Phase II

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rescue674aa

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Does anyone know who will MAYBE go Phase II in the Hampton Roads area? I have see a lot of Phase II radios around here. Just wanted to know if I need to invest in a new scanner. I have a 396xt right now.
 

digitalman

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Phase 2

Newport News was supposed to be phase 2- don't know what they are planning- still analog. I think Little Creek is Phase 2.
 

brownlab

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It appears that digital APO 25 Phase II TDMA will be the signals to decode in the next 10 years so I think it is just a matter of time before somebody in the Tidewater area upgrades. As a matter of fact I am kind of impressed by the number of smaller counties and cities that are converting. The big problem with Phase II (at least to me) it that is seems to make encryption relatively easy and that could be temping a lot of police chiefs and sheriffs.
 

John

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I am not sure it is any easier to encrypt Phase II than it is to do Phase I. I believe the reason a lot of smaller localities are now going Phase II is they have put off upgrading their radio systems as long as they can and now have to do something. If you are going to put in a new system now it might as well be Phase II if you have to replace everything anyway. Also it is a way to make a smaller pool of frequencies go further. A lot of the new Phase II systems around here are operating on 8 frequencies or less while the older Phase I systems generally have 20 or more. If you have a legacy Phase I system that the user radios aren't too old it is more cost effective to upgrade and remain Phase I since you can reuse some equipment and you have lots of frequencies already. Encryption isn't really related unless you are having to buy a bunch of new radios. If you do have to then it gives you an opportunity to buy encryption if you didn't have it before. That's why I think you see a lot of the newer systems implementing it.
 

mikewazowski

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The big problem with Phase II (at least to me) it that is seems to make encryption relatively easy and that could be temping a lot of police chiefs and sheriffs.

Whether a system is Phase I or Phase II has nothing to do with encryption. All Phase II adds is the ability to use TDMA to double the amount of traffic your system can carry.

Once the voice is P25 whether it's an old 3600baud system, P25 Phase I or P25 Phase II system, it's trivial to encrypt.
 

brownlab

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Whether a system is Phase I or Phase II has nothing to do with encryption. All Phase II adds is the ability to use TDMA to double the amount of traffic your system can carry.

Once the voice is P25 whether it's an old 3600baud system, P25 Phase I or P25 Phase II system, it's trivial to encrypt.
Gosh, I really was not referring to Phase I systems converting to Phase II systems ( or did I write that?). No what I was referring to were smaller cities and counties that are converting from older analog systems to new digital Phase II TDMA and how temping is was to encrypted radio traffic. Yes I know Phase I already has that capability but thanks for pointing that out. Sorry I did not make that clearer.
 

brownlab

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I am not sure it is any easier to encrypt Phase II than it is to do Phase I. I believe the reason a lot of smaller localities are now going Phase II is they have put off upgrading their radio systems as long as they can and now have to do something. If you are going to put in a new system now it might as well be Phase II if you have to replace everything anyway. Also it is a way to make a smaller pool of frequencies go further. A lot of the new Phase II systems around here are operating on 8 frequencies or less while the older Phase I systems generally have 20 or more. If you have a legacy Phase I system that the user radios aren't too old it is more cost effective to upgrade and remain Phase I since you can reuse some equipment and you have lots of frequencies already. Encryption isn't really related unless you are having to buy a bunch of new radios. If you do have to then it gives you an opportunity to buy encryption if you didn't have it before. That's why I think you see a lot of the newer systems implementing it.
I am thinking more along the lines of places like Pittsylvania and Spotsylvania Counties in Virginia which are making or considering making the jump to Phase II TDMA. I don’t know about Pittsylvania but Spotsylvania is definitely thinking about the “E” word. Anyways for a while there is was also said that places such as these were too small in size and people for a Phase II TDMA System however apparently that is no longer the case.
 

John

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In some ways the smaller the size the more likely they are to go to Phase II simply due to the lack of available frequencies to install a new trunking system without doing so. Larger areas probably already either have a trunked system with frequencies assigned or have more channels assigned to them in the regional plans. Also smaller geographical areas generally require fewer tower sites and less subscriber radios so the overall cost is less.
 

davewhall29

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Basically, encryption is already added into the cost of the system/radios/etc for all P25 systems. It's basically standard, and from what I understand Motorola will automatically set everything up for encryption (at least from what I have read on these forums). Then it is up to the various agencies to unencrypt. So, from my understanding, encryption is part of the overall package when switching to a P25 Phase I or II system, so it would not be hard at all for everyone to be encrypted. I have seen that in most areas, the smaller cities/counties end up being the ones to be encrypted, either full or part time, rather than the larger cities/counties.
 

John

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At least from Motorola, encryption does cost extra on each radio. However some encryption (ADP) is very inexpensive (around $10 per radio). Higher levels of encryption cost considerably more. Still compared to older systems it is easier to do and doesn't affect performance of the system.
 

rescue674aa

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Phase 2

I was trying to figure out who was doing what in hampton roads virginia. Not who is going enc or anything lkke that. Thanks though for responding.
 
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