Trisquare 900mhz Radios

[KD8DVR]

Someone used an Opto. near-field receiver and got a perfect series of test transmissions. Naturally, this was close-in.

These are not totally secure radios; but most certainly are very good.

For a consumer-grade radio, the technology versus cost is very good. I love mine.

 

[cdesigns]

Someone used an Opto. near-field receiver and got a perfect series of test transmissions. Naturally, this was close-in.

These are not totally secure radios; but most certainly are very good.

For a consumer-grade radio, the technology versus cost is very good. I love mine.

Is imposible to scan I can only lock in one time every 3 -5 seconds and my voice can be heard for 1/4 of a second , I know it's me because I change the sound I make each time, but they're very secure.

 

[RayAir]

Ok I have been Signal Stalking the frequencies on this radios, I got hundreds of "stalks" and most of the frequencies repeat several times.

This is what I found:

Frequency range is 902.0250mhz - 927.7750mhz, there is a total of 104 frequencies.

After several signal stalking I saw that the offset is 0.2500mhz.

Example:
902.0250
902.2750
902.5250
902.7750
903.0250 etc.

Here is the frequencies if you want to copy paste and try them. I tried scanning them on my PRO-137 and I can hear my voice very fast as soon I lock on in one of the frequencies. but my scanner is not that fast scanning so.

Here is the frequencies

902.0250
902.2750
902.5250
902.7750
903.0250
903.2750
903.5250
903.7750
904.0250
904.2750
904.5250
904.7750
905.0250
905.2750
905.5250
905.7750
906.0250
906.2750
906.5250
906.7750
907.0250
907.2750
907.5250
907.7750
908.0250
908.2750
908.5250
908.7750
909.0250
909.2750
909.5250
909.7750
910.0250
910.2750
910.5250
910.7750
911.0250
911.2750
911.5250
911.7750
912.0250
912.2750
912.5250
912.7750
913.0250
913.2750
913.5250
913.7750
914.0250
914.2750
914.5250
914.7750
915.0250
915.2750
915.5250
915.7750
916.0250
916.2750
916.5250
916.7750
917.0250
917.2750
917.5250
917.7750
918.0250
918.2750
918.5250
918.7750
919.0250
919.2750
919.5250
919.7750
920.0250
920.2750
920.5250
920.7750
921.0250
921.2750
921.5250
921.7750
922.0250
922.2750
922.5250
922.7750
923.0250
923.2750
923.5250
923.7750
924.0250
924.2750
924.5250
924.7750
925.0250
925.2750
925.5250
925.7750
926.0250
926.2750
926.5250
926.7750
927.0250
927.5250
927.7750

There are 700 possible frequencies according to TriSquare.

Funny, I tried the same thing you did with the scanner and was lucky to get a full second of audio. I am sure, that if someone really wanted to, they could enter all 700 channels in a series of scanners, say 50-100 ea. scanner. They would have to be fast scanning receivers, but I think it's doable because the FH in the TriSquare is only 2.5 hops p/sec.

With my test gear I can lock on to the TriSquare easily, but yes you have to be close in. I never tried a range test. You can extend your receive with a gain type antenna or yagi.

Of course all of the above is for test purposes and 99.99% of the people out there would never go to such an extent, but it is doable if someone were so inclined or had a reason to want to listen in.

I like the TriSquare, but prefer the Motorola DTR. I programmed in 9 public channels and 1 private channel I created using the programmer to create my unique 11-digit code. I found a few gen 2 DTR's on Ebay for less than $150/ea. Also have 2 gen 1's that I had to pay $249 a pop for. I know they are more expensive, but I like the additional security of having VSELP digital voice, the ruggedness of the radio, and the already installed longer 900MHz whips. I've always been big on privacy.

 

[RayAir]

Is imposible to scan I can only lock in one time every 3 -5 seconds and my voice can be heard for 1/4 of a second , I know it's me because I change the sound I make each time, but they're very secure.

They can be scanned using multiple scanners. I'm just saying, it can be done. It comes down to "if there's a will, there's a way. Virtually nobody will have that much incentive to do that though. Just FYI.

As far as calling them secure, I would stop short. I don't have much of a problem receiving TriSquare radio test transmissions from my test equipment.

 

[rescuecomm]

It would be nice for Tri-Square to offer a better ruggedized case and more effective antenna. The radios would have a much wider appeal to business and event planners with better sales even at a higher price.

I would have purchased four of them instead of the Motorola i355's for family comms while on vacation. If changing the antenna does not make a difference, then why does the SC Palmetto 800 (CIO) system administrators strongly advise against replacing the 800 portable antennas with stubbies? It is on their website. I find a difference with using a 15 inch MFJ antenna versus the 7 inch on my amatuer portable. Not much for sure, but about 1 to 2 S units.

