AM radio phased out in some EVs

[avaloncourt]

My sister hasn't had any issues with maintenance. The only thing she's had to do was tires.

She may not have had issues with maintenance but she's required to go to Tesla for the maintenance. That cost is going to be absolute top dollar. I'm a do-it-myself-within-my-abilities kind of person. I'm trying to find an article I read regarding a customer who received service interval notices and did not take the vehicle in. So, Tesla disabled the vehicle.

Tesla is also the leader in, "Oh, you want that feature? Yeah, there's a charge for that." There's also been lots of press about customers whose car has been stuck at service for months yet Tesla is still billing them for those monthly charges even though the dealership has the vehicle sitting waiting for service.

 

[belvdr]

She may not have had issues with maintenance but she's required to go to Tesla for the maintenance. That cost is going to be absolute top dollar. I'm a do-it-myself-within-my-abilities kind of person. I'm trying to find an article I read regarding a customer who received service interval notices and did not take the vehicle in. So, Tesla disabled the vehicle.

I'd be interested in that article. It seems it would be troublesome for a manufacturer to disable an entire vehicle for that reason.

 

[mmckenna]

She may not have had issues with maintenance but she's required to go to Tesla for the maintenance. That cost is going to be absolute top dollar. I'm a do-it-myself-within-my-abilities kind of person. I'm trying to find an article I read regarding a customer who received service interval notices and did not take the vehicle in. So, Tesla disabled the vehicle.

I'm the same way. I have a 2018 F350 that's never been in a shop. I do the work myself.
My sister, however, does not do her own maintenance, but fortunately her car, like many others, come with a long warranty, so she's not concerned.
And it's not her first electric car. She previously drove a Chevy Volt, which is essentially an electric car with a built in generator. She put over 100K on that without issues.

The technology isn't the problem. Range will continue to grow, but that's not really the issue people make it out to be.
And like I've said before, it's not the right solution for everyone. I personally have two Diesel pickups and no plan to get rid of those in the near future. But I'm willing to bet an electric car/truck will be in my future. It's a good option to have.

Tesla is also the leader in, "Oh, you want that feature? Yeah, there's a charge for that." There's also been lots of press about customers whose car has been stuck at service for months yet Tesla is still billing them for those monthly charges even though the dealership has the vehicle sitting waiting for service.

As for Tesla and Elon Musk, I'm not personally a fan. I wouldn't buy a Tesla for many reasons, and he's one of them.
But there are other electric vehicle options on the market. I have a friend running one of the new Ford Mustang electrics, and they just came back from a long road trip with it. No issues at all, no problems with range. The F-150 looks to be a promising vehicle, as long as you don't use it for heavy towing (half ton pickups are not great at towing, anyway…).


Not directed at you:
It's a shame that technology has turned into such a politically polarizing subject. Used to be the US led the world in innovation, now it seems like some are afraid things might change and we must all go back to driving 1968 Chevys. I'm glad to see that US manufacturers are continuing to develop electric cars, as well as renewable energy. As we rely more and more on energy, it'll be important that we can supply our own. Technology isn't going to stop because a handful of people are afraid of it.

 

[mmckenna]

I'd be interested in that article. It seems it would be troublesome for a manufacturer to disable an entire vehicle for that reason.

Unfortunately it happens frequently in high technology. So many things have gone to XXX as a service, or xxxx in the cloud. It's too easy for someone to screw up and lock a system. Had it happen with a system at work, thankfully we have a good relationship with the VAR and we got it resolved in about 2 hours.

 

[avaloncourt]

I'd be interested in that article. It seems it would be troublesome for a manufacturer to disable an entire vehicle for that reason.

I'm looking. I can't recall where I bumped into it originally. I think it was back in October. I'm running into other interesting articles trying to find it. I just read an article about someone who bought a used Tesla from Tesla. It was advertised as coming with Auto Pilot. The person bought it and Tesla disabled the Auto Pilot. Reason: The second owner wasn't the one who paid for it (even though the Tesla dealership advertised it as part of the sale.

I'm finding multiple articles very interesting where Tesla replaced a battery pack with a larger one (60->90kWh), thus, extending the range. In one article, the guy was driving it and suddenly his range dropped with no warning or explanation. He contacted Tesla and was told, you didn't initially pay for that amount of range so you can't have it without paying for it.

