Yes been hearing CNF ADMIN NET running checks on hand guns. Probably out in the forest making sure hunting season permits are active and guns are legit registered. Enforcing the law in the forest.
Cleveland National Forest New Forest Net
- Thread starter KK6UME
- Start date
I'm on a loaner computer as mine suffered a motherboard failure. When I can access my files I will get back to you.
Any luck with the computer?
Computers, bah humbug :-( I had to pull the hard drive out of a computer that isn't quite 2 years old yet. I hooked it up to my dad's computer, but his is only Windows 7 and mine was 10.
Here is a link:
https://www.fs.fed.us/fire/management/assessments/CaliforniaSubTeamReport.pdf
Go to page #42 and read under Recommendation. The following wording is in there:
"1) fully implement the proposed LE Net in Region 5 with tone guard, P25 compliance, encryption and operational procedures."
This document is dated in September 2012. It says that there is already a proposal to build out a R5 LE Net that includes P25 and ENCRYPTION. There are a lot of posts in threads in the Calif. forum that have reports of the region wide LE net showing up on new repeaters, most especially in northern Calif. The southern CA posts, not only just on this thread, have been reporting P25 operations for a few years now, some on the old R5 LE net on 166.1250.
I'm assuming that the proposal is still the plan. I don't have any information beyond that other than from a source in R5 that says he heard the net is still headed to encryption and this contact was made last spring or summer.
Let me clear up the confusion you have with written information, contact and source. Source may be inferred by many people as a person. To me source means source of information and that might be a person, contact or a document I've found. I remembered reading about the R5 LE Net in the minutes of a dispatcher's conference, which lead up to the report I linked. I didn't try to find the dispatcher conference minutes as the report is more recent and is final, the minutes are not. I was sloppy in my language and that might have caused confusion, sorry about that, I'm getting old.
I worked about half my career in Calif at two different NPS park units in fire management. I spent the latter half of my career in the Rocky Mtns, the last unit I was at was in the Northern Rockies. I was poking around trying to get frequency and other fire related information for all 5 federal wildland fire/natural resource agencies (NPS, BLM, USFWS, BIA and USFS) after a former coworker invited me to a prescribed fire operation on a National Wildlife Refuge in the east. Much to my wife's and kid's consternation I can't seem to get fire out of my blood. Between my former landlord and this I got interested in scanners. The coworker now working for the USFWS gave me someone to contact about information. I wanted Arizona and New Mexico info, but I haven't found anyone to pass info on to me here and the person I now stay in touch with works at a federal land management unit in CA so he has passed along a lot of information for R5, including the document I linked to. I just found the link tonight as I thought the report was not posted on a publicly accessible website.
I can't share most of what the person in Calif passes along to me. Starting about 2004 management put pressure on us to not make frequency and dispatch info public. By the time I retired in 2015 the pressure had become nearly a threat. Sharing info between retirees so they can keep their hand in fire is one thing. Taking that info and sharing it online it not really going to happen. I'm also not all that interested in law enforcement info. I stayed away from LE in the NPS as I wanted to spend my time with trees, brush, grass, critters and fire ecology and wasn't interested in dealing with unreasonable visitors. I had my fill of them when they would come up to us when we were allowing fires to burn and while we were lighting prescribed fires.
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P.S. I thought I would use my access to update the USFS R5 NF wiki, but I've decided I shouldn't. All the pressure those last 10 years while working is the main reason. The Northern Rockies GACC made things rather clear about that after someone leaked the GACC frequency directory back in about 2012 or 2013. We couldn't even get the next years version on a computer, we had to go to our dispatcher to get a printed copy and they would not let us have enough.
When I see links like that I try paring them back to see what else might be in the directory:
https://www.fs.fed.us/fire/management/assessments/ and it is also old info but still interesting.
The cache includes lots of documents with the seemingly main thrust being about the cost savings of consolidating dispatch centers and not so much about actual planning for encrypted LE Nets.
I read through the 4+ year old document referenced and what I see are unsupported recommendations but not a PLAN to actually implement encryption in an effective manner. To properly service the LEOs in Cleveland NF they need more than three widely scattered P25 repeaters that don't work very well. A full solution takes a bunch of capital which could explain the poor progress towards the recommendations.
