XG-100M and features

[mancow]

So, the hhch needs a canbus adapter or translation box or whatever that is with the can connectors and the DB25?

Mobile - 7/800 MHz - Used-Radios.com

used-radios.com

 

[BMDaug]

So, the hhch needs a canbus adapter or translation box or whatever that is with the can connectors and the DB25?

Mobile - 7/800 MHz - Used-Radios.com

used-radios.com

Yes, see attached picture. The side opposite the visible db25 male is a db25 female which can use standard CH-XXX accessory cables.

-B

Edit: Attachment did not post…

 

[mancow]

Interesting. I wonder if it's just a CAN to RS485 or 232 level conversion of if some other stuff is going on.

 

[BMDaug]

Interesting. I wonder if it's just a CAN to RS485 or 232 level conversion of if some other stuff is going on.

Well… it offers all the same accessory options as the CH100/721… so you have digital inputs and outputs, discriminator output, a 2W audio amplifier, external mic input, serial I/O, hook switch, etc. so it’s much more than an adapter…

-B

 

[BMDaug]

I suppose, you could potentially make a direct connection looking at the diagram… assuming there isn’t anything active in the box and everything takes place inside the 731 itself, but I’m not willing to try it.

-B

 

[mancow]

That diagram is pure gold. Hell there's nothing to it at all. It's direct connect. Super easy!

 

[BMDaug]

That diagram is pure gold. Hell there's nothing to it at all. It's direct connect. Super easy! If I can find a cheap hand held control I will do it.

I hope you are right! I’m used to wiring diagrams being over-simplified for the sake of the end user. That’s from an installation manual, not from a technical document. If you find a cheap 731 and do decide to try it, please report back!

-B

 

[mancow]

I hope you are right! I’m used to wiring diagrams being over-simplified for the sake of the end user. That’s from an installation manual, not from a technical document. If you find a cheap 731 and do decide to try it, please report back!

-B

I'm sure it's correct. It makes perfect sense for them to do it that way. Everything else is CAN driven, why not the hand held control?

So am I thinking correctly that the 44 to 25 would be needed as well? I found a diagram for that on line. I suppose a guy could use a 44 pin cable to one of the single sided 25 breakout boxes and eliminate a step.

 

[BMDaug]

I'm sure it's correct. It makes perfect sense for them to do it that way. Everything else is CAN driven, why not the hand held control?

I believe that you can get the HHC working via direct wire, but I’m not positive that all inputs and outputs are properly isolated, so just be careful! Looking at the photos, there are some transformers in there (edit: in the HHC itself), but it doesn’t seem like there are enough of them to cover all the inputs and outputs available on the accessory port.

There are some 731s available on eBay and NLT… there are even some available in the bay for around $40 with cut wires, which seems perfect for experimenting.

I wish you lots of luck! Maybe you’re right and there’s absolutely nothing in there but wires and connectors!!!

-B

 

[mancow]

Those are likely going to be switching voltage regulation smd inductors for the various logic devices.

 

[BMDaug]

Those are likely going to be switching voltage regulation smd inductors for the various logic devices.

Ya, I am being generous and assuming there are more on the other side of the PCB, but ya, that’s also likely, which furthers my point… If you aren’t connecting any accessories, I believe that you can create a robust solution, but if you plan to use a variety of accessories and/or external I/O, just heed this warning…

Personally, I followed the instructions in the manual for making a headset connection and I used that to create a headphone output (unbalanced line level inputs handle it well too!) and I have a sound card interface connected to input 1 set to Alt. PTT. So I need the accessories to work reliably.

I’m lazy and like screw terminals… so I’d use that part. I don’t know the exact part number you’re referring to regarding the 44:25 cable, but AFAIK, that is not the same pinout. The 44pin does not carry canbus.

The XL-200M HHC plugs into the 44pin on the back of the MRU AFAIK… It’s a color screen version of the current 731, but with a 44 pin connector at the end instead of a 25 pin.

-B

 

[mancow]

Looking at page 79 of the installation manual HARRIS TR-0060-E M7300/M5300 Mobile Radio User Manual Manual 1 it doesn't show or talk of any use of the CA-12349-001 44 pin options cable at all. I'm thinking it's doing everything via CANbus just like the CH-721 does such as display data, control and digitized mic audio except provide amplified audio. They say you still have to source audio from the rear of the radio since it doesn't have an audio output amplifier like the CH-721. From what I'm seeing you are correct that CANbus is not available at the 44 pin Dsub.

