Listening to the archives from the working fire in 6's area last night. BC-1 requested a "Water Supply Taskforce". First time hearing that. Appears to be 2 Engines, 2 Tankers, & Water Supply 27.
Changes coming to AA Fire
- Thread starter troymail
- Start date
- Status
What's Water Supply 27?
troymail
Silent Key
New LDH unit at Maryland City
What the procedure / setup using large diameter hose? Can you link any references?
troymail
Silent Key
The best basic description I know of for LDH is "creating a temporary water main" or "laying a water main in the street" - usually (but not limited to) non-hydrant areas where water needs to be brought into the area from a distance.
With smaller the hose, you get far less actual water and more pressure loss due to friction. As a result, you need more side by side hoselays and pumpers in line to regenerate the pressure to get water to fight the fire.
Aside from allowing more water given the hose size, there is significantly less loss in LDH requiring less hose and less equipment to get the water you need.
Last edited:
I guess there is less friction loss in LDH, makes sense. I was wondering how they would keep the pumper with the LDH supplied with enough water, and the connections to other engines. I'll have to find a pump operations manual / training materials somewhere.
troymail
Silent Key
With LDH, since you need fewer 'relay' pumpers, units can focus on draft and shuttle operations to feed the flow. Of course, this also takes less time to setup than multiple lines, appliances, and pumpers. It is also really helpful in tight areas... you need alot of room for portable tanks and units dumping into those tanks.
WA3CSX
Member
So my 536 on the AACOFD has gone silent. I have reloaded the sentinel program twice and still nothing. Any ideas???
Make sure all the alternate control channels are programmed in - an alternate cch 854.8125 is the current active control channel. Not sure how long it will last.
Adding, check that all control channels are listed in AACo's entry in the Favorites List that gets loaded when you start up the radio. Updating the database or reloading programming doesn't necessarily change the data / frequencies in Favorite lists. I've seen missing system / control channel frequencies in Favorites Lists. It's also possible that there are errors in your SD card, but it's more likely a programming issue since your radio went deaf when the system's control channel rolled to another frequency.
Several large scale water rescues today. They seem to be assigned to TG Juliette - Special Operations. Perhaps because they are using boats, and/or interoperating with another county? Earlier today the water rescue call involved units from Calvert, QAC, Talbot and AACo. They also patched in a MSP helo that was using Kilo - Box (South.) - must not have Juliette programmed.
Update:
Trooper 2 is responding on this evening's rescue, and patched into Juilette from Lima - Box (South.)
USCG release from this afternoon's search (note that they got the number of fireboats way off):
News Release
June 27, 2018
U.S. Coast Guard 5th District PA Detachment Baltimore
Contact: Coast Guard PA Detachment Baltimore
Office: (410) 576-2541
After Hours: (757) 202-3429
Maryland Natural Resources Police
Candy Thomson: (410) 279-3916
PA Detachment Baltimore online newsroom
Coast Guard, state, local agencies search for missing man off Kent Island, Maryland
BALTIMORE – Coast Guard crews, with state and local partners, are searching by air and sea for a man who reportedly fell overboard between Kent Narrows and Herring Bay, Wednesday afternoon.
The missing man is described as being a white male, about 6-feet tall, 180-190 pounds, wearing blue shorts and a dark shirt without a life jacket.
Coast Guard Sector Maryland-National Capital Region received a report at about 2:45 p.m., that a person aboard a 40-foot cabin cruiser was missing. The boat owner, a novice, had gotten underway with his friend. During the trip, the friend had gone below deck and when he had not reappeared about an hour later and once the boat was in calmer waters, the owner searched the boat for his friend.
After realizing his friend was no longer aboard, he called a friend on shore, who called the Coast Guard. The reporting source stated that the man had likely fallen overboard between Kent Narrows and Herring Bay.
The sector command center launched search crews aboard a 45-foot response boat from Station Annapolis and an MH-65 Dolphin helicopter from Air Station Atlantic City, New Jersey. Additionally, the Maryland Natural Resources Police responded with boats and a helicopter, the Maryland State Police has searched with Trooper 2 and Anne Arundel County Fire Department deployed a boat.
The on-scene weather was reported as 25 knot winds, 4-to-5-foot seas and a water temperature of 75 degrees.
If anyone sees anything in the vicinity south of Kent Island, it is requested that they contact the Coast Guard sector command center on VHF-FM channel 16, or at 410-576-2525.
-USCG-
Update:
Trooper 2 is responding on this evening's rescue, and patched into Juilette from Lima - Box (South.)
USCG release from this afternoon's search (note that they got the number of fireboats way off):
News Release
June 27, 2018
U.S. Coast Guard 5th District PA Detachment Baltimore
Contact: Coast Guard PA Detachment Baltimore
Office: (410) 576-2541
After Hours: (757) 202-3429
Maryland Natural Resources Police
Candy Thomson: (410) 279-3916
PA Detachment Baltimore online newsroom
Coast Guard, state, local agencies search for missing man off Kent Island, Maryland
BALTIMORE – Coast Guard crews, with state and local partners, are searching by air and sea for a man who reportedly fell overboard between Kent Narrows and Herring Bay, Wednesday afternoon.
The missing man is described as being a white male, about 6-feet tall, 180-190 pounds, wearing blue shorts and a dark shirt without a life jacket.
Coast Guard Sector Maryland-National Capital Region received a report at about 2:45 p.m., that a person aboard a 40-foot cabin cruiser was missing. The boat owner, a novice, had gotten underway with his friend. During the trip, the friend had gone below deck and when he had not reappeared about an hour later and once the boat was in calmer waters, the owner searched the boat for his friend.