 

[belvdr]

I'm looking. I can't recall where I bumped into it originally. I think it was back in October. I'm running into other interesting articles trying to find it. I just read an article about someone who bought a used Tesla from Tesla. It was advertised as coming with Auto Pilot. The person bought it and Tesla disabled the Auto Pilot. Reason: The second owner wasn't the one who paid for it (even though the Tesla dealership advertised it as part of the sale.

I'm finding multiple articles very interesting where Tesla replaced a battery pack with a larger one (60->90kWh), thus, extending the range. In one article, the guy was driving it and suddenly his range dropped with no warning or explanation. He contacted Tesla and was told, you didn't initially pay for that amount of range so you can't have it without paying for it.

I think that behavior is only going to become more common on all vehicles, unfortunately. It's happen on other fronts already.

 

[avaloncourt]

I think that behavior is only going to become more common on all vehicles, unfortunately. It's happen on other fronts already.

Yes, I can see it coming. You may have theoretically bought the car but are only leasing the features. Sell it to someone else and the lease ends.

This makes me think of a local nursing home/assisted living complex near me. They have those services but they also "sell" houses and apartments to seniors as independent living at crazy high prices, like 4x the going rate for such a place in the area. The purchase conditionally deeded to the resident and includes taxes, indoor and outdoor maintenance and lawn care. BUT, if you become ill and have to go into assisted living or skilled nursing, that's the end. The property returns ownership to the facility to be resold at the same crazy pricing. So, if you're there for 30 days and have an incident that sends you to skilled or assisted you just had the biggest rent payment in the history of rent payments because nothing of what you paid for the house is applied to the new care.

 

[Omega-TI]

Tesla? There are too many articles online about them being among the lowest of the low in reliability. For the price, one would expect better. I have to admit their PR department is good with the hype though.

 

[Omega-TI]

I think that behavior is only going to become more common on all vehicles, unfortunately. It's happen on other fronts already.

Possibly, but if I ever get a whiff of a company doing that, I'll never buy a car from them. From the looks of the 2023 Hyundai Elantra Limited Hybrid, I hope they keep the same combination of features in 2025 as I'm not ready to trade in yet. The mileage is great and unlike a Tesla, I wouldn't have to use and wait at a charging station. Also the hybrid does not have a constant velocity transmission. The best thing is it's a a heck of a lot less expensive than a Tesla and is considered a well built and reliable vehicle. Now everyone is different, but I it's a good thing I detest Tesla's, because I cannot afford one anyway.

 

[cc333]

I have to admit their PR department is good with the hype though.

What PR department?

Since I think either 2015 or 2018, Musk allegedly did away with it and does most of the PR himself, mostly via Twitter, which he now conveniently (and somewhat ironically) owns (incidentally, one of the first things he did after the sale went through was to disband their PR dept. as well. It seems he really likes to be in absolute control of his messaging, for better or worse).

c

 

[AK9R]

According to an article in the Wall Street Journal, seven former FEMA administrators have written a letter to SecTrans Pete Buttigieg stating that "the government should seek assurances that auto makers will maintain AM radio in cars".

"The issue, the former officials say, is that AM radio serves as a linchpin of the infrastructure behind the federal National Public Warning System, which provides emergency-alert and warning information from FEMA to the public during natural disasters and extreme weather events."

Full article: WSJ News Exclusive | Electric Vehicles Need AM Radio, Former Emergency Officials Argue

 

[GROL]

According to an article in the Wall Street Journal, seven former FEMA administrators have written a letter to SecTrans Pete Buttigieg stating that "the government should seek assurances that auto makers will maintain AM radio in cars".

"The issue, the former officials say, is that AM radio serves as a linchpin of the infrastructure behind the federal National Public Warning System, which provides emergency-alert and warning information from FEMA to the public during natural disasters and extreme weather events."

Full article: WSJ News Exclusive | Electric Vehicles Need AM Radio, Former Emergency Officials Argue

Isn't that really a weak argument? Who doesn't have a smartphone these days that will get a national alert. And if there is no AM, FM radio gets national alerts as well as XM radio. Also, if the AM really gets a lot of interference from the car, how likely would any one use AM?

