Sticky Thread for MilAir II

[TinEar]

12.21.2007
2015Z-2033Z:260.900 CAP covered better by Tin. I had some local QRM that destroyed reception for a time.

2044Z PT APP 118.675 REACH 5143 - 15000'-13000'-11000' X AML @ 8000' QSY PT APP 119.850. Guys were being given WIZRD @ 10000' AML @ 8000' now so the WIZRD waypoint is a new one on me.

Tony, I seem to remember adding the WIZRD (or something similar) airspace fix to a long list of them in a message on this thread when the FAA first posted them. While on that subject, they posted two new fixes for Maryland today.
EDDWD 38-58-34.80N / 077-01-38.25W
EYESS 38-58-18.75N / 076-53-48.84W

And they cancelled two in Pennsylvania: MAJEZ and NOUTH.

Come to think of it, the spelling is probably different for what you heard than WIZRD since that one is in Ohio.

I list these occasionally when they post those changes but there are so many of them in a constant stream that it's difficult to keep up with them. Copying and pasting is not an option from the location I get them so it isn't an easy thing to do - otherwise I would just post all changes for our area. There are also constant changes to the STAR routes - including several just today for this area but those are impossible to repost just because of the volume of information they provide when they make a change. Every waypoint in the area, along with altitudes at each point and controllers that should be contacted at each point are included in those reports. They go on for page after page. I don't think many people here are interested in that level of minutiae to post it all.

 

[BM82557]

Potomac TRACON Guard Dog CAP airspace control is 135.525 and 350.25

I haven't heard anything from my location on 135.525 today, just 350.250. Anybody copy anything there?

 

[freqhopping]

I haven't heard anything from my location on 135.525 today, just 350.250. Anybody copy anything there?

I hear Potomac on both freqs.

 

[TinEar]

I haven't heard anything from my location on 135.525 today, just 350.250. Anybody copy anything there?

Brian, the first two tankers (and now the third) came into the area using 135.525 and then were sent to 126.55 instead.

1740: TANKER 03 just coming into the area....135.525 and 260.9

Tanker Recap:
TANKER 01 = KC-135R, 59-1498, 132nd ARS ME-ANG Bangor, Mode 3=3477
TANKER 02 = KC-135R, 60-0315, 126th ARS WI-ANG Milwaukee, Mode 3=5662
TANKER 03 = KC-135R, 63-8018, 173rd ARS NE-ANG Lincoln, Mode 3 = 5653
TANKER 04 = KC-135R, ---------, 133rd ARS NH-ANG Pease, Mode 3 = 3515

 

[CitationJet]

Re: ELDEE2 arrival

Hi guys,

ELDEE2 arrival WIE 12.20.2007 and guys were being given WIZRD @ 10000' ELDEE @ 8000'. ELDEE1 has been deleted according to the PT controller on 118.675.

Not sure of spellingon WIZRD but I think that's what he said.

 

[TinEar]

Hi guys,

ELDEE2 arrival WIE 12.20.2007 and guys were being given WIZRD @ 10000' ELDEE @ 8000'. ELDEE1 has been deleted according to the PT controller on 118.675.

Not sure of spellingon WIZRD but I think that's what he said.

Found it Tony...should be WZRRD which is in Virginia...
38-56-03.45N / 077-44-01.28W
*******************************************************

1758: SONIC 05 told 06 to go to 22 Prime and they came up on 262.025 - one of Langley's popular interflight freqs.

Late 1700 hour: In the background I heard RATS 80 giving an arrival message to Andrews on 378.1. He's a KC-135R, 61-0280 from the 336th ARS AFRC March ARB CA. Don't get many of those into Andrews.

 

[freqhopping]

If you've got an extra scanner put it on 298.65 and see if you hear what I am. It sounds like the Raptor pilots. Only thing is that I only hear a split second of comms at a time, mostly nothing though.

1826- Right after these last comms with HUNTRESS. There were some broken comms on 298.65. I have it set to record.

