San Juan County monitoring

[rbuxton]

I was on a road trip through San Juan County today. I loaded up the UCA Motorola and P25 systems along with the conventional systems for UHP and San Juan County.

I heard nothing on either UCA system but heard traffic, as I always have, on the conventional systems for UHP and San Juan County EMS.

My last trip was a few months ago and I heard plenty of traffic on the UCA Motorola system. I was surprised not to heard anything. I was using ID search and could receive signals on the control channels.

Can anyone explain the lack of traffic on the trunked systems? And I understand how the systems work.

Thanks.

-Randy

 

[DanLP456]

The old 800mhz UCA system is virtually unused now. What I’ve seen in my area and heard from others is that the VHF links from that system have largely migrated to the new P25 system. In looking at your list of scanners, with the P25 system, the HP2 isn’t going to work if your only available site is a simulcast system. And with my SDS 100, I had to set the global filter to none to not miss any transmissions. If you were hearing the control channels on the new P25 system then this likely doesn’t explain it lol but I thought I’d relay my experience.

 

[theaton]

I live in Moab, and the UCA P25 system is very busy around here. I picked up traffic on Abajo Peak yesterday. Most of it is on the rotating Supergroup TGs patched from conventional.

 

[hazrat8990]

The lack of radio traffic on a P25 system in a remote area is not surprising to me at all. It is very likely there weren't any radios affiliated with the particular site(s) you were monitoring at the time. If a trooper happens to move into the area, you will hear their TG become active.

 

[rbuxton]

I was within line of sight of Abajo. And I'm pretty sure the SO car in Monticello was affiliated with Abajo. Even if that car had it's radio off there were certainly many radios that were affiliated with Abajo that should have made my scanner come alive with traffic. The radio is set to ID search.

Thanks.

-Randy

 

[enosjones]

The P25 Sites for the state including Abajo for San Juan County, may use all the frequencies assigned to that site for a control channel. some settings in sentinel may only download 2 frequencies to the scanner per site for control channel and alt . I would highly suggest making sure all the frequencies for each site are programmed. 3 sites use the p25 system for San Juan County, Abajo, Navajo mountain and Cedar Mesa. Some areas Might have other sites coming in from other counties. Also make sure that u have ID search on and not ID scan, as like was mentioned before they are using Talkgroups in the 63xxx range that are not listed in the database as patch Talkgroups.. especially because of the VHF patches going on in some parts of the state including San Juan County....

 

[enosjones]

Also I don't believe that abajo is a simulcast site , apart from northern Utah and st George area, the other sites to my knowledge aren't simulcast. The 800 Motorola system is non functional and some control channels are offline. please scan the 769.000 -775.00. frequency range to search for control channels that are digital on p25 phase 1 and 2.

 

[rbuxton]

Also I don't believe that abajo is a simulcast site , apart from northern Utah and st George area, the other sites to my knowledge aren't simulcast. The 800 Motorola system is non functional and some control channels are offline. please scan the 769.000 -775.00. frequency range to search for control channels that are digital on p25 phase 1 and 2.

I have all freqs for UCA P25 in my scanner (BCD536HP) and ID search. My understanding (from the RRDB) is that Abajo is not a simulcast site.

 

[theaton]

I don't know what to tell you. The Abajo site is quite active. Cedar Mesa & Navajo Mtn have far less traffic. If you were monitoring Abajo for more than a couple hours with no traffic I suspect there was something wrong with your setup. My BCD436HP picks it up fine.

 

[hazrat8990]

Since you stated that you have ALL of the frequencies programmed, this could be your entire issue. You should only have the verified control and alternate control frequencies programmed. The reason is that your scanner may have been mistakenly locked onto a data only frequency, rather than the actual control frequency. If you insist on keeping all frequencies programmed, at least move the control frequencies to the top of the list.

 

[gldavis]

During most of my Searching, I will lock (hold) the scanner to 1 Site (normally the site with the strongest signal (rssi). Searching Sites takes time, and you will miss traffic.