After realizing his friend was no longer aboard, he called a friend on shore, who called the Coast Guard. The reporting source stated that the man had likely fallen overboard between Kent Narrows and Herring Bay.
The sector command center launched search crews aboard a 45-foot response boat from Station Annapolis and an MH-65 Dolphin helicopter from Air Station Atlantic City, New Jersey. Additionally, the Maryland Natural Resources Police responded with boats and a helicopter, the Maryland State Police has searched with Trooper 2 and Anne Arundel County Fire Department deployed a boat.
The on-scene weather was reported as 25 knot winds, 4-to-5-foot seas and a water temperature of 75 degrees.
If anyone sees anything in the vicinity south of Kent Island, it is requested that they contact the Coast Guard sector command center on VHF-FM channel 16, or at 410-576-2525.
-USCG-
Last edited:
Juliet is always used for water rescue assignments since they made the changes a few months ago. Talbot Boat 70 marked up on Kilo and Fire Alarm advised that they would patch them in to Juliet. This has happened in the past with one of the Eastern Shore Counties since they don't have Juliet in their radio.
I am not aware of the reason for the patch from Lima on the other call.
Not exactly sure why Juliette is the preferred TG for water rescues when its likely that neighboring jurisdictions and assets assigned to the call will not have that channel programmed into their radios. One reason for this was hinted at during the last control board meeting. The operations managers of the different systems have a hard time getting together because of scheduling and personnel changes. Kinda ironic because of all the money spent on / capability of these systems that the humans running them cannot interop.
Last edited:
Which is absolute BS. Why a neighboring jurisdiction cannot add 16 talkgroups to their radios by now is inexcusable. It is 2018 people. The next area west doesn't have these issues. Communications should be the first thing considered when discussing mutual aide.
troymail
Silent Key
The problem is likely that when a jurisdiction makes significant changes to their talkgroups (as Anne Arundel did a few years ago), it may or may not be fully coordinated with all neighboring jurisidcitions and/or those jurisdicitions may not want to take the time to reprogram all of their radios everytime a neighboring area decides to make lots of changes.
There have always been issues at times -
There was a time when Baltimore City went P25 and Anne Arundel couldn't communicate because AA didn't have digital radios. Over time, digital radios stated being issued to the stations that were likely to run mutual aid and eventually the rest of the county received them.
Occasionally, I'd hear a unit coming from Baltimore County that didn't have (or at least said they didn't have) the talkgroup that was assigned in their radio (note: many times, the mutual aid responders just didn't know how to find the right zone and talkgroups on their radio). At other times I'd hear "we don't have KILO on our radio, we only have TAC-1, TAC-2, etc." (which by the way are the same thing).
Locating Interop channels becomes a similar problem - just like other jurisdictional talkgroups, you have to know how to find them on the radio.
It's like any other tool - if you don't routinely train using those "other zones" and talkgroups (making use of the radio part of your training), you can't use the tool when you need it.
Having said that - with various dispatcher patching options available, even if units don't have some specific talkgroup in their radio (or just don't know how to switch to it), there should still be no reason units cannot communicate directly if needed.
There have always been issues at times -
There was a time when Baltimore City went P25 and Anne Arundel couldn't communicate because AA didn't have digital radios. Over time, digital radios stated being issued to the stations that were likely to run mutual aid and eventually the rest of the county received them.
Occasionally, I'd hear a unit coming from Baltimore County that didn't have (or at least said they didn't have) the talkgroup that was assigned in their radio (note: many times, the mutual aid responders just didn't know how to find the right zone and talkgroups on their radio). At other times I'd hear "we don't have KILO on our radio, we only have TAC-1, TAC-2, etc." (which by the way are the same thing).
Locating Interop channels becomes a similar problem - just like other jurisdictional talkgroups, you have to know how to find them on the radio.
It's like any other tool - if you don't routinely train using those "other zones" and talkgroups (making use of the radio part of your training), you can't use the tool when you need it.
Having said that - with various dispatcher patching options available, even if units don't have some specific talkgroup in their radio (or just don't know how to switch to it), there should still be no reason units cannot communicate directly if needed.
It seems the NCR is way ahead in terms of regional coordination vs. the counties that surround the bay - which is not even an official "region" wrt mutual aid / interoperability / resource coordination. It needs to be.
This still occurs. In the past month or so, I heard at least once BCoFD say they didn't have a channel (if I remember correctly it was talkgroup "Hotel").
---------------
Not picking on Anne Arundel but every county should have their radio talkgroup chart placed in each apparatus. So everyone can easily know and switch to a neighboring jurisdiction zone's talkgroup with ease. Maybe these charts are in the apparatus but if they aren't, they should.
troymail
Silent Key
I'm certain those types of things were in the units at one time but like many things of that type, they tend to disappear over time (or get lost in the bottom of the map box). It is just one of those things (like an Amtrak emergency guide) that ends up covered up by lots of other things... You have to experience sitting in those tight cabs with all that gear, equipment and other stuff during an emergency response... I don't recall ever looking for a document during a response and preparing to use a nozzle, saw or other rescue equipment -
Last edited:
There are these things called "checklists" that we use in aviation. Perhaps during the shift change / daily apparatus checkouts that standardized lists can be used that make sure that necessary equipment and reference materials are aboard. There are ways to mitigate human error / indifference. BTW, I'm not blaming anyone because these are perennial issues, but there is a reason that in aviation, accidents / equipment failures are exceedingly rare.
Last edited:
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