 

[TinEar]

If you've got an extra scanner put it on 298.65 and see if you hear what I am. It sounds like the Raptor pilots. Only thing is that I only hear a split second of comms at a time, mostly nothing though.

They may be using something like a Have Quick comm system. When they went to that 22 Prime freq earlier on 262.025, the flight leader told his wingman to push something on his radio and to use 003. I had no idea what that was at the time. Yes, I am hearing bits of Raptor transmissions on 298.65 as you are. It's probably spread across a dozen other freqs too. If we had enough radios and put each on one of the freqs they're using, we could recover the transmissions.

1845: SONIC 11/12 coming into Guard Dog to take their shift...350.25 (27 Prime) and 260.9
1857: SONIC 11/12 have completed their boom checks...SONIC 05/06 heading home...260.9 > 350.25
1858: SONIC 05/06 using interflight for chat on the way home...both report having 11.K gas...262.025
SONIC 11 gave his tail number in the clear as 04-0066
SONIC 12 was asked for his tail by the tanker but apparently gave it on intercom rather than the radio so didn't get to hear it.

1902: SONIC 05/06 doing a lot of yakking of being kept in the Guard Dog area awaiting their clearance from Potomac....262.025
They then switch to Primary 260.9 (31 AUX) to let SONIC 11/12 know they should not wait until the last minute to ask for their clearances when they leave.
1904: SONIC 05/06 finally get their clearance back to Langley from Potomac...350.25 (they let 11/12 know they got it on 260.9)
1904: SONIC 05/06 back to interflight...05 reports 9400 pounds of fuel and 06 has 10,100 pounds...stepping up speed to 400 knots...262.025

Ref Below: Travis, would you mind sharing the few freqs you heard the Have Quick signals on? I'm not sure if anyone else will use it but I can set the freqs up in separate radios so it won't miss pieces during the delay moving from one freq to the next.

 

[freqhopping]

They may be using something like a Have Quick comm system. When they went to that 22 Prime freq earlier on 262.025, the flight leader told his wingman to push something on his radio and to use 003. I had no idea what that was at the time. Yes, I am hearing bits of Raptor transmissions on 298.65 as you are. It's probably spread across a dozen other freqs too. If we had enough radios and put each on one of the freqs they're using, we could recover the transmissions.

That's what I figured since I have it labeled as a Have Quick freq. I just loaded all the freqs I have as HQ into one bank with no delay time. Just a couple of seconds ago it stopped on 3 or 4 freqs really quickly.

Ref Below: Travis, would you mind sharing the few freqs you heard the Have Quick signals on? I'm not sure if anyone else will use it but I can set the freqs up in separate radios so it won't miss pieces during the delay moving from one freq to the next.

I would if I know what they were. It happened too fast. If they use it again I'll have my ID Tracker running, I hope it can keep up.
This is what I have programmed now.
225.1500
235.0500
239.9500
252.9250
257.2500
262.4500
267.8500
271.9500
279.7500
284.1500
289.0500
293.5500
297.5750
297.6000
298.2750
298.3000
298.6500
300.0250
300.1000
300.1250
300.2250
300.3250
300.4250
300.5250
300.6250
300.7250
300.8250
300.9250
301.0250
301.1250
301.2250
301.3250
303.2750
308.7500
314.4500

 

[Mark]

Hear 4 McGuire KC-10's up tonite for AR work. TEAM 55,56,57 and 58.
A/A 139.875 also on 238.900
Faded fast so must have headed North or Northwest.

Mark

 

[TinEar]

I would if I know what they were. It happened too fast. If they use it again I'll have my ID Tracker running, I hope it can keep up.
This is what I have programmed now.
225.1500
235.0500 [SNIP>

Thanks Travis. Even if I dig out some old and moldy scanners to go with my regulars, I won't have enough for that list.

