146.520!

[zz0468]

What's the big attraction for using the .52 National Simplex Calling Frequency for long winded QSO's? Do hams do this on the 2 meter SSB calling frequency? Why not use .52 it for what it is... a CALLING frequency.

Part of the problem is the actual designation as a "calling frequency". I don't know when the ARRL decided to add the designation of "calling" to the name, but I have a collection of ARRL handbooks that refer to 146.52 and 446.0 as the "National Simplex Frequency" for those bands. The ARRL webpage still refers to 446.0 as that, and 146.52 is now shown as the "National Simplex Calling Frequency", so I think we're looking at a matter of semantics, more than a hard and rigid intended use as a "calling" frequency.

You will also note that the ARRL bandplans come with the caveat that local custom takes precedent over any national band plans.

This hobby is getting more and more lax on rules and procedures. I became an amateur radio operator because, unlike C.B. radio, there are rules,regulations and procedures. There's no need for the ARRL if we don't support them,. i.e., honor the suggested band plan.

It seems to me that the problem is not so much people getting lax on procedures, but a lack of understanding what's in the rules, and what's evolved locally to deal with local customs, and how the bandplanning process even works. The ARRL bandplans themselves state that local custom takes precedent, as I stated above. That means if the locals want to use .52 as a simplex working frequency, there is no violation of any rules, there is no violation of any ARRL "official" bandplans. "Good amateur practice" could consist of extended use of .52, if local practice supports it.

How am I to know what the local/regional band plan is if I'm traveling through an area? Why not stick to the ARRL band plan so we can all be on the same sheet of music?

This is a good question, but all I can tell you is that a national bandplan doesn't necessarily work. The area I live in has long been at the forefront of FM repeaters and simplex, and the local bandplans don't even vaguely resemble the ARRL band plans, and haven't for the last 40 years. The simple reason is, the ARRL bandplan doesn't take local conditions into account that caused people out here to do things a specific way.

I believe the ham radio hobby will go by the way of the C.B. radio hobby, people ignore rules, regulations, etc., and do what they want to do and then the hobby turns into another 11 meter cesspool.

You would do well to get involved with the local frequency coordinators in your area, and participate in the various ARRL band planning functions that continuously take place. You'll soon come top appreciate that amateur band plans are not etched in stone, but rather, they're written in chalk. And every area has it's own chalkboard.

The more I think about it.... maybe the C.B. radio folks have one up on us. At least they have channel 19 designated as a road/info channel, channel 9 is the emergency channel, and channels 36-40 are used for SSB. Seems they are smarter than us after all.....

I disagree. For the most part, the people involved in developing band plans for the amateur bands are pretty sharp people. The process is less than perfect, but the efforts are admirable, and the result is usually right for a local area.

 

[AK9R]

The more I think about it.... maybe the C.B. radio folks have one up on us. At least they have channel 19 designated as a road/info channel, channel 9 is the emergency channel, and channels 36-40 are used for SSB. Seems they are smarter than us after all.....

I disagree. For the most part, the people involved in developing band plans for the amateur bands are pretty sharp people. The process is less than perfect, but the efforts are admirable, and the result is usually right for a local area.

And, it seems the FCC agrees that local management of the amateur radio VHF/UHF spectrum is A Good Thing. A few years ago, there was a proposal in front of the FCC to specify that 146.520 MHz be designated a nationwide emergency channel like CB Channel 9 or FRS Channel 1. The FCC denied the proposal saying that local usage patterns made such a designation unworkable.

 

[SCPD]

Part of the problem is the actual designation as a "calling frequency". I don't know when the ARRL decided to add the designation of "calling" to the name, but I have a collection of ARRL handbooks that refer to 146.52 and 446.0 as the "National Simplex Frequency" for those bands. The ARRL webpage still refers to 446.0 as that, and 146.52 is now shown as the "National Simplex Calling Frequency", so I think we're looking at a matter of semantics, more than a hard and rigid intended use as a "calling" frequency.

You will also note that the ARRL bandplans come with the caveat that local custom takes precedent over any national band plans.




You're making my point for me... sort of. I am aware of local customs when it comes to band plans... why have an ARRL: band plan if no one uses it? What if a ham from out of your area/state visits and commits a faux pas and doesn't adhere to "local custom"? Again, I believe the C.B. crowd has us beat. If I travel ANYWHERE in the country I know that I can hear road/traffic information on channel 19. I know that if I want to use SSB that I can find it on channels 36-40. What I don't know is that if I go to another state and try to call for a contact, on .52, that I may "violate" some local custom because, that may be the local simplex hangout and I may not be welcome there calling C.Q.