The 2012 document clearly states the financial challenges:
"• This alternative will require building out a radio system for law enforcement dispatch area coverage with tone protection and encryption capabilities. The cost to build out the radio system statewide will be a major financial commitment.
• Facilities, equipment, and staffing will require an upfront capital outlay."
I can understand that LEOs may push for encryption but obtaining funding falls on others to achieve.
Other comments/replies:
Not seen the other posts and I can try to search for them but that will take a while. The three forests that I can hear today have very limited P25 in Cleveland NF and no encryption in use.
Thanks for elaborating on the confusing mix of overlapping terms that you used for your info sources.
I trolled a bit for Arizona USFS freq info for your areas of interest. The Master Plan looks the most interesting:
www.k7yca.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/2016-Master-Radio-Plan.pdf
https://gacc.nifc.gov/gbcc/logistics/docs/
US Forest Service - Coconino National Forest (AZ) - The RadioReference Wiki
U.S. Government Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference
US Forest Service - Apache-Sitgreaves National Forest (AZ) - The RadioReference Wiki
Not had a chance just yet to see what is out there for New Mexico.
If you can't share you can't share but it may be better not to mention it at all.
I am interested in the LE folks as well as the repeater systems.
Best regards,
Jim
Orange County, CA
I looked back three years on the Sac Valley Area and also Greater LA Area sub-forums and found nothing recent enough to have much bearing. The main California forum had one post from Ex-Smokey that discussed LE digital but did not definitively list out activity.
http://forums.radioreference.com/ca...319303-usfs-le-activity-n-ca.html#post2448980
What I am not seeing is evidence that they are currently expanding the LE Net repeater locations to match the same locations as Admin and Forest nets. I imagine that as funding becomes available they will go for that. I will keep monitoring my 3 local forests for changes/expansion to the current LS repeaters.
It was really useful to go back and read the historical threads so thanks for motivating me to finally accomplish that!
Jim
Orange County, CA
They are trying out Tac5 now.
2King1 out of service at 19:20 PST
Just a little thought and something to think about. It might be best not to post on the internet forums about where USFS LE is going and doing and also checking in for the day and checking out for the day. Seems like this has been a pattern on this thread. Just saying and not trying to throw stones. Just a friendly thing to think about.
This might creep them out if they start reading these post or get wind of what is going on. Keep this info within your own home and enjoy what you can still hear.
Agree. I don't think we need a running blog of who's checking in where. This goes beyond the original purpose of the thread.
Reading through the thread it looks like it's purpose was to identify frequencies and tones and it appears that was mostly accomplished. Let's stick to the topic please.
Reading through the thread it looks like it's purpose was to identify frequencies and tones and it appears that was mostly accomplished. Let's stick to the topic please.
I honestly took this message to heart and created the new thread so that I could discuss more than just frequencies and tones. I will be glad to continue to post here! I spend a fair amount of time in CNF and have a number of reasons to learn more about USFS operations.
How do I add reception reports to the CNF Wiki????
US Forest Service - Cleveland National Forest (CA) - The RadioReference Wiki
For a radio monitor it is good to know how the CNF repeaters are used and roughly where the users are with respect to the repeater sites listed in the excellent Wiki.
US Forest Service - Cleveland National Forest (CA) - The RadioReference Wiki
One resource is the CNF page for listing the three districts HQs: Descanso, Trabuco and Palomar.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/main/cleveland/about-forest/districts
The rough outlines of the districts can be viewed in the Motor Vehicle Use Maps available here:
Cleveland National Forest 4x4 & OHV Access Maps and Info
This information and knowledge of the terrain can make it easier to understand repeater coverage and the various activities heard on the USFS nets.
US Forest Service - Cleveland National Forest (CA) - The RadioReference Wiki
One resource is the CNF page for listing the three districts HQs: Descanso, Trabuco and Palomar.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/main/cleveland/about-forest/districts
The rough outlines of the districts can be viewed in the Motor Vehicle Use Maps available here:
Cleveland National Forest 4x4 & OHV Access Maps and Info
This information and knowledge of the terrain can make it easier to understand repeater coverage and the various activities heard on the USFS nets.
