Changes in BWI Frequencies

[TinEar]

Looks like some changes are in the works at BWI. Freq 123.75 which has been a backup tower freq is now an approach freq. It looks like it may have replaced 125.525. I say "may" have replaced only because I heard nothing on 125.525 for about an hour this afternoon. I also heard one of the controllers mention new ATIS freqs are coming. At this point, I don't know if these are going to be just some minor changes or a reworking of their whole card.

The controllers seem to be beefing up security procedures too. All day they've been notifying flights that in addition to having a working transponder, they better have a working Mode C too or out of the ADIZ they must go immediately. One flight was made to land at Martin State airport to get his Mode C fixed before being allowed to move on.

 

[Spleen]

And even for a Friday night, BWI is pretty dead tonight....hmmmmm. Getting some Andrews, though....is/was tonight a good night for VHF ducting?

Keep an eye on http://www.airnav.com/airport/KBWI for the frequency changes...they're usually pretty up-to-date.

 

[ka3jjz]

Keep an eye on http://www.airnav.com/airport/KBWI for the frequency changes...they're usually pretty up-to-date.

Hmph, the last time I checked, they were missing a few freqs; 126.75, 133.75 weren't there, nor was 125.525. Nor were most of the milair parallels listed, although I have them documented here:

http://www.monitoringtimes.com/html/EXmdaero.html#Baltimore-Washington International Airport

In fact, I sent them into the editors here to be added, and they were there, now they all seem to have disappeared.
Anyway, it's very important to keep in mind that all approach/departure freqs are now under Potomac Tracon's control. I too have noticed that there seems to be some changes. 125.525 and 126.75 at one point seemed to have exchanged usages; .525 used to be an approach freq (and you could hear the pilot replies), while 6.75 was for approaches from the western areas (such as Frederick and Hagerstown), and you couldn't hear the pilots. Time to listen a bit more closelyl

73s Mike

 

[ericcarlson]

In fact, I sent them into the editors here to be added, and they were there, now they all seem to have disappeared.

The freqs had been consolidated on a single page for the Potomac TRACON, but I just moved them back to the individual airport pages.

-Eric

 

[TinEar]

Just getting to my computers and scanners for the day so haven't had a chance to listen yet. However, last night, everything was still active in the right places - such as 126.75 and 133.75 unless they disappeared "very" late last night.

Mike, I don't agree with you that 126.75 doesn't contain pilot replies. I hear them all the time on that freq. Mostly, they are general aviation on that freq so might not be as loud as the commercial aircraft but they sure do talk up a storm. In fact, that's one of my favorites since there are so many unusual requests and novice sounding replies to the controllers. I can't tell you how many times I've heard the controller lose his composure on that freq as a result of what he puts up with. By the way, the aircraft I mentioned to start this thread that was told to land at Martin State to have his Mode C fixed was told to do so on 126.75. The pilot had a French accent and I thought for a moment he was going to tell the controller to stuff it but he apparently thought better of that, knowing he was in the ADIZ, and complied.

Spleen, yes, ducting was fairly good last night. I had lots of New Jersey traffic coming in 5X5. There was also that local chase by the MSP that wound through Glen Burnie and started on 39.04/155.73. Freq 155.73 was the better choice until they finally switched to Golden Ring and then 155.73 disappeared. However, I heard the MSP fairly well on the 39.44 Golden Ring freq all the way into Baltimore City where the chase ended. I usually can't hear the cars on Golden Ring. That chase also, at times, included cars from AA County's Northern, Eastern and Western Districts. There were also AA County and MSP helicopters involved.

Eric, thanks for putting all the approach/departure freqs back in the correct places in the database. I had no idea why they weren't there when I checked yesterday after I got that first change to 123.75. Although they are Potomac TRACON, they transmit from BWI property so that's where they should be - in my most humble opinion.

 

[ka3jjz]

Mike, I don't agree with you that 126.75 doesn't contain pilot replies. I hear them all the time on that freq

Yes, that changed about a year ago; I started hearing pilot replies on that freq and thought there was a change. Before then, it was devoid of any pilot chatter. I live only 15 mins from BWI, so it's not hard to hear them.

Doing some spot checks today, 133.75 is still quiet, but 126.75 is there. And yes, it seems that the 123.75 TRSA Tower freq is now an approach freq; in fact I heard a controller point an approaching flight there. It seems that 125.525 is now simply something of an announcement freq - I hear the controller, but that's it, no pilots. I can hear the pilots on the other freqs tho - unless there's been an antenna change at the site, which is very possible.
Living with indoor antennas is a pain in the xxxxx.