Bob

 

[cdesigns]

There are 700 possible frequencies according to TriSquare.

Funny, I tried the same thing you did with the scanner and was lucky to get a full second of audio. I am sure, that if someone really wanted to, they could enter all 700 channels in a series of scanners, say 50-100 ea. scanner. They would have to be fast scanning receivers, but I think it's doable because the FH in the TriSquare is only 2.5 hops p/sec.

With my test gear I can lock on to the TriSquare easily, but yes you have to be close in. I never tried a range test. You can extend your receive with a gain type antenna or yagi.

Of course all of the above is for test purposes and 99.99% of the people out there would never go to such an extent, but it is doable if someone were so inclined or had a reason to want to listen in.

I like the TriSquare, but prefer the Motorola DTR. I programmed in 9 public channels and 1 private channel I created using the programmer to create my unique 11-digit code. I found a few gen 2 DTR's on Ebay for less than $150/ea. Also have 2 gen 1's that I had to pay $249 a pop for. I know they are more expensive, but I like the additional security of having VSELP digital voice, the ruggedness of the radio, and the already installed longer 900MHz whips. I've always been big on privacy.

You know I tried over 1 hour using signal stalking and I got 83 different frequencies, all of them with the same ending .0250, .2750, .5250, . 7750 , ranging from 902mhz to 927mhz.

I think when trisquare says 700 possible frequencies is because they might use a CT tone or DCS and called a new frequency, I really don't know

either way is really secure

 

[KD8DVR]

You know I tried over 1 hour using signal stalking and I got 83 different frequencies, all of them with the same ending .0250, .2750, .5250, . 7750 , ranging from 902mhz to 927mhz.

I think when trisquare says 700 possible frequencies is because they might use a CT tone or DCS and called a new frequency, I really don't know

either way is really secure

No.. what they said was correct.

You did your frequency search on only one "channel". There are 10 billion. If you go to a different channel, you will find they add or take away certain frequencies from the "hop-set". This helps allow for the 10 billion virtual channel combinatrion.

 

[cdesigns]

No.. what they said was correct.

You did your frequency search on only one "channel". There are 10 billion. If you go to a different channel, you will find they add or take away certain frequencies from the "hop-set". This helps allow for the 10 billion virtual channel combinatrion.

Opps you're right I forgot about the other channels hmmm,

They are limited to 260,000 frequencies thought, I will try to scan the other channels and create the table for each channel and combine all frequencies I find.

This is what I found so far:

Ch 0 = 902-928 frequencies ending on:
.0250
.2750
.5250
.7750

Ch 1 = 902-928 frequencies ending on:
.2000
.4500
.7000
.9500

Ch 2 = 902-928 frequencies ending on:
.1250
.6250
.7250
.8750

and so on: They only have 4 different endings on each channel.

 

[RayAir]

TriSquare Specs

Here's the specs you're looking for:

TriSquare TSX300 Specifications:
• FCC ID: O9GTSX300
• Transmitter: 1-watt ERP; FHSS 906.275–923.750 MHz
• 700 hopping frequencies; 25-kHz spacing, 400-msec/hop
• 10 billion virtual channels (unique frequency-hopping
patterns)
• Transmission protocol: Half-duplex TDMA
• 4.0 kHz FM RF deviation (nominal)
• 3.0 kHz compressed audio bandwidth (nominal)

And I found another site that has some reviews of these radios if you want to peruse it.
http://www.twowayradioforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=129

 

[texasemt13]

Man ya'll are beating this eEXRS horse dead.

I have two and they suck. I've done urban range tests (had a friend do beach range tests on flat sand) and I couldn't get more than about a 1/4 mile. At the beach they didn't do much better.

First, admitting you're modding these, to illegal standards, isn't smart, considering you post your GMRS call.

If you wanna talk reliably- get your tech license. First, it's easy, and completely legal to push a lot of wattage (get handhelds and put amplifiers on them if you want a "cool" handheld). Second, you seem interested in all the technical aspects- get into different modes besides voice if you'd like.

You seem like you have a lot of know how to be wasting it on GMRS.

Wanna know why I think Trisquare is a bunch of bs? I pulled this from there FAQs.

"What is the output power of eXRS radios?
The output power is 1Watt, which is plenty of power for normal two-way radio use conditions. Under normal use conditions, higher power does not provide additional range, but does deplete the batteries more quickly."