I can put some of them in though. Even with a half dozen or so radios set for that, you can sometimes get the gist of the conversations - depending on how many freqs they're using and how quickly or slowly they're speaking. However...<fill in any scenario you can imagine here>, I'd bet we can't catch enough of it.
***************************************

Nice catch on those KC-10s Mark. I only managed to hear one KC-10A while running around here . It was 86-0036 and I'm not even sure he was one of that TEAM quartet you heard.

I did just (2000) hear KING 21 (HC-130H, 102nd RQS/106th RQW, NY-ANG) trying to contact Langley Metro on 239.8. He gave it a couple of tries and then gave up.

2000: TANKER 04 is on the way to the CAP. He's coming from the 133rd ARS NH-ANG Pease. Mode 3 = 3515

2027: TANKER 03 has requested his clearance home from Potomac...135.525
2030: TANKER 03 gets his clearance from Potomac and is handed off to ZDC-Hagerstown 134.15 where he checks in at FL 240 heading for 345.
2031: TANKER 04 checks in with HUNTRESS on 260.9 which he calls Blue-13...he gets the squawks for SONIC 11/12 and TANKER 03....he's coming in at FL 270 and heading for 240.
2034: TANKER 03 receives clearance direct BelAir, direct Lincoln (NE)...will maintain FL 335 rather than 345...134.15
2040: TANKER 03 handed off to Cleveland Center...ZOB-Imperial on 132.125 (and this is where I drop him)
2044: TANKER 04 has been trying to call Potomac Guard Dog on 135.525 to report at FL 240...makes contact on 4th call.
2046: TANKER 04 calls SONIC 11 to announce he'll be entering the airspace in a couple of miles...also confirms the fighters are in the block 210-230...260.9

NOTE: The FAA has been removing those "Discrete" designators beside many of the ARTCC freqs they've had in place for years. Today, they made several changes in designators for Cleveland Center and added a few new freqs at the same time. Unfortunately, when they list new items, including new freqs, they do it by RCAG rather than breaking them down into Sector names which doesn't give the level of detail that I, for one, like to have for Center freqs. However, I take what I can get which is much better than not getting them at all.

 

[BM82557]

I haven't heard anything from my location on 135.525 today, just 350.250. Anybody copy anything there?

I posted this at 17:17. At 17:38 I started hearing activity on 135.525. Maybe they read this forum and activated a new ground site!

 

[JohnFB]

Hear 4 McGuire KC-10's up tonite for AR work. TEAM 55,56,57 and 58.
A/A 139.875 also on 238.900
Faded fast so must have headed North or Northwest.

Mark

Mark:

TEAM 56 Flt [w/TEAM 55] went up to AR204 324.600
TEAM 58 Flt [w/TEAM 57] went up to AR212 238.900 and they were actually passing gas

 

[Mark]

Mark:

TEAM 56 Flt [w/TEAM 55] went up to AR204 324.600
TEAM 58 Flt [w/TEAM 57] went up to AR212 238.900 and they were actually passing gas

Awsome John,thought you might catch them headed North.
Too bad they aren't dragging some B-1's across but then they would be using
GOLD callsign or that new Coronet callsign.
Maybe next time will catch them with real deal.

Mark

 

[JohnFB]

RCH 426 &amp; MAZDA Flt

This one really faked me out .....

FRI
1824 - 1835Z

RCH 426 wkg MAZDA [unknown flt number, type or number of a/c] on 294.800

Also possible A2A for MAZDA btwn 141.000 - 142.000. I didn't hit the pause on scanner fast enough.

They were passing thru ZBW Delancy sector. MAZDAs wanted clearance direct Rockdale Wright-Patterson. I heard RCH clear them down to the bottom of the block, but I never heard any AR comms.

I only heard them because I have 294.800 in a spare 'Giant Killer/Huntress' bank. I believe it's usually labelled Coronet A.

Ref below: Thnx Tin

 

[TinEar]

This one really faked me out .....

FRI
1824 - 1835Z

RCH 426 wkg MAZDA [unknown flt number, type or number of a/c] on 294.800

Also possible A2A for MAZDA btwn 141.000 - 142.000. I didn't hit the pause on scanner fast enough.

