute if I loaded F9R06N05.dsp code into it. After that it was fine.