Really? then why do radio stations operate in kilowatts or megawatts? It can't be because they want more range- they must want their batteries to run out quicker.

The FAQ also claims the eXRSs are "interference free" and the reason that TriSquare "refuses to play the mileage game" is because they tried their radios out themselves...

I like that you want to improve your rigs- but expecting too much out of a "toy" is just asking too much. Keep in mind that sometimes these units were built with only 1 watt in mind and you could fry some components.

 

[rescuecomm]

First, admitting you're modding these, to illegal standards, isn't smart, considering you post your GMRS call.

Yawn!!

I am sure that the FCC Swat team is getting ready with flash bangs and CS gas to enter his house.

There have been unlicensed hunters using 2 meter radios for the last 6 weeks in NW South Carolina and there has been no interest, intervention, or emails. So I am sure that they give a "rats butt" about someone modding a 1 watt spread spectrum radio for greater range.

Bob

 

[cdesigns]

Yawn!!

I am sure that the FCC Swat team is getting ready with flash bangs and CS gas to enter his house.

There have been unlicensed hunters using 2 meter radios for the last 6 weeks in NW South Carolina and there has been no interest, intervention, or emails. So I am sure that they give a "rats butt" about someone modding a 1 watt spread spectrum radio for greater range.

Bob

It's funny, you know how many Licensed ham users have modified radio equipment, I know people that uses their FT-8800R with MARS/CAP mod and transmit on GMRS, they will tell you on air that they have a Part 95 radio but it's BS.

 

[scnnr]

It's funny, you know how many Licensed ham users have modified radio equipment, I know people that uses their FT-8800R with MARS/CAP mod and transmit on GMRS, they will tell you on air that they have a Part 95 radio but it's BS.

Exactly.

How is the mod's, 'new antennas' working out on the Radios? Or have you not tested them out yet.

 

[texasemt13]

So because others break the law it's okay for me?

Wow... when I got my ticket I signed a license, giving my word to not break federal law. It not a 1 watt issue- when is giving your word not worth anything anymore?

Especially you rescuecomm: "Extra Class Op.?" C'mon, you of all people should not promote things like this. You're an "extra" but you don't seem to act like one. I'm a tech with more class than that.

 

[RayAir]

So how's the range tests going??

 

[cdesigns]

I'm in Puerto Rico right now, and I only took my i355 radios with me, as soon I finished packing I realize I had to many things to carry with me, so I didn't take the GMRS or TRISQUARE radios with me.

The only test I have done is around my neighborhood clear comunication on 0.6 miles thru houses.

I will do more test as soon I get back, so far it works good.

As far as the antenna's mod law, I still can't find a direct section saying that you can't modified the fixed antenna, I might be wrong but so far I haven't found anything yet. other than I can't use more than 1 watt and a directional antenna with more than 6dBi.

 

[rescuecomm]

Especially you rescuecomm: "Extra Class Op.?" C'mon, you of all people should not promote things like this. You're an "extra" but you don't seem to act like one. I'm a tech with more class than that.

Merely stating the facts as I see them. He is not going out of band, modding the RF power amp adding harmonics, or interfering with anyone. The radio is still within the required ERP mandated. Basically you would be saying that since I changed my i355's pull out antenna for the i325's fixed antenna, I am in violation too? Seems like a rather mundane project to get worked up about. I would rather the FCC chase the 2 meter bootleggers off our repeater input than go after cdesigns 1 watt radio.

More a matter of priorities really.

Bob

 

[SkipSanders]

FCC regulations, Section 15.203 specifies that the antenna of an intentional radiator (which these radios come under) may not be changed. Posted earlier in the thread.

The section regarding power, and antenna gain, applies only to the designer of the radios to be accepted under Part 15, not the end user.

 

[cdesigns]

Further, this requirement does not apply to intentional radiators that
must be professionally installed, such as perimeter protection systems
and some field disturbance sensors, or to other intentional radiators
which, in accordance with Sec. 15.31(d), must be measured at the
installation site. However, the installer shall be responsible for
ensuring that the proper antenna is employed so that the limits in this
part are not exceeded.

^^^^^^^ I have no equipment to test this antennas but I dont think they will be between specs required.

Either way I will take responsability when swat enters my house because the interferance my radio makes

 

[lmrtek]

GREAT SECURITY poor range

The most important aspect of the trisquare is frequency hopping spread spectrum.
It gives them better security than the scramble available on a very few frs/gmrs radios.

1 watt at 900mhz sounds like plenty but in actual use, multipath causes these units to loose sync
I use mine at no greater than 1 mile outdoors.
My 500mw motorola FRS with scramble easily out distances the trisquares and is easier on batteries.