Yaesu And APCO P25 Amateur Radio Gear
- Thread starter JASII
- Start date
- Status
I'm still new to this area of ham radio so please correct me if I'm wrong. When I search for C4FM one of the first hits is the Wikipedia article for P25. Project 25 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. It seems like the description of the Yaesu FT1D fits the Phase I P25 description.
I've also got the AARL VHF Digital Handbook on my desk. I've been reading up on this to try to learn more. It seems like the description of the Yaesu FT1D fits pretty well with the description of P25 Phase I on page 6-2 of that book. "Phase 1 radio systems operate in 12.5 kHz analog, digital or mixed mode. Phase 1 radios use continuous 4-level FM (C4FM) modulation for digital transmissions at 4800 baud and 2 bits per symbol, which yields 9600 bits per second total throughput."
Is the Yaesu FT1D not a Phase I P25 radio?
Bret - W9JY
I've also got the AARL VHF Digital Handbook on my desk. I've been reading up on this to try to learn more. It seems like the description of the Yaesu FT1D fits pretty well with the description of P25 Phase I on page 6-2 of that book. "Phase 1 radio systems operate in 12.5 kHz analog, digital or mixed mode. Phase 1 radios use continuous 4-level FM (C4FM) modulation for digital transmissions at 4800 baud and 2 bits per symbol, which yields 9600 bits per second total throughput."
Is the Yaesu FT1D not a Phase I P25 radio?
Bret - W9JY
W2NJS
Member
W9JY,
You are incorrect. The FT1D is not compatible with present, commonly used, P25 systems. Yaesu has even admitted this to be true.
Yaesu does make very good P25 commercial radios, but none specifically for the amateur market.
You are incorrect. The FT1D is not compatible with present, commonly used, P25 systems. Yaesu has even admitted this to be true.
Yaesu does make very good P25 commercial radios, but none specifically for the amateur market.
That's disappointing as the descriptions sound so similar. I wonder how hard it will be to get it working on the existing repeaters. I wonder how the FT1D would even be used otherwise. Would it require clubs to purchase all new repeaters?
Bret - W9JY
Bret - W9JY
I have been interested in doing some P25 stuff with Ham radio since I already have two P25 radios. I was excited when I heard that Yaesu was going to put out a C4FM capable Ham Radio, I was very disappointed to hear that it was not compatible. I fear we are going to get to the point that we have the technology to use digital voice but then everyone has to get the same gear. D-Star, Yaesu Digital, or P25.
I feel that since P25 was meant as a standard for public safety that there is no reason not to market it for Amateur use also, instead of coming up with new modes.
I feel that since P25 was meant as a standard for public safety that there is no reason not to market it for Amateur use also, instead of coming up with new modes.
W2NJS
Member
So far no one has advanced any reasonable theory as to why Yaesu did what they did with the FT1D. With the availability of P25, Nexedge, D-Star, and other digital modes it really doesn't seem to make any sense.
Does anyone know the actual digital mode(s) the FT1D uses? From the research I've done I've seen a lot of speculation but I haven't been able to find a definitive answer. I downloaded the user manual from the FCC site that was posted in another thread. They just have T.B.D. on the page for the digital mode settings. Who's to say this thing couldn't do P25 as well as some of the other commercial modes?
Bret - W9JY
Bret - W9JY
kayn1n32008
ØÆSØ Say it, say 'ENCRYPTION'
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9780; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.8+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/6.0.0.600 Mobile Safari/534.8+)
People with P25, TRBO, and NXDN gear have tried to communicate with the Yaesu at Dayton.
People with P25, TRBO, and NXDN gear have tried to communicate with the Yaesu at Dayton.
that's interesting. i did not know that.
Yaesu's FT1D is a bad marketing flub on their part! They should have never released that radio with it's current format!
They expected the masses to jump on it with little to no homework being done and credit card in hand!
Way bad financial move for yaesu, not to mention ignoring what the consumers need!
73,
n9zas
Some Ham will hack it for P25 give it time.
I don't think so since the firmware doesn't support P25. That would be like trying to add 4wd to a kia, It's just not likely or worth the effort.
Yaesu screwed the monkey by producing that talkie. :roll:
73,
n9zas
kayn1n32008
ØÆSØ Say it, say 'ENCRYPTION'
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9780; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.8+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/6.0.0.600 Mobile Safari/534.8+)
Best statement yet about their digital entry into ham digital
gewecke said:
Best statement yet about their digital entry into ham digital
Last edited:
It sure is heart-warming to see how you open-minded, non-judgmental folks have pre-determined that Yaesu's digital handheld will be a failure.
Granted, it may fail. It may also be the greatest thing since the transistor. But we really won't know until the radio hits the market and Yaesu tells us more about what the radio can do.
I have no financial interest in Yaesu other than owning several of their products nor do I have inside information about their plans. Just sayin'...
Granted, it may fail. It may also be the greatest thing since the transistor. But we really won't know until the radio hits the market and Yaesu tells us more about what the radio can do.
I have no financial interest in Yaesu other than owning several of their products nor do I have inside information about their plans. Just sayin'...
I hope it turns out to be something cool. Just have to wait and see.
Bret - W9JY
Bret - W9JY
Yaesu
They had a few at Dayton back in May and they told me it was not P25, D-Star, TRBO or NXDN. It was their own format. So maybe their format will do something different and better then the rest. Time will tell.
They had a few at Dayton back in May and they told me it was not P25, D-Star, TRBO or NXDN. It was their own format. So maybe their format will do something different and better then the rest. Time will tell.
I'm concerned that the digital voice of their C4FM will pass through my Quantars and I won't be able to monitor it with my P25 radios. It would be no different than if someone was running encryption, except it wouldn't be an FCC rule violation on them.
We don't need another digital format.
Is the Yaesu Capable of NAC ?
kayn1n32008
ØÆSØ Say it, say 'ENCRYPTION'
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9780; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.8+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/6.0.0.600 Mobile Safari/534.8+)
Alinco tried doing DV. How many people run Alinco DV? Along came IRLP, and ECHOLink, then WIRES... We already have DSTAR, P25, NXDN, and TRBO. Of which all 4 are starting to see wide spread use some more than others depending on local intrests.
I hope Yaesu is sucessful, I just cannot see it happening.
W9RXR said:
Alinco tried doing DV. How many people run Alinco DV? Along came IRLP, and ECHOLink, then WIRES... We already have DSTAR, P25, NXDN, and TRBO. Of which all 4 are starting to see wide spread use some more than others depending on local intrests.
I hope Yaesu is sucessful, I just cannot see it happening.
- Status
Similar threads
