In case of power outage .

[vagrant]

A. If I need to dry my clothes, I would string a line up and hang them. Trust me it works, even indoors during the winter!
B. I would use my generator for the fridge/freezer during the day and turn it off at night.
C. I have various solar panels, controllers and plenty-o-batteries. If the sun wasn't cooperating, I would top up the batteries on the generator.
D. I have a 12v fridge as well. I would rent that space.

No permits needed. Plenty of money saved.

 

[n1das]

Hi...
Good to hear that you have an arrangement.
A lot of times that kind of thing requires a building permit.

I'm all for back-ups for everything, but ..... _________.

Thanks
Joel

No building permit required. A licensed electrician installed the interlock in the panel and installed a 240VAC power inlet receptacle on the outside of the house. All set for plugging a portable Gen into the house safely and legally. The interlock setup offers more flexibility than a transfer switch and is cheaper and easier to install.

 

[MUTNAV]

That's great, all the electricians around here refuse to do that, they also want to control what kind of generator you have installed. I assume they all want the money for installing a generator also.

I even pointed out in the N.E.C. how it could be done safely and legally.

I live in a rental (move around too much to buy at this point) and am just not willing to to a full install,
the arrangement that you have is as far as I would be willing to go.

I really just need to power a well pump, and two fridges. Once again though, not my house, so plug in items only with a portable.

Thanks
Joel

 

[belvdr]

No building permit required. A licensed electrician installed the interlock in the panel and installed a 240VAC power inlet receptacle on the outside of the house. All set for plugging a portable Gen into the house safely and legally. The interlock setup offers more flexibility than a transfer switch and is cheaper and easier to install.

I looked at this option as well, but opted for the transfer switch. I think it was $300, but what I lose in flexibility, I gain in peace of mind. I know I'm not going to overload the generator. It's one of those decisions you have to make when making a portion of the house on the generator.

I have everything but A/C, heat pump (propane backup though), and the garage. None of that is considered essential in our home though, so it works well.

That's great, all the electricians around here refuse to do that, they also want to control what kind of generator you have installed. I assume they all want the money for installing a generator also.

I even pointed out in the N.E.C. how it could be done safely and legally.

I live in a rental (move around too much to buy at this point) and am just not willing to to a full install,
the arrangement that you have is as far as I would be willing to go.

I really just need to power a well pump, and two fridges. Once again though, not my house, so plug in items only with a portable.

Thanks
Joel

Ask an electrician if he/she will build a 120V breakout box from a 240V outlet. This would allow you to run a long 240V cord from the generator, connect the breakout box to it, then connect your 120V appliances to it. Of course, running a fridge off a 120V extension cord is not recommended, so you might need to discuss it more with them to find the optimal configuration.

 

[MUTNAV]

I could probably do that myself, or buy one, although this thing seems pretty expensive for what it does.

Marinco EEL Shore Power Y-Adapter – 50A Male to 30A Females | West Marine

Safely split power with the Marinco EEL Shore Power Y-Adapter. Connect 50A 125/250V to dual 30A 125V outlets, perfect for powering multiple devices on board.

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Good thinking for keeping line losses lower.

For the radios though, I think using my battery powered lawn equipment batteries are more appropriate.

Thanks
Joel

 

[KMG54]

We have talked about batteries and chargers for keeping our radios running during a power outage. OK, so what do you do to back up the AC power with in case of an outage so that you don't need to use the batteries yet?

In addition to batteries and charger, I have a 6800W portable generator and an interlocked connection to the electric panel in my house. I can run everything in the house on the generator except for the electric stove. I can run the electric clothes dryer provided I keep other stuff turned off. I have to be careful with the total power budget when loading the generator.

It takes only a few minutes to swap the house connection from commercial AC power to the generator. I would love to have a permanently installed and fully automatic generator setup but that costs $$$$$.$$. A good portable Gen with an interlock in the electric panel for a safe (and legal) generator connection is an inexpensive and practical way to go. I have receptacle outside the house for the generator connection. The interlock in the panel consists of a metal sliding plate between the main breaker and a pair of 30A ganged circuit breakers installed in the top two slots on the right hand side of the panel (Square-D brand panel). The main breaker has to be first moved to the OFF position to allow the plate to be moved to allow the pair of 30A circuit breakers to be turned on for the generator connection. When these circuit breakers are ON, the metal plate physically blocks the main breaker from being able to be flipped on. To switch back to commercial AC power, the generator circuit breakers have to be turned off to allow the plate to be moved to allow the main breaker to be flipped on. Each physically locks the other out so that the main breaker and the pair of breakers for the generator can't be on at the same time. Either the main breaker or the pair of 30A breakers for the generator can be turned on, never both at the same time.

I also installed a propane conversion kit on the generator to allow running the Gen on propane instead of gasoline. I use a standard 15 lb. gas grille propane cylinder. The ability to run the Gen on gasoline is fully retained so that the generator can run on either gasoline or propane, giving it dual-fuel capability. Having one of these kits installed on the generator also opens up a lot of other possibilities for fueling the generator. The propane conversion kit is from PropaneCarbs.com. (www.propanecarbs.com) Very easy to install. I recommend watching the how-to videos on the site.

250 gallon propane tank here for my fireplace, grille and generator. My setup may not be perfectly legal, but a 50 amp plug on the outside of the garage, kill the main, fire up the generator and keep living.

 

[a417]

'replace existing'

 

[belvdr]

250 gallon propane tank here for my fireplace, grille and generator. My setup may not be perfectly legal, but a 50 amp plug on the outside of the garage, kill the main, fire up the generator and keep living.