 

[enosjones]

Since you stated that you have ALL of the frequencies programmed, this could be your entire issue. You should only have the verified control and alternate control frequencies programmed. The reason is that your scanner may have been mistakenly locked onto a data only frequency, rather than the actual control frequency. If you insist on keeping all frequencies programmed, at least move the control frequencies to the top of the list.

that shouldn't matter where the control channel is located, I have all the frequencies programmed and on a couple of the sites the control channel is last, it don't affect it. this system the control channels occasionally rotate to the other frequencies. if you don't have all of them programmed u will miss traffic if the control channel moves to a frequency that isn't programmed....

 

[hazrat8990]

that shouldn't matter where the control channel is located, I have all the frequencies programmed and on a couple of the sites the control channel is last, it don't affect it. this system the control channels occasionally rotate to the other frequencies. if you don't have all of them programmed u will miss traffic if the control channel moves to a frequency that isn't programmed....

That is true about the CC rotation, but if you look at the details the site is transmitting, you will see a primary and only one alternate for most sites. The alternate control frequency is usually the one that handles data, but will switch to voice when all of the voice only frequencies are in use. It is a possibility the scanner locked on to a frequency that is dedicated to data only, instead of moving along to the actual control channel. The only way to see what is actually going on with the frequency assignments is with an SDR, or something like Pro96com.

The issue with Uniden scanners latching onto a data frequency, rather than the actual control frequency was brought up years ago, but was never fully addressed. If you search through UPMan's posts, the best way to mitigate the problem is to program only the control frequencies, and to arrange the order of them in Sentinel. These posts are buried pretty deep in the archives, but are still relevant.

 

[rbuxton]

I'm sure my issues can be figured out if I wasn't on my mobile mounted scanner. And my home station is too far away to receive the system. O well. For another day.

 

[enosjones]

sometimes the sites go offline, it could have been offline when u were trying to monitor it

 

[otiska]

Hello,
I'm preparing for a short trip into the Salt Lake area, specifically Davis County. I'm a little confused on what I should enter into the SDS100. While traveling, I'll want to monitor mostly Utah Hiway Patrol, but once reaching Salt Lake, I'll tend to listen to the local activity. If I understand correctly, the active system is now the UCA P25. Should I also scan the older 800 mhz analog system? Also, I've noticed for many of the smaller towns, such as Syracuse, there's not many talkgroups listed on the UCA P25, however, there's several listed on the 800 mhz system. Are there still many cities who have not made the migration yet to the newer P25 system?
Thanks.
Bob

 

[enosjones]

The whole state is on p25, the 800 system pretty much is silent, very little if anything is even on that system. some sites are no longer online. we haven't completed the list for some areas, but doesn't meant there isn't traffic on them. 700mhz is very active with this system. I suggest programming all the frequencies, not just the 2 control channels. some sites move the control channel around most stay put but if u don't want to miss traffic I'd program them all in. Talkgroups for the areas varies San juan and price TGs for UHP 7842 and 7843, Spanish fork canyon Utah County is 1835-1838. Salt Lake dispatches for utah County and salt lake uhp.. probably will cover most of those TGs..

 

[gldavis]

For Davis Co, program in the Wasatch Region sites (Davis Co Simo, Francis Peak, Morgan Peak, and North Salt Lake). Using Radio Reference, download Davis Co Department. Make sure the radio is set to "ID Scan" and not "ID Search".
Sill trying to confirm 2411=Syracuse City PW; 3371=Syracuse Ch 3 "City"; and 3372=Syracuse-Kaysville tie.

 

[enosjones]

For Davis Co, program in the Wasatch Region sites (Davis Co Simo, Francis Peak, Morgan Peak, and North Salt Lake). Using Radio Reference, download Davis Co Department. Make sure the radio is set to "ID Scan" and not "ID Search".
Sill trying to confirm 2411=Syracuse City PW; 3371=Syracuse Ch 3 "City"; and 3372=Syracuse-Kaysville tie.

why not ID search?

 

[otiska]

Thanks enosjones and gldavis for the replies. Your help will save a lot of time.