Wal-Mart Incident Today

[MTS2000des]

Maybe it is time to write the FCC and make them aware of the practice that local Walmart's have literally overtaken the MURS band and due to their size and number of locations and should be utilizing coordinated/licensed Part 90 frequencies instead like so many other businesses. It isn't like they don't have the money.

IMHO they are abusing the spirit of Part 95 and they act like they are their "exclusive use" channels.

WalMart had licenses in many districts for 154.57 and 154.600, but most expired first of this year and weren't renewed. Do a quick ULS search for Wal-Mart and notice they didn't renew any low power license on MURS channels.

That being said, more people play with Wal-Mart, they will call up BearComm and order TRBO radios or iDAS with encryption...

wait, scratch that, they're too cheap.

 

[kruser]

That being said, more people play with Wal-Mart, they will call up BearComm and order TRBO radios or iDAS with encryption...

wait, scratch that, they're too cheap.

Are those modulation types (and encryption) even allowed on MURS frequencies?
If not, then they would need to acquire frequencies and licenses again.

 

[MTS2000des]

Are those modulation types (and encryption) even allowed on MURS frequencies?
If not, then they would need to acquire frequencies and licenses again.

Never said they would use them on MURS/FRS.
If you check the ULS, WalMart has a ton of active IG licenses all over the spectrum, mostly UHF. Some are nationwide. Would be easy to do an emission change and sell them iDAS or TRBO radios, though I'm sure Bearcom (who handles most of their licensing) has already tried.

But this is WALMART we're talking about....cheap is as cheap does. Until someone starts selling "bubble pack" grade DMR or iDAS radios, I wouldn't lose any sleep just yet.

 

[MeddleMan]

At the end of all of this...

...I have decided to conclude the following:

1) Shop at Walmart only when necessary.

2) Conceal any radios. This is so that I and any member of my party is not confused as to be of any illegal nature. I listen to a "scanner" as I see fit. I like to find many wireless devices. I'm a nut. I confess.

3) Use GMRS at my leisure with any family member as I see fit. After all, I have spent my money to be licensed as such. I find it cheaper to contact my party without calling them on the cell phone. If an entity finds within their own rules that it is a bad idea to allow their "patrons" to use similar products, even in a legitimate manner, they should not expect to sell or carry similar items.

4) I am glad that Walmart and others cannot and do not use other radio services in which they are not allowed. Let's not forget that MURS falls under the same rules as the Citizen Band as all the other Citizen Bands (LHF/VHF/UHF). We know what the rules are. Last time I checked, Walmart operates well within the limits of the USA. They should not be able to prohibit legal use of any wireless device by consumers especially within a store. They do not regulate the spectrum under their roof, I would guess. It might be an extra effort on quality control to big brother communication on the same monitored frequencies.

 

[ipfd320]

All This JIBBER JABBER about WALLY WORLD RADIOS--- it just Keeps Going Back to SQUARE 1---Here is the REAL QUESTION---Why Dosen,t WALL-MART have PL,S Set in their RADIOS

Don,t you Think That would solve the Problem SOMEWHAT???

Just my Point of Viw on this Matter

 

[jhooten]

No. Any decent quality scanner and most current amateur radios have PL scan. It wouldn't take much effort to find the PL they are using and plug it your unit.

 

[kruser]

Never said they would use them on MURS/FRS.

But this is WALMART we're talking about....cheap is as cheap does. Until someone starts selling "bubble pack" grade DMR or iDAS radios, I wouldn't lose any sleep just yet.

I did assume you were talking about their MURS use from your statement about people "playing with Walmart". My bad for assuming that one.
I do truly hope people do not "play" with them on their licensed frequencies! In reality, nobody should play with them on the MURS frequencies either. Even though it is license free, it still carries rules.

Speaking of "bubble pack" radios, do they sell MURS capable radios in bubble packs yet? I suspect not and that is the likely reason all the MURS channels around here are as quiet as they are.
As far as bubble pack DMR or iDAS radios go, Walmart or Sam's Club will probably be the first ones to sell them when the little Chinese guys start making them dirt cheap. Assuming they can get FCC type acceptance which I'm sure they could as the FCC accepts about everything these days with little regard about how much crud they emit! They sure as heck won't certify a receiver that covers the old AMPS band or does not have epoxy over the bandswitching circuitry. Go figure.

 

[kruser]

...I have decided to conclude the following:

1) Shop at Walmart only when necessary.

2) Conceal any radios. This is so that I and any member of my party is not confused as to be of any illegal nature. I listen to a "scanner" as I see fit. I like to find many wireless devices. I'm a nut. I confess.

3) Use GMRS at my leisure with any family member as I see fit. After all, I have spent my money to be licensed as such. I find it cheaper to contact my party without calling them on the cell phone. If an entity finds within their own rules that it is a bad idea to allow their "patrons" to use similar products, even in a legitimate manner, they should not expect to sell or carry similar items.