Unless I'm missing something, but I read through that section until it started talking about the CH-721. They ended the discussion with the CANbus and power connections to the CA-018399-001 adapter box then it being secured in its holder. I don't understand what its purpose in life is though. Maybe it can be driven through the CA-012349-001 options cable through that box via the various data lines illustrated in it with separate analog mic etc... buses instead of CANbus.

 

[BMDaug]

Looking at page 79 of the installation manual HARRIS TR-0060-E M7300/M5300 Mobile Radio User Manual Manual 1 it doesn't show or talk of any use of the CA-12349-001 44 pin options cable at all. I'm thinking it's doing everything via CANbus just like the CH-721 does such as display data, control and digitized mic audio except provide amplified audio. They say you still have to source audio from the rear of the radio since it doesn't have an audio output amplifier like the CH-721. From what I'm seeing you are correct that CANbus is not available at the 44 pin Dsub.

Unless I'm missing something, but I read through that section until it started talking about the CH-721. They ended the discussion with the CANbus and power connections to the CA-018399-001 adapter box then it being secured in its holder. I don't understand what its purpose in life is though. Maybe it can be driven through the CA-012349-001 options cable through that box via the various data lines illustrated in it with separate analog mic etc... buses instead of CANbus.

They are doing everything via canbus between the MRU and interface box/731… There is a two watt audio amp somewhere in the interface box or 731. I have it wired up to drive headphones on a normal 3.5mm audio jack and of course the mic is built in to the 731.

Someone in the thread was wondering about using the 44:25 option cable to drive the 731, but that’s not possible. You can still use the 44pin for sourcing audio to a speaker and you can still use the 25pin on the interface box for I/O and that’s where things could get tricky… for instance, Harris could have placed transformers or other isolators/decouplers in the interface box to properly isolate various inputs and outputs. That’s just a guess though…

Regardless, most of the I/O is duplicated on the 44pin so just run I/O from there and connect only canbus and power to the 731 and it should work!

-B

 

[redbeard]

Every head for the 7200/53007300/100M is CAN. Period. Including the front mount heads.

Looking at the schematic it should be easy enough to make a 25-pin with power and a CAN pigtail for the 731 to connect to.

Anyone swapping between front and dash mount, you are more likely to find a head in the config you want vs the conversion parts and having to do the serial terminal incantation. The back half of both the 721 and 100 heads contains the audio amp and accessory interfaces essentially.

Dash mount 5300/7300/75M are a good source for cheap parts. Despite being more capable (P25 Phase 2) than 800MHz XTL mobiles, they find themselves in the same price bracket...one step up from e-waste.

 

[brian86]

So I used a breakout board and followed the Schematic, Running the Can Bus + to Pin 1, Can Bus - to Pin 2, Shielding to pin 7 and provided DC Power + to pins 21 and 22(Sense), Power - to Pin 7. The result was nothing. I may have to check the programming of the radio, but assuming all can bus devices operate the same pressing the power button on the HHC731 should have summonsed a response. So back to the drawling board.... NLT has the HHC731 Wiring Harness new for $170. I ordered one so at the very least I can check and make sure the HHC731 I have actually works.

I am open to suggestions if anyone has any.

 

[mancow]

Maybe try dropping a 120 ohm resistor across the can lines???

 

[brian86]

Correction....

The configuration above does work (without the 120ohm), I can confirm that. The HHC731 I have has a short in the DB25 Cable just below
the HHC. Keeping the HHC731 cable in the un-shorted position all works great, fully functional. (looks like Big M unprogrammed this radio after an upgrade)

 

[mancow]

Excellent!

 

[redbeard]

Nice. Shame you will need a new cord. Unless you want to hack off the DB25 and start over with a new metal AMP connector.

Regarding termination, since the HHC only has one CAN connector we should assume it's self terminating inside the head.

Edit: sorry I misread, it's below the head not above the DB25. That sucks. A new cable is part number: 14002-0145-02. That includes the cable attached to a new rear housing.

 

[prcguy]

With this set

Correction....

The configuration above does work (without the 120ohm), I can confirm that. The HHC731 I have has a short in the DB25 Cable just below
the HHC. Keeping the HHC731 cable in the un-shorted position all works great, fully functional. (looks like Big M unprogrammed this radio after an upgrade)

View attachment 139382

With this setup it looks like you would have to use the 44 pin connector to get speaker audio out of the radio.