California Radio Interoperable System (CRIS)

scannerboy02

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What are you talking about? Why would a vehicle do any crossband repeating?
The reason they put this capability in every patrol car was to give the officers the ability to connect everyone on the scene of a critical incident without needing to wait for a mobile command post to show up. This was put in with the CPVE setup, I'm actually not sure if the new setup will still do it or not.

I’m talking about how it’s done in Kern county where there is a LB, VHF and UHF repeater sites all tied together. When CHP and locals needto talk to each other just go to the cross band repeater. What comes in one band goes out the others.
I knew what you were referencing. These setups are great but they still require addition installations at each sites and require the users to change channels as they move.
 

PrivatelyJeff

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The reason they put this capability in every patrol car was to give the officers the ability to connect everyone on the scene of a critical incident without needing to wait for a mobile command post to show up. This was put in with the CPVE setup, I'm actually not sure if the new setup will still do it or not.


I knew what you were referencing. These setups are great but they still require addition installations at each sites and require the users to change channels as they move.
I’ve never heard of the to CHP patrol vehicles systems being used in the configuration, I believe it was only for the CHP officers use not as a mobile command center. I’ve only ever heard them use it for the own personal communication.

Also in Kern County they don’t have to change as they go they just stay on their particular channel. The cross band repeat system is countywide.
 

scannerboy02

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While the goal of this system might be getting smaller-agency buy-in this system doesn't account for replacement subscriber cost to do so. Also the proposed coverage is so limited to make this proposed system a poor local investment.
The federal government (and perhaps the state) has grant programs to help with these costs but yes that is something that needs to be thought about before joining as a paying customer. And again, this is why the state should have "state pricing" with the vendors to help reduce the cost to local agencies who want to join.
 

scannerboy02

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I’ve never heard of the to CHP patrol vehicles systems being used in the configuration, I believe it was only for the CHP officers use not as a mobile command center. I’ve only ever heard them use it for the own personal communication.
I don't know if this has ever actually been used in the field or not. When it was shown to me the officer "patched" LLAW1, VTAC11, UTAC41, and 8TAC91 together on the CPVE screen in a Crown Vic.

Also in Kern County they don’t have to change as they go they just stay on their particular channel. The cross band repeat system is countywide.
So I'm guessing it's a simulcast setup? I'm definitely not familiar with Kern County radio systems. If so that's really good.
 

norcalscan

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I want to stop a critical misunderstanding that has quickly thrown this thread off-topic on a tangent. CHP patrol vehicles do not have any patching capabilities, period. I'm not sure what was seen on a CPVE screen in a crown vic, other than the officer tuning his own RF deck to all 4 of those channels at once so he can hear traffic on all 4 out the vehicle's speaker. The vehicle extenders have a very long history with CHP with a simple task of allowing the officers to use a handheld on highband instead of needing a lowband handheld on their hip (and subsequent antenna jammed in their armpit all shift long). The extender has gotten more intelligent over the years with some remote tuning of the vehicle channel, etc. Search the forums for threads with deeper discussion on the extender. A user-initiated patch across agencies/disciplines in the field under nobody's control is a COML's nightmare.

I think a lot of us are verklempt over the communications pursuit fanfic and imaging solutions (and politics/policies/procedures/agreements/staffing/logistics/dispatcher bandwidth) that simply don't exist. One thing is correct, no amount of technology will solve interoperability. It is an attitude change.

Let's get back to CRIS.
 
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es93546

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When there are long pursuits the CHP usually takes over if the offender moves some distance away from the original location that the driver did not comply. Also, it is standard in most pursuits for the chasing vehicle, the one immediately behind the pursued vehicle, to not talk on the radio, the second car in the pursuit does that. A lot of times, the officer calling the pursuit in the second car will be replaced with another vehicle that has had the time to make frequency changes. This is one reason you see cars at the front rotate out of the pursuit or further back in line. This also helps with stress control, not being in the hot seat for too long.

What are you talking about? Why would a vehicle do any crossband repeating?

I’m talking about how it’s done in Kern county where there is a LB, VHF and UHF repeater sites all tied together. When CHP and locals needto talk to each other just go to the cross band repeater. What comes in one band goes out the others.
The cross band repeat is an important function. The CHP can bring up federal frequencies used on a wildland fire, for example. It is seamless to. They don't need to know that their handheld is on 700 MHz and the Bureau of Land Management is on VHF High. The radio has a display that shows them the channel they are on, say BLM Central California Fire Net, and the radio user just rotates a dial. That is my understanding after looking at a CHP officer's handheld at the county fair in fall of 2019, albeit, very briefly. The officer explained the rest of it to me. He complained to me that CHP radios are crap though and I'm not sure why he would say that. He is too young to remember the 1950's era portables I used in the USFS in the early 1970's. A 40 lb. metal box with batteries bigger than what goes in a car now.
 

PrivatelyJeff

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When there are long pursuits the CHP usually takes over if the offender moves some distance away from the original location that the driver did not comply. Also, it is standard in most pursuits for the chasing vehicle, the one immediately behind the pursued vehicle, to not talk on the radio, the second car in the pursuit does that. A lot of times, the officer calling the pursuit in the second car will be replaced with another vehicle that has had the time to make frequency changes. This is one reason you see cars at the front rotate out of the pursuit or further back in line. This also helps with stress control, not being in the hot seat for too long.