4) I am glad that Walmart and others cannot and do not use other radio services in which they are not allowed. Let's not forget that MURS falls under the same rules as the Citizen Band as all the other Citizen Bands (LHF/VHF/UHF). We know what the rules are. Last time I checked, Walmart operates well within the limits of the USA. They should not be able to prohibit legal use of any wireless device by consumers especially within a store. They do not regulate the spectrum under their roof, I would guess. It might be an extra effort on quality control to big brother communication on the same monitored frequencies.

I agree with all you said but as has been pointed out, Walmart stores are private property so they are in their right to not allow certain activities or devices including radio devices if they so choose. Just like a movie theatre bans (poor attempts anyway) cell phones and pagers.
If it is something that could get you banned from their stores with possible criminal trespass charges down the road, those rules should be publicly posted on their websites and at the entrance into the buildings or at their property borders. Ignorance of the law is no excuse but when different "private rules" apply to a private business, ignorance of those rules should be excusable if the rules are not publicly posted. And how do you know they did not just make up a new rule just because they felt like it. I'd guess they have a blanket rule that could ban you for creating any kind of "disturbance".

How can they turn using a MURS radio into a trespass charge anyway? Or does that happen after you have been banned and then caught on their property again at a later date? Some of the posts in this thread make me feel you could be charged with a trespass violation for doing as the OP did.
Is a trespass charge a criminal or civil offense?

With all that said, I've never had a problem at a Walmart or Walmart owned store but I do try to stay out of their stores and I don't stir up trouble when I do visit one of their stores or any store for that matter.

I don't consider what the OP did as stirring up trouble either. If the manager did not like it, he could have just kindly asked the OP to not do that in the future.
It's pretty bad when you cannot say "Thank You" via a legal form of communications to those that just helped you.

 

[ThomasMcKean]

Maybe it is time to write the FCC and make them aware of the practice that local Walmart's have literally overtaken the MURS band and due to their size and number of locations and should be utilizing coordinated/licensed Part 90 frequencies instead like so many other businesses. It isn't like they don't have the money.

IMHO they are abusing the spirit of Part 95 and they act like they are their "exclusive use" channels.

I love this idea. I might just do that! But alas how much yew wanna bet it would be a complete waste of time?

 

[SCPD]

yew wanna bet it would be a complete waste of time?

Like this thread?

 

[bob-the-scanner-man]

The way Walmart erodes this country, they should be forced to acquire licenses and purchase radios made in this country for all stores and distribution centers.:roll: They can afford it. The way our government seems to be in bed with large corporations and what not, I'm surprised they have not given Walmart a few exclusive use frequencies in exchange for free toilet paper or something.
It would be like the nationwide mutual aid channel but it would be the nationwide walmart channel.

On another note, since this thread came up I've been scanning the MURS channels again. I usually do have them scanning but not as often as I have in the past. Anyway, around 1 AM this morning, I heard the St. Louis County police helicopter come up on 154.600. It sounded like they were trying to contact some at Spirit airport which is their hanger and refueling point. Of course nobody responded.
I don't know what kind of radio equipment they have in their copters these days but they have had the ability to come up on about any frequency out there. Years ago I'd hear them come up on other municipalites frequencies with the correct tones and all so they could get into their repeaters or open the squelch on whomever they wanted to talk with.
They still do this to this day. I've heard them come up on the city of st. louis P25 system even and using different talkgroups.
I always wondered how they key all the info in as they fly around.
I'd like to have a copy of whatever list they use to lookup the info! I'd imagine most is programmed into whatever radios they carry today but no way was that possible back when they first started doing this.
I remember when I first heard them on other muni freqs, it was not long after a radio made by Wilson (I think) came out. That radio had FPP and a sloped front panel with full numeric keypad for frequency entry. It looked similar to some of the earlier AOR scanners. I'm pretty sure it was Wilson though that made the radios. I figured they must have had at least two as the radios could not do both UHF and VHF back then. Who knows what they have today.
Mostly the county copters use the local RIOT channel (154.725) when working with other muni's but they do have the ability to come up about anywhere and will come up on the frequencies for whomever they are helping.
One place I've never heard them on is our states VHF low band frequencies.
Why they came up on 154.600 this morning was a mystery. I'd bet the radio is putting out over 2 watts! Probablly not much more though as they don't really need much power due to being in the air. I know when they are working in the county, their signal level does drop off pretty quick when they get more than 15 miles or so away so I assume they are using fairly low power radios. Even with the low power, you can still hear them pretty well but no chance of hearing those on the ground that they are talking with unless they jumped onto a muni with a repeater.

Funny you should mention that. There's a local fire department here that uses 151.88mhz for its fireground frequency . Kind of surprising; you'd think they'd just license another frequency in the public safety band. At least they do use pl tones.

 

[ThomasMcKean]

Like this thread?

Pretty much. YES!