73s Mike

 

[TinEar]

I thought that pain was only spelled with three XXXs.

I'm going now to fire up the scanners and see what I get from BWI. I've always lived with only indoor antennas for everything but the 800 band. My reception is much, much better with the radio whip on frequencies outside the 800 band. One of these days I'm going to throw a discone up in the air to see what it does to my reception but I fear it'll result in overload across most of the bands since I seem to be in such a hot spot for reception. All those freqs I was reporting from PA, DE, NJ and VA were done only with the radio whip. In fact, I just added a new one that comes in fairly well most nights - 155.70 from Hardy County in WV. My first WV freq. The dispatcher usually identifies himself as Hardy County and the cars are all H1, H2, etc.

I'll report back later with what I hear on the BWI emissions. I also want to check the ATIS freqs - 115.1 and 127.8 - since they announced yesterday changes were coming.

Alan

 

[Spleen]

Changes

http://listarchives.his.com/dcpilots-l/dcpilots-l.0311/msg00716.html

The thread is old, but if you follow it, you'll see what a mess the Potomac Tracon changeover must have been (and may still be).

Apparently, to get the latest/greatest list all in one place, you have to buy the FAA Airport/Facility Directory or subscribe to the FAA ftp site, or find somewhere where someone has posted it...

Here's a list gleaned from another thread...standard disclaimer applies:

==================================
Potomac TRACON paired frequencies ...

118.300 /
118.950 / 257.200
119.000 /
119.300 / 335.500
119.400 /
119.700 / 290.475
119.850 / 338.200
120.450 / 343.775
120.525 / 250.750
120.825 / 284.625
121.050 / 343.700
124.200 / 306.300
124.550 / 317.425
124.650 / 343.775
125.050 / 350.200
125.525 / 291.625
125.650 / 348.725
125.800 / 343.775
126.100 / 338.250
126.400 / 282.375
126.550 / 269.500
126.650 / 350.200
126.750 /
126.825 /
128.700 / 307.900
132.850 / 257.750
134.200 / 343.775
134.700 / 307.200
==================================

The thread url is http://listarchives.his.com/dcpilots-l/dcpilots-l.0310/msg00703.html BTW.

So, theoretically, these Potomac Tracon frequencies could be in use anywhere within VHF range of BWI, DCA, etc.

And as I type this, I'm listening to people call Potomac approach on 126.1 heading into Leesburg sector

 

[TinEar]

Everything at BWI seems to be working according to plan for now at least. Both ATIS freqs are working. So, the only change for now is that 123.75 has replaced 125.525 as an approach freq. By the way, I checked the NOTAMs for BWI and 125.525 is listed as being out of service until further notice. I couldn't find any others concerning freq usage.
NOTAM=Notice to Airmen
At the risk of sucking up too much bandwidth, these are the freqs for BWI that I listen to. Any corrections/additions/deletions would be appreciated. I have the United trunked system elsewhere and all the helo freqs that are used for medical services are also listed elsewhere. The list doesn't contain others in the area like College Park or Montgomery Park airports. The format of the list is due to the ARC250 format which puts that zero in front of the freq and limits descriptions to 16 characters to match the Uniden 785.

0122.9500 Unicom
0122.9000 Unicom
0118.0500 BWI Clrnce Deliv
0120.2000 BWI-Gnd Ops(Alt)
0121.9000 BWI-Ground Ops
0119.4000 BWI-Tower
0257.8000 BWI-Tower
0123.7500 BWI-Approach
0119.0000 BWI-Approach
0119.7000 BWI-Approach
0124.5500 BWI-Appch/Depart
0128.7000 BWI-Appch/Depart
0125.5250 BWI-Out PerNOTAM
0126.7500 BWI-Appch/Depart
0228.4000 BWI-Approach
0231.6000 BWI-Approach
0307.9000 BWI-Approach
0325.8000 BWI-Approach
0125.3000 BWI-Approach
0287.1000 BWI-Approach
0133.7500 BWI-Departure
0121.5000 Flight Emergency
0243.0000 Flight Emergency
0461.7125 AirTran Gnd Ops
0460.7750 American Gnd Ops
0464.6000 AmerWest Gnd Ops
0460.7500 Contnentl GndOps
0460.8500 Delta Gnd Ops
0460.6500 Northwest GndOps
0461.0500 Southwest GndOps
0461.2750 Southwest Mech
0461.5750 Southwest CustSv
0463.2750 Southwest GndOps
0463.8000 Southwest GndOps
0462.1125 Butler Aviation
0121.3000 Martin St Tower
0121.8000 Martin St Ground
0123.0500 Tipton Airfield
0130.5250 ContinentalAirOp
0129.8000 US Air-Air Ops
0130.4750 Southwest AirOps
0130.3000 Northwest AirOps
0129.0000 Signature Ops
0130.5750 AirTrans Air Ops
0130.8500 AmerWest Air Ops
0129.0750 Dixie Air Ops
0129.2250 American Air Ops