They were passing thru ZBW Delancy sector. MAZDAs wanted clearance direct Rockdale Wright-Patterson. I heard RCH clear them down to the bottom of the block, but I never heard any AR comms.

I only heard them because I have 294.800 in a spare 'Giant Killer/Huntress' bank. I believe it's usually labelled Coronet A.

REACH 426 was a KC-10A from the 305th at McGuire - tail 79-1949. Kind of strange he was working a MAZDA flight with a REACH callsign rather than the usual tanker callsigns. Perhaps he was diverted from his regular REACH mission to service that MAZDA flight heading wherever.

I also have that 294.8 freq in my scan rotation but I've got it labeled as a refueling freq for Coronet missions.

2306: SONIC 11 to Potomac to say they'll be RTBing to Langley in 5 minutes...350.25
2306: TANKER 04 to Potomac to say he'll be RTBing in 5 minutes...135.525
2309: TANKER 04 picking up clearance...says he's been cleared to leave...will take flight plan route or whatever they have for him...wants FL 310 if he can get it...135.525
2310: SONIC 11/12 released by HUNTRESS...260.9
2310: SONIC 11/12 to Potomac to pick up clearance...cleared direct Langley at FL 230 when released by ATC...350.25
2312: TANKER 04 handed off to ZDC-Brooke and check in there at FL 230...put 310 on request...126.875
2312: SONIC 11/12 doing a 360...their clearance is not ready yet...asking Potomac how long the delay should be...350.25
Can't say they weren't warned. SONIC 05 told them to apply for the clearance at least 10 minutes before leaving. They didn't.
2315: SONIC 11 tells Potomac they can drop below FL 180 and go VFR (trying whatever he can to get out of here)...350.25
2317: SONIC 11/12 finally cleared direct Langley...350.25
2319: SONIC 11/12 handed off to ZDC-Calvert and check in at FL 230 as a flight of two, non-standard (formation)...281.4
SONIC 11/12 using interflight freq on the way home...262.025
And the CAP is done for tonight. Expect it to resume at 0600.

 

[Mark]

SONIC 11/12 using interflight freq on the way home...262.025
And the CAP is done for tonight. Expect it to resume at 0600.

Thankfully they aren't making it 24 hour CAP for them.
Wonder if Langley will work till Weds or someone else will chip in?

TEAM flight of 4 KC-10's on Holiday weekend has me wondering that they have
some return Heavy work on Saturday in mind.

2334 local REACH 33116 on ZDC Millville 125.450

Mark

 

[JohnFB]

Awsome John,thought you might catch them headed North.
Too bad they aren't dragging some B-1's across [snip]

Mark

I'm never that lucky ..... although McGuire sends out x4 TEAMs quite often for some night-time AR ..... at least once every 4-6 weeks.

 

[JohnFB]

Unfortunately, when they list new items, including new freqs, they do it by RCAG rather than breaking them down into Sector names which doesn't give the level of detail that I, for one, like to have for Center freqs. However, I take what I can get which is much better than not getting them at all.

Maybe they'll come out with RCAG maps to help us hobbyists??


HAH!!!!


Merry Xmas & Happy Holidays ...... I won't be online again until mid-week.

 

[TinEar]

Guard Dog CAP in place again this morning as expected. Primary freq still 260.9.
SONIC 31/32 were the first pair of fighters this morning with 33/34 coming on station around 0930 to replace them. All are F-22A, 94th Fighter Squadron, 1st Fighter Wing Langley chicks.
Tankers are on the same schedule this morning.

Actually, it appears SONIC 34 hasn't made it in and 31 is being held over until he arrives.
Hearing SONIC 34 coming up the road at 1004 and contacting 33 to make altitude arrangements when he gets to the airspace.

Two tankers so far this morning...
TANKER 05 = KC-135R, 59-1467, 171st ARW PA-ANG Pittsburgh, Mode 3 = 4142
TANKER 06 = KC-135R, 57-2597, 153rd ARS MS-ANG Meridian, Mode 3 = 1520