Gave some thought today about filing a complaint with the FCC. I doubt it would help but I do love the "disabled man takes on uncaring giant corporation" thing.

But I suspect the best thing to do would be just to let the manager continue to thump his chest and think he is ALL THAT.

 

[SCPD]

Funny you should mention that. There's a local fire department here that uses 151.88mhz for its fireground frequency . Kind of surprising; you'd think they'd just license another frequency in the public safety band. At least they do use pl tones.

Yes Trussville FD and I bet they use more than 2 watts,if I was a betting man I bet their radio shop told them no one would bother them...lol

 

[ThomasMcKean]

One interesting thing I noticed about this thread is a lack of consensus on what walmart's rights are.

Some say they don't own the frequency, others say that as long as one is under their roof, one has to live by their rules.

So the question is, DO they have the authority to tell yew not to use a public frequency when yew are on their property, OR is the frequency public and use is allowed regardless?

 

[MTS2000des]

One interesting thing I noticed about this thread is a lack of consensus on what walmart's rights are.

Some say they don't own the frequency, others say that as long as one is under their roof, one has to live by their rules.

So the question is, DO they have the authority to tell yew not to use a public frequency when yew are on their property, OR is the frequency public and use is allowed regardless?

The issue is simple. Walmart is a private business, and they can allow/prohibit anything on their premises the same way you can tell me I can't bring my radios, guns, knives, or whatever into your home. Rules don't have to be posted. In my state, if I ask you to leave and you don't you become a criminal trespasser.

I have this same discussion with open carry crowd, you cannot expect your rights to supersede the rights of others. What you do on a public street is NOT the same on someone else's private property. The same way you can have rules on your property, so can someone else. If I come on your property and disrespect you, even with no mal intent, and you ask me to leave, that is your right, FCC rules and radio use have little impact on the true nature of your situation. I don't have to post my rules, I can make them up as I go. Your option is to leave my property, the same way you can do so as you see fit in your home or business.

You entered upon the private property of another and did something they found offensive, and they asked you to cease and desist doing so on their property.

I fail to see the problem with this.

 

[ThomasMcKean]

The issue is simple. Walmart is a private business, and they can allow/prohibit anything on their premises the same way you can tell me I can't bring my radios, guns, knives, or whatever into your home. Rules don't have to be posted. In my state, if I ask you to leave and you don't you become a criminal trespasser.

I have this same discussion with open carry crowd, you cannot expect your rights to supersede the rights of others. What you do on a public street is NOT the same on someone else's private property. The same way you can have rules on your property, so can someone else. If I come on your property and disrespect you, even with no mal intent, and you ask me to leave, that is your right, FCC rules and radio use have little impact on the true nature of your situation. I don't have to post my rules, I can make them up as I go. Your option is to leave my property, the same way you can do so as you see fit in your home or business.

You entered upon the private property of another and did something they found offensive, and they asked you to cease and desist doing so on their property.

I fail to see the problem with this.

Well okay then, I guess that explains that!

 

[Confuzzled]

One interesting thing I noticed about this thread is a lack of consensus on what walmart's rights are.

Some say they don't own the frequency, others say that as long as one is under their roof, one has to live by their rules.

So the question is, DO they have the authority to tell yew not to use a public frequency when yew are on their property, OR is the frequency public and use is allowed regardless?

They can tell YOU what to do when YOU are on their property. Or they can keep YOU off their property.

If you're off their property, but still within radio range, they can't do anything about your jabbering on the channel. Unless maybe they can make a case for jamming.

If you're sitting out there badmouthing the store or their employees, they might be able to do something. But if you're just yakking with a 'friend' about the weather, they're SOL.

 

[gewecke]

A few posts ago, someone asked if there are any "bubble pack" MURS radios?
I've never seen any, has anyone else seen legit MURS radios offered to the consumer?? Other than the mobile that r/s marketed and the moto P10 that had their logo on it, I'm not aware of any.

73,
n9zas

 

[Zagadka]

but I do love the "disabled man takes on uncaring giant corporation" thing.

I note that , save for bob-the-scanner-man who likely had his tongue firmly planted in his cheek, no one has answered my question about using radios to harass other businesses. I think Brother McKean gives us the reason why - it's OK, even fashionable, to mess with Walmart. Radio is just another, "cooler", way to do that. Kinda' sad really.

 

[gewecke]

I note that , save for bob-the-scanner-man who likely had his tongue firmly planted in his cheek, no one has answered my question about using radios to harass other businesses. I think Brother McKean gives us the reason why - it's OK, even fashionable, to mess with Walmart. Radio is just another, "cooler", way to do that. Kinda' sad really.

To attempt to answer your question, I myself might attempt to ask a question or ask for assistance at another business on "their" channel as long as that store or corporation was using a frequency I was licensed for, or legal to use.
Menards was the only other place I can say that I have talked to a assosciate on 154.570/ 179.9pl to request help with loading a large grill.
They had no problem with me doing so.

73,
n9zas