 

[ka3jjz]

Al, you might want to take a look at the link I provded earlier; some of those Milair freqs for BWI are not correct. I was hearing a good deal of traffic on their milair freqs before, not so much now. And 125.525 is back up, so the NOTAM should be cancelled.
I'll take another look at those ARINC freqs too; the list I supplied came from several weeks worth of recordings with Radiomax, and it's entirely possible I missed some.

73s Mike

 

[ka3jjz]

Re: Changes

http://listarchives.his.com/dcpilots-l/dcpilots-l.0311/msg00716.html

That's a great list! Now all that needs to be done is to break it down by airport usage (which freqs are BWI, Dulles, Andrews, Reagan) and confirm them, then they can be added to the database; something like this:

118.300 /
118.950 / 257.200
119.000 / BWI
119.300 / 335.500
119.400 / BWI
119.700 / 290.475 BWI
119.850 / 338.200
120.450 / 343.775
120.525 / 250.750
120.825 / 284.625
121.050 / 343.700
124.200 / 306.300
124.550 / 317.425 BWI
124.650 / 343.775
125.050 / 350.200
125.525 / 291.625 BWI
125.650 / 348.725
125.800 / 343.775
126.100 / 338.250
126.400 / 282.375
126.550 / 269.500
126.650 / 350.200
126.750 / BWI
126.825 /
128.700 / 307.900 BWI
132.850 / 257.750
134.200 / 343.775
134.700 / 307.200

73s Mike

 

[TinEar]

Thanks Mike. Yes, I just also heard the 125.525 freq active again. I brought the scanner downstairs but all I can hear down here is the airport. I'll check those MilAir freqs for corrections to my list. I believe the 257.8 freq might still be good for pairing with 119.4.

The airline ground ops and air ops freqs should be good because I just recovered that list myself over the past couple of weeks without input from any other list other than IDs on the Southwest list. As you know, I used to listen to those freqs just for the giggles they provide at times but decided to identify what I was hearing and enter them in my scanner instead of just using a search function to listen.

Thanks for your advice on the MilAirs.

There is both a Coast Guard exercise of some kind going on yesterday and today and a parachute jumping display by some group.

There was an interesting bunch of comms from Montgomery County an hour or so ago trying to rescue someone from the Potomac River. Potomac River Control, Virginia River Control, various helos/boats and Fairfax and Montgomery counties were involved. 7G and 4C were primaries.

[Edit} Okay, I fixed the MilAir freqs and now have them paired on the display like this:
0290.4750 BWI-Apprch/119.7
0317.4250 BWI-Appch/124.55
0307.9000 BWI-Apprch/128.7
0291.6250 BWI-Apch/125.525

 

[Spleen]

After posting the above, I checked back with http://www.airnav.com/airport/kbwi on a hunch, and sure enough, they changed the listing so now it looks like this (bold type mine):

Airport Communications
UNICOM: 122.95
ATIS: 115.1 127.8
WX ASOS: PHONE 410-691-1278
BALTIMORE GROUND: 121.9
BALTIMORE TOWER: 119.4 257.8
POTOMAC APPROACH: 119.0(020-100) 119.7(131-180) 124.55(101-130) 128.7(181-019)
CLEARANCE DELIVERY: 118.05
CLASS B: 119.0(020-100) 124.55(101-130) 128.7(181-019)
CLASS B IC: 119.7(131-180)
EMERG: 121.5 243.0

Can we assume that the frequencies now listed as Potomac approach are the TRACON towers on BWI property? Especially since some of them are also still Class B?

 

[TinEar]

Yes, Spleen, I think we can safely assume the Approach freqs you listed are all transmitting from BWI property. I base that simply on the fact that I can hear them and can't hear any ground controllers from Reagan or Dulles. They still left off the 125.525 freq though.