It’s nowhere near legal. One slip and you can seriously hurt or kill someone. I don’t know why folks won’t do this the correct way.

 

[a417]

there are plenty of people in our area with the exact same setup, codes came out - gave them certificate of occupancy ... so ymmv.

 

[MUTNAV]

I don’t know why folks won’t do this the correct way.

I think it's because of an assumption that everything else is wired correctly to begin with (Big assumption) and that others won't ever have to use it (house is sold, relatives come over and the one or two people in the house that know how to work it properly aren't available due to ill health, dementia (which gets to many of us eventually, etc...) or that don't know the "trick" of how to make it work safely.

I think a lot of people also don't read all of the accident reports of competent experienced people "blowing it" when it comes to properly doing things.

The Air Force Safety Magazine doesn't get to publish all of those cool articles about accidents (which are by far human caused) because everyone always uses the right things the right way all of the time.

(Sorry... that's like a double negative sarcasm )

Thanks
Joel

 

[scanmanmi]

My setup may not be perfectly legal, but a 50 amp plug on the outside of the garage, kill the main, fire up the generator and keep living.

If you don't have an interlock you need to get one NOW! You won't just kill the main you'll kill someone up up line if you accidentally (yes it will happen) have both on.

 

[n1das]

Pics of the interlock in my SQUARE D brand panel and power inlet receptacle......




Prior to switchover to the generator:
1. Start generator and allow engine to warm up.
2. Connect generator power cord to generator 240VAC outlet and to 240VAC house inlet.

To switch from Utility power to Generator power:
1. Turn all branch circuit breakers OFF.
2. Flip main circuit breaker to the left to turn OFF.
3. Slide interlock plate UP to allow ganged pair of 30A circuit breakers to be turned ON.
4. Turn ON ganged pair of 30A circuit breakers for the generator.
5. Turn ON individual circuit breakers to supply branch circuits that are essential.

Turning on circuit breakers individually for essential branch circuits as a last step minimizes the inrush current that the generator and the pair of 30A circuit breakers will see. There will be no arcing/pitting of connections to the generator or contacts inside the pair of 30A circuit breakers because these connections are already made.

Reverse the order of operations to switch back to Utility power.

In the past I have run extension cords to the fridge and to power other stuff during a power outage. What a PITA. Never again. That's what prompted me to get the interlock and generator power inlet installed.

 

[n1das]

That's great, all the electricians around here refuse to do that, they also want to control what kind of generator you have installed. I assume they all want the money for installing a generator also.

I even pointed out in the N.E.C. how it could be done safely and legally.

I live in a rental (move around too much to buy at this point) and am just not willing to to a full install,
the arrangement that you have is as far as I would be willing to go.

I really just need to power a well pump, and two fridges. Once again though, not my house, so plug in items only with a portable.

Thanks
Joel

It sounds like the electricians in your area don't do generator installations on a regular basis.

This is interesting because the team of 2 licensed electricians I used specialize in generator installations. Much of the work they do are interlock and power inlet receptacle installations like what I have but they also install complete fully automatic setups. I emailed them pics of my panel ahead of time so they knew which interlock kit to bring with them when they came to do the install.

 

[scanmanmi]

I picked up a couple of digital volt/amp meters. When the generator is on they light up showing voltage and current on each leg. I had to go through the house with an ammeter and figure out how much things draw and what I can run at the same time. Turns out my well takes 7 amps. If I need to do a load of laundry I need to shut off the boiler and frige! I rewired things I would want on onto different breaker legs to balance it.

 

[scanmanmi]

Once again though, not my house, so plug in items only with a portable.

Believe it or not, not all generators are made to have things plugged into them. Yes, they sure do have outlets on them but many (like mine) came designed to be plugged into the house. The problem is with grounding. It is relying on the house ground. Look for a sticker about guidelines if you want to plug things straigth into it. On mine there is something I would have to attach. Fine print.

 

[AJAT]

Decided to go with a lawn tractor battery .

I would recommend a deep cycle battery they are designed for what you want to do. You can get 20aH from amazon for under 100 bucks

 

[AJAT]

All the Person wanted to do was power a radio I would say interlocks generators and propane are a little extreme just to power a scanner

 

[MUTNAV]

All the Person wanted to do was power a radio I would say interlocks generators and propane are a little extreme just to power a scanner

Yes... True... Do to current events I think a lot of us are thinking "Black Swan" events, or rolling blackouts, or power outages from fire risk issues.

My preference for just a scanner would have been the lawn and garden electric appliance batteries (I hate using gas motors when I don't have to, so I have a bunch, for PITA, not "environmental" issues).

or a battery start up booster for a vehicle... with a 12volt plug.

But... if a lawn tractor battery works. Great.

Thanks
Joel

 

[KMG54]

Sit in the dark with your radio. Sounds like fun. I think the point was to say get a generator so at the least, you can power your Refrigerator and microwave so you can eat. Also coming from hurricane central, it is nice to turn the bathroom light on.

 

[KMG54]

If you don't have an interlock you need to get one NOW! You won't just kill the main you'll kill someone up up line if you accidentally (yes it will happen) have both on.

A DVOM will tell you it is isolated with the main killed, two bus bars in the middle of the panel. With the main killed make sure they read zero volts. And most importantly do not turn the main on. During the hurricanes of 2004 in Stuart Florida, county code came out and banned extension cables to neighbors, after a complaint, they reversed it and as long it was adequate gauge all was fine.