The cross band repeat is an important function. The CHP can bring up federal frequencies used on a wildland fire, for example. It is seamless to. They don't need to know that their handheld is on 700 MHz and the Bureau of Land Management is on VHF High. The radio has a display that shows them the channel they are on, say BLM Central California Fire Net, and the radio user just rotates a dial. That is my understanding after looking at a CHP officer's handheld at the county fair in fall of 2019, albeit, very briefly. The officer explained the rest of it to me. He complained to me that CHP radios are crap though and I'm not sure why he would say that. He is too young to remember the 1950's era portables I used in the USFS in the early 1970's. A 40 lb. metal box with batteries bigger than what goes in a car now.

Falling back also helps with wear and tear. While they can drive really fast, they can’t do it forever and eventually the cars will over heat so the lead will back off to cool down and let the next guy get on it.

As for the XBR, yeah but that’s only for the IVR. It’s one radio connecting to the 800 for the portable, not mixing and matching VHF to UHF or LB to VHF, etc.
 

PrivatelyJeff

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Now back to CRIS: I don’t think there will be a full statewide system of systems. At best there might be shared tower space. Whatever interop plans agencies have now work well enough.
 

es93546

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Falling back also helps with wear and tear. While they can drive really fast, they can’t do it forever and eventually the cars will over heat so the lead will back off to cool down and let the next guy get on it.

As for the XBR, yeah but that’s only for the IVR. It’s one radio connecting to the 800 for the portable, not mixing and matching VHF to UHF or LB to VHF, etc.
I can't follow you, too many abbreviations.
 

mcjones2013

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Well this pop up today in Monterery County

Site: 1.36 NAC=9D6

Channel 1-1772: 773.08125 SCC
Channel 1-1848: 773.55625 CC
Channel 1-1884: 773.78125 SCC
Channel 1-1972: 774.33125 SCC
My initial thought, was that this is the Loma Prieta site. But based on terrain and distance, maybe not? Also a possible Loma Prieta has already been identified in the RRDB. Additionally, the site number doesn't seem to align with the others in the "Bay Area Region", so I'm going to guess they're starting the Phase 3 - Central Coast Region build-out.
 
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My initial thought, was that this is the Loma Prieta site. But based on terrain and distance, maybe not? Also a possible Loma Prieta has already been identified in the RRDB. Additionally, the site number doesn't seem to align with the others in the "Bay Area Region", so I'm going to guess they're starting the Phase 3 - Central Coast Region build-out.
Well comparing the signal strength it's coming stronger then site 20 and it must be behind me do to my yagi. It's coming on par with Moco Williams Hill's site.
 

es93546

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@KevinC - can we clean this thread up? So much off topic noise.
I don't think it is all noise. There is some discussion of what this CRIS is ultimately going to be, I think that is very relevant. Then someone talked up CRIS as being a solution when pursuits over long distances occur. The claim was made that officers would more easily be able to handle the longer distances as the CRIS would switch the radio to a new electronic site without the officer having to switch frequencies. That elicited some discussion that a system like CRIS isn't essential to long pursuits and switching radio channels.

Both of these discussions were started when the design and use of CRIS was being discussed. I think those discussions are pertinent to CRIS. Some seem to think this will be the all do over, all capable, every agency radio system for all of California. They think this will be like the Colorado state system or the new one New Mexico is building. Others think it will be an OES system to assist agencies when they need to have interoperability with other agencies. All the state and local agencies will retain their existing and planned systems, with CRIS there to help San Francisco officers to talk with the CHP on a large incident for example. Another example would be Livermore FD being able to talk with Cal Fire. CRIS would be a bridge and bridge only for such needs.

I think the debate of how CRIS will be used when it is built out is valid and relevant. I didn't think this thread was to discuss specific sites and frequencies only. The title is CRIS, not CRIS sites coming on line, frequencies of CRIS sites, etc.
 

Outerdog

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I think the debate of how CRIS will be used when it is built out is valid and relevant. I didn't think this thread was to discuss specific sites and frequencies only. The title is CRIS, not CRIS sites coming on line, frequencies of CRIS sites, etc.
Traditionally, these threads are used to discuss system particulars, details and findings, (for example: SVRCS, EBRCS, SDRCS) and not stray so far off topic as to debate whether or not a CHP patrol vehicle radio deck can patch. It's too broad, off topic and discourages participation. I might as well discuss the colors of the leaves on trees because the CRIS frequencies will pass through them.

But whatever. You do you.
 

es93546

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Traditionally, these threads are used to discuss system particulars, details and findings, (for example: SVRCS, EBRCS, SDRCS) and not stray so far off topic as to debate whether or not a CHP patrol vehicle radio deck can patch. It's too broad, off topic and discourages participation. I might as well discuss the colors of the leaves on trees because the CRIS frequencies will pass through them.

But whatever. You do you.
I appreciate what you are saying. I think the tree example is an exaggeration though. I don't think there has been another thread about this system, it is a new discovery we've heard about due to this thread. As it is new and this is the first thread I think the overall mission of the system needs discussion. Most of the other systems are obvious as to what the mission of the system is to be, the example of the EBRCS, it is self evident. The CRIS system is not.
 
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