I found something about Signature Ops at the airport that makes me want to find their UHF freq. They use something called a Zetron Model 4010 Radio Console. This is what piqued my interest:

The Signature Flight Service personnel wear Motorola Minotaur pagers. They’re not pagers, however, they’re voice-decoding PL receivers with earplugs. The console can cross-patch communications to Signature personnel walking the floor in the operations area, so when someone talks on the VHF frequency, the console duplicates the call on the UHF frequency and they can hear it over their pager. It allows them to hear the VHF communications from the aircraft coming in, and they can also hear their own units on the ground on the same channel.. The advantage to this setup is that the customer doesn’t overhear what’s going on in the dispatch mode.”

 

[Spleen]

Frequency list

Since we're all in a sharing mood today, I'll go ahead and upload an edited frequency list from my latest Winradio memory file. I took out anything that might look illegal, and added a MHz column. The group column is missing, but paging down from the top are ungrouped entries...once you page down to where the trunks start, the listing is in group order. Ignore any offsets in the 800MHz band, the Winradio has a little problem in that range. I went ahead and edited the aviation range to reflect the latest known Potomac TRACON frequencies; some are doubled up with known tower frequencies until they're confirmed. Any entry with a question mark is, um, questionable or unknown. Obviously there are some old entries that are going to be completely out to lunch that I just haven't gotten around to deleting yet. Have fun!

 

[ericcarlson]

I found something about Signature Ops at the airport that makes me want to find their UHF freq. They use something called a Zetron Model 4010 Radio Console. This is what piqued my interest:

Interesting. Here are the Signature licenses at BWI:
WPRL255 - licensed as YG (trunked) 3-channels, this might be an LTR, has anyone checked this out?
KB70395 - simplex freqs
WNRO317 - simplex freqs

FYI, Signature Flight Support was formed by the merger of Butler Aviation and another company.

-Eric

 

[Spleen]

Signature

I'll start scanning 461-469MHz at 12.5kHz spacing, excluding GMRS/FRS, business radio, etc., but my feed line is too long and I have a lot of loss at 400MHz and up....great setup for civilian aviation band and below, but lousy for UHF. I'm not hopeful. Could be an excuse for a driveby with the Pro-94, though....

 

[TinEar]

I'd take the freqs associated with WPRL255 off the list - or save them for last. My guess is the net I mentioned above would be a low power output. The other two batches are both 2 watt transmitters whereas WPRL255 is 10 and 25 watt transmitters. A drive-by sounds like fun.

Totally different topic...there has been constant traffic on the 866.3625 DC area police freq last night and today. It's just a bit out of my range and all I can understand are the DC police digital conversations. Most of it though is too weak to correctly demodulate the digital voice and there is also a bunch of encrypted comms on it.

 

[ka3jjz]

I found something about Signature Ops at the airport that makes me want to find their UHF freq. They use something called a Zetron Model 4010 Radio Console. This is what piqued my interest:

Interesting. Here are the Signature licenses at BWI:
WPRL255 - licensed as YG (trunked) 3-channels, this might be an LTR, has anyone checked this out?
KB70395 - simplex freqs
WNRO317 - simplex freqs

FYI, Signature Flight Support was formed by the merger of Butler Aviation and another company.

-Eric

I hear Signature flight ops on 462.1375 pl=100.0 quite easily here; that freq came from Dave Schoenberger's page. And Butler can still be heard on their usual 462.1125 freq, so evidently only part of Butler participated in the merging. I have a few more BWI related freqs somewhere, and I'll post them later.

If we get enough info together, perhaps I'll put together a BWI page for the CHM website. It would be very interesting to have an accurate freq picture for the site, but it's very large and hard to pin down.
Be careful about doing a drive by; with the enhanced security these days, it might not be the best idea unless you're very unobtrusive.

73s Mike

 

[n3bxv]

For those interested, an excellent place to see(and monitor) the General Aviation section of BWI is from the BWI Trail near Lindale Brooklyn Park Middle School. If you park at the school and walk past the Andover Equestrian Center on the BWI Trail just over the hill is a small area with benches that overlooks the General Aviation Area and Runway. You're unlikely to be hassled here and there are far fewer people than at the Dixon Observation Area on Dorsey Road, but you don't see the Commercial aircraft well.

More Info http://bikewashington.org/routes/bwi/
http://www.bwiairport.com/7arndtwn/in_trl.shtml
http://www.dnr.state.md.us/greenways/bwi_trail.html