If memory serves me right, 146.520 isn't recognized as a valid frequency for contacts during a contest... neither are the adjacent frequencies of 146.505 and 146.535. It's been awhile since I contested so I may be wrong. If they're not allowed for contesting then they SHOULD be just another 2 meter simplex frequency, yes? Evidently the 'ole .52 is recognized as such albeit by the ARRL and not allowed for that purpose because it's a "calling frequency".

If no one wants to adhere to a band plan then it should be done away with. What purpose is it serving?

 

[n9mxq]

In the end, the frequency is being used.. So it's a good thing.. If only 220 (around here) would have seen that use we may not have lost part of it.

 

[zz0468]

...why have an ARRL: band plan if no one uses it?

Good question. Some of the ARRL band plans are rather useless. Some are good starting points for discussion. My question for you is, why obsess over the ARRL bandplans when the local groups have their own needs figured out? This ad hoc flexibility is one of the things that makes ham radio so useful. The ARRL serves an advisory role, not a regulatory role.

What if a ham from out of your area/state visits and commits a faux pas and doesn't adhere to "local custom"?

So what? So, this out of area ham either learns local custom, or he doesn't. Either way, life goes on.

What I don't know is that if I go to another state and try to call for a contact, on .52, that I may "violate" some local custom because, that may be the local simplex hangout and I may not be welcome there calling C.Q.

Not so. If the local's want it as a calling channel, you put your call out there, and the other guy says QSY to another channel to keep the calling channel clear. If it doesn't matter, you put your call out there and people talk to you. I really don't see what the big deal is here.

Not to be pedantic here, but calling cq on FM is a bit of a faux pas in and of itself.

...If they're not allowed for contesting then they SHOULD be just another 2 meter simplex frequency, yes? Evidently the 'ole .52 is recognized as such albeit by the ARRL and not allowed for that purpose because it's a "calling frequency".

Don't try to find deeper hidden meaning buried within ARRL contest rules. They're written by one or two guys over a pizza, and they don't always make sense when someone else looks at them.

If no one wants to adhere to a band plan then it should be done away with. What purpose is it serving?

They serve as a default suggestion and starting point for areas that are not real progressive in creating their own band plans. That's all they are intended to do. Having participated in the creation of ARRL band plans, I can tell you that the process isn't intended to be the be-all and end-all of frequency use. That's left for the area frequency coordinators, who frequently do more than just assign repeater frequencies. If they're doing their job, they will also be documenting ALL band activity and insuring that there's a place for every type of operation.

 

[SCPD]

Not obsessing... I suppose I see things differently than others. The point I've been trying to make is, if different areas/locales/etc., want to do their own thing what's the point in having a band plan? Maybe I just don't get it... I assumed a band plan gave us uniformity. BTW, I used "calling CQ" on .52 as a general term when calling another station on FM. I've heard it done before but I suppose that was the local custom.

 

[m00se]

I've heard a lot of traffic and chit chat on this freq in my area too. Doesnt seem to be used as a calling freq.

 

[robertmac]

As some have stated and I have, with out some consistency, we end up with chaos with everyone going in their own direction.

 

[zz0468]

As some have stated and I have, with out some consistency, we end up with chaos with everyone going in their own direction.

We have state and local goverments because Federal regulation of matters of local concern doesn't work well. Consider amateur vhf/uhf frequency bandplans to be a matter of local concern. Until and unless ARRL band planning is able accomodate ALL local preferences, expect local preferences to override the ARRL national plans. It's not chaotic at all if you pay attention to local bandplans. If there is none, then you can turn to the ARRL for guidance.

 

[zz0468]

Not obsessing... I suppose I see things differently than others. The point I've been trying to make is, if different areas/locales/etc., want to do their own thing what's the point in having a band plan?

The point is, vhf and uhf bandplans can be (but don't have to be) a local matter.

Sorry if you disagree, guys, but thats the way it is. Even the ARRL's own bandplans state that local agreements take precident over national ones.

 

[bill4long]

Since it's not an FCC rule and nobody seems to mind, I think I'll create an echolink node with a P25 radio and an IRLP node with a DMR radio connected full time to the busiest reflector I can find and I'll put one on 146.52 and the other on 446.Hey, I'm just keeping with tradition. Have fun using those frequencies with with all the P25 and motoTRBO on it.

You could do that. But why would you want to?

 

[bill4long]

I am aware of local customs when it comes to band plans... why have an ARRL: band plan if no one uses it?