 

[AK9R]

A few thoughts:

I wouldn't assume that in the wake of an incident where FEMA feels it necessary to use the National Public Warning System, that the cellphone towers would still be operating or wouldn't be overloaded with other traffic.

It seems that FEMA has worked with AM broadcasters to be ready to activate the National Public Warning System in case of emergency. AM provides greater range than FM in many cases.

Not everyone has an XM radio.

If an AM radio installation in a vehicle gets lots of interference from the vehicle, then I think FEMA is suggesting that maybe the vehicle manufacturers should be encouraged to reduce or eliminate the interference. In my opinion, if the electronics in an electric vehicle generate enough interference to render an AM receiver useless, then maybe the EV's engineers need to address their sources of interference.

 

[MCWKen]

It has been a lax enforcement of corporations, utilities, and manufacturers of interfering with AM and other radio frequencies. I am not just talking about static from a passing car or pick-up, but sometimes blocks at a time of complete blanking of signals. And listening to some telephone while driving is not acceptable to me, they are just not loud enough to overcome road noise and blower motors.

At home, forget about listening to AM at home anymore. And recently, now some moderate signals in the 700 mhz band have become unusable if the antenna is near either CATV or Electrical service lines. You can talk til you turn blue in the face, but CATV and Utilities will not take you seriously. Along with it, the FCC no longer enforces RF interference if you complain.

Okay, I get it, this is not the 1970's, and technology has changed. Yet, why should manufacturers devise ways to avoid interference? After all, there is no consequence from the body that was supposed to regulate it.

 

[gmclam]

Isn't that really a weak argument? Who doesn't have a smartphone these days that will get a national alert. And if there is no AM, FM radio gets national alerts as well as XM radio. Also, if the AM really gets a lot of interference from the car, how likely would any one use AM?

Just because you have a smartphone doesn't mean it will have reception. AM broadcast has a better chance (if not for self-generated interference). Serious alerts should be sent via as many means as reasonably possible.

 

[GROL]

Point is, if the AM really gets a lot of interference from the car, how likely would any one use AM? The other options would be used. Impossible to cover all grounds, and what if they do not have any of these turned on? Just another how can we one-up.

 

[mwjones]

Just because you have a smartphone doesn't mean it will have reception. AM broadcast has a better chance (if not for self-generated interference). Serious alerts should be sent via as many means as reasonably possible.

In my hometown in Kansas, a county seat, population 12,500 (county wide population 26,000), there's only 2 radio stations, an AM "daytimer" station (if you remember those) that operates at lower power at night, and an FM station operated by the local college. Otherwise you're tuning in the big "powerhouse" stations out of Kansas City or Topeka (45+ miles line of sight away). In the event of a local emergency, that AM station would be the first and likely only source of information, whereas the Kansas City or Topeka stations may not be as quick to broadcast about events at the fringe of their areas (although the Weather Service office in Topeka is the source of watches and warnings for the county, so most of the stations in Topeka and Kansas City will broadcast those alerts for the county).

I know the AM station has the appropriate EAS gear tied into their automation, but I don't know if the college operated FM station even has an EAS receiver, let alone the automation to cut into programming in real time.

It's for areas like that which make AM radio as a means of distributing information still a reliable fallback to all of the newer methods. It should be up to the automobile manufacturers to make sure their vehicles can receive AM signals without interference from the drive train.

 

[Omega-TI]

@mwjones I don't know about other states, but here in Washington we have traffic advisory stations along the major highways that use AM radio transmitters. They come in quite handy at times.

Highway advisory radio | TSMO | WSDOT

 

[mwjones]

@mwjones I don't know about other states, but here in Washington we have traffic advisory stations along the major highways that use AM radio transmitters. They come in quite handy at times.

Highway advisory radio | TSMO | WSDOT

@Omega-TI Good point. Those Highway Advisory/Airport Information and other low power stations are always on AM, and with the problems of distracted driving should remain as a convenient way for guidance without taking the eyes off the road. Without an AM radio, the user is forced to search for that information on the Infotainment System or their smartphone, neither of which is a safe thing to do while driving.

 

[CrabbyMilton]

Of course it's easy enough to have travel advisory channels on FM too. Excellent point about having to fumble around with your device to access that info.