It is suggestive only. Many localities follow it because they can. We do, basically, in Indiana. Some localities simply cannot, so they don't, such as So Calif. Ever lived there? I have. ARRL band plan is simply unworkable there. Why did the ARRL concoct such a thing? Because most areas of the country can abide it and essentially do with small variations. The large urban areas are exceptions. It's reality. Live with it.

What if a ham from out of your area/state visits and commits a faux pas and doesn't adhere to "local custom"?

Then he or she will probably be graciously informed of it. I've been a ham for 31 years and lived all over the country, in large urban areas and out in the sticks and I've never heard any one get dumped on in a mean-spirited way for rag-chewing on 146.52.

Again, I believe the C.B. crowd has us beat.

Then C.B. might be a better fit for you.

 

[dksac2]

There is not a lot of VHF/UHF traffic in my area, simplex or otherwise and those who do use these frequencies usually make a quick conversation.
It is for that reason I talk on HF, lots of good people and ragchews.

The more active band(s) in my area are on GMRS. That is because there are a lot of LDS church members here and the local LDS churches have decided that GMRS is what they want their members to use for EMCOMM and have made it a part of their emergency plan; mind you, this is only local, I don't think it's going on all over the country, but I could be wrong, some do still participate in ARES/RACES.
They do have a weekly net, but not many participate, so if there is an emergency, a lot of people are not going to be used to a net controlled frequency and the repeater will be a huge mess. Many use surplus business radios or UHF handhelds, not all are legal radios for GMRS, but that's on them.

Many think that LDS church members should only help LDS church members, not the general public, others will help anyone on any frequency.
The hardcore LDS seem to be somewhat clickish. Me, I could care less what they do, they are only hurting themselves in my opinion. I leave them to their conversations and talk with those who don't care what church you attend or if you even go to a church. One of the LDS church members put up a very good GMRS repeater, which to their credit is an open repeater.
Me, I'll talk to any reasonable person who follows the rules and to each his own, I don't judge a person by their religion.

As to the calling freqs, I do think they should be used for calling only, but it's rural where I live and I do understand in those areas, a calling freq may be used to chat on. Thing is, most rural people will gladly let someone break in to call someone. Rural and City's are two different animals.
Me, I try and follow the Band Plan. It's there for a reason and should not cause problems, but help keep the bands in a orderly way so there are fewer conflicts on the bands. We cannot ever forget that the FCC is the one who gives us the right to use the frequencies that we do and that the primary purpose of Amateur radio is not to talk to Joebob, but to help in EMCOMM events. We can easily lose bandwidth if all we want to do is argue and turn the Amateur freqs into CB. I don't see this happening, but if too many do their own thing, who knows.

John

 

[k9rzz]

Am sitting here in the car with the scanner on 146.52 listening to WA9AFB/air mobile flying a Boeing C135 at 35,000 ft. Says he's running 10 watts to a blade antenna and he's been booming in for the last 20 minutes. In that time he's flown halfway across Wisconsin and is crossing Lake Michigan just about to reach it's east coastline. Say's he's going 530 knots ground speed. He is BOOMING in and has no shortage of people to talk to. Say's he's got a pileup of about 30 stations calling. 2m simplex is NOT dead. :^)

 

[Rt169Radio]

Am sitting here in the car with the scanner on 146.52 listening to WA9AFB/air mobile flying a Boeing C135 at 35,000 ft. Says he's running 10 watts to a blade antenna and he's been booming in for the last 20 minutes. In that time he's flown halfway across Wisconsin and is crossing Lake Michigan just about to reach it's east coastline. Say's he's going 530 knots ground speed. He is BOOMING in and has no shortage of people to talk to. Say's he's got a pileup of about 30 stations calling. 2m simplex is NOT dead. :^)

That's really cool!

 

[AC2OY]

Nice!!!

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; U; en-US) Gecko/20081217 Vision-Browser/8.1 301x200 LG VN530)

I think I've read here on these boards of an F/A-18 pilot doing the same thing.

 

[Rt169Radio]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; U; en-US) Gecko/20081217 Vision-Browser/8.1 301x200 LG VN530)

I think I've read here on these boards of an F/A-18 pilot doing the same thing.

Yup, I read that too. That thread or posts are still around here somewhere.

 

[AC2OY]

That would be sooo cool to have a Qso with....Maverick and Goose!!!!

 

[k7ltc]

While at my cabin I monitor 146.52 in case anyone in the local national forest might call for assistance. One afternoon I was monitoring and heard a QSO in progress fade in. I understood from what I caught that a pilot was flying over and folks were calling and talking to him. I waited and gave him a call. We chatted but because I am in a fairly narrow valley, I had to let him go fairly quickly. I later found that he was an FA/18 pilot on his way to a base in Washington State.