Interpretation of FCC Part 97 Emergency Distress Operations Rules

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WPXS472

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I don't want to comment on the ongoing discussion directly as it seems opinions have already set up like concrete and I don't want to disagree with anyone. My comment regards the FCC and asking for opinions on rules. I had a situation arise some years ago wherein I thought some local amateurs were doing something contrary to the rules, so I wrote a letter asking for an opinion. I received a tersely worded reply saying that they were in violation. I relayed this information to one of them and thought the matter was resolved. A couple of weeks later, I got a call from the regional field engineer with the FCC telling me to mind my own business and including some thinly veiled threats regarding my own license. I had to eat crow and apologized to the local ham I had spoken with before. Just be aware that people within the FCC often render conflicting opinions. I think we have all seen cases of inconsistent enforcement.
Edit: It seems the local engineer was a personal friend of my local ham.
 
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DaveNF2G

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Read the chapter below. Note the specific words "any means of radiocommunication at its disposal "

An amateur station has amateur radiocommunication "at its disposal." I don't understand why this is so hard to grasp for some people.

Part 90 of the FCC rules prohibits possession of a transmitter that is able to transmit on frequencies for which the possessor is not licensed or authorized. Your public safety frequency mods are illegal to begin with.
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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FYI;
From an ancient USENET post. Still waiting for Riley to open his mail from me.
---------------------------------
"David A. Webb
3/7/95
(I)n speaking with Mr. Monte Dupont of the Wireless
Telecommunications Bureau of the FCC, I discovered that in his
opinion, which I assume is that of the whole Bureau, 97.403 means
any licensed ham can use any frequency, in any radio service, at
his disposal in an emergency. Mr Dupont saw my point about the
technical definitions of 'amateur station' and 'amateur service',
but he said that I was going overboard. Fine, I can accept that.
I hoped it was legal to use police frequencies in an emergency.

73's
Dave
N9HUR
mu...@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu"
-----------------------

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.radio.amateur.misc/V4RPBY0NXXY
 

N4GIX

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Part 90 of the FCC rules prohibits possession of a transmitter that is able to transmit on frequencies for which the possessor is not licensed or authorized. Your public safety frequency mods are illegal to begin with.
Nearly all of my VHF/UHF equipment is Part 90 certified...

It is the actual usage of the equipment that determines legality, not the capability.
 

mmckenna

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Nearly all of my VHF/UHF equipment is Part 90 certified...

It is the actual usage of the equipment that determines legality, not the capability.

There's a "capability" side of this, as in most part 90 radios are "capable" of transmitting all over the place, compared to actually programming frequencies into the radio. Usually the possession versus use thing applies, however the FCC specifically says this:

§90.427 Precautions against unauthorized operation.
...

(b) Except for frequencies used in accordance with §90.417, no person shall program into a transmitter frequencies for which the licensee using the transmitter is not authorized.
 

RFBOSS

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Part 97: Sec. 97.403 Safety of life and protection of property No provision of these rules prevents the use by an amateur station of any means of radio communication at its disposal to provide essential communication needs in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available.

Okay, I know this is a re-post, but I am going to take it apart. This is how I see it.

There are the general rules that talk about day to day operation of various types of radios then there are the rules specifically talking about what a licensed amateur radio operator may do when faced with a situation of the immediate safety of human life.



"No provision of these rules".

Okay, what does this mean? It means nothing that is contained in these rules.

And what about nothing that contained in these rules? Nothing contained in these rules prevents.

What rules? It could be all of the FCC rules in general, but let’s narrow it down. What rules, the part 97 rules.

And what is contained in the part 97 rules. Part 97.301 the frequency bands of operation and the rest of the technical standards. What do the first 5 words of part 97.403 say?

They say no provision of these rules (that means any part of these rules) then prevents and that includes Part 97.301, limiting the frequencies and the rest of the technical standards.

Part 97.403 goes on to say "any means of radio communication at its disposal".

This means exactly what it says. "Any means", is saying that anything goes. The meaning of the word any, is fairly clear.

And then "radio communication at its disposal". Again it is what ever is at hand.

Remember the first 5 words (no provision of these rules) tell us that none of the rest of part 97 applies in the case of the safety of life and limb. And since it says "these rules" one might interpret these rules to mean all of the FCC rules, of which Part 97 is a part.

Of course we can pull and twist the meanings here, but to me it is clear that the intent of the FCC is to put the safety of life and limb first and the rules second.

Why would it be any other way?


What is prohibited?

Federal law prohibits the use of any authorized equipment in a manner that is inconsistent with the terms of its equipment authorization or that is in violation of the Communications Act or the Commission’s rules.

Okay, the “commission’s rules”. Part 97.403 is part of the commission’s rules and the first 5 words apply. The first 5 words tell us that nothing else applies when it comes to the safety of life and limb.

And then there is this.

Note: Part 73 of this chapter contains provisions governing emergency operation of standard, FM, noncommercial educational FM, and television broadcast stations. Part 97 of this chapter contains such provisions for amateur stations.

Provisions, what provisions: the provisions for an amateur station operating during an emergency.

And what do we find under Subpart E – Emergency communications?

We find our friend, Part 97.403, safety of life and protection of property, taking us back to the beginning of this post.

The thing that keeps being missed is the meaning of the first 5 words.

No provision of these rules



As previously mentioned, the government can twist the meaning of words to suite its purpose. But this is what is written.

Oh, BTW, I just found this after writing the above. The following is taken from the FCC’s web page…

Note the exception.
Operations in Emergencies

Q: Is it correct that my station must not transmit analog voice emissions on the HF band digital emission segments even during an emergency?
Yes. The Rules, including the analog/digital emission exclusive segments, are carefully designed to provide an amateur radio service in the United States that has certain fundamental purposes. Section 97.1 declares that the foremost purpose is expressed in the principle of recognition and enhancement of the value of the amateur service to the public as a voluntary, noncommercial communication service, particularly with respect to providing emergency communications. It would be illogical to abandon these Rules -- which are carefully developed through the rule making process with the input of amateur operators and organizations experienced in providing emergency communications -- during an event of the very type for which the Rules were intended.

Q: Are there exceptions?
Yes. There are two exceptions. In summary:

  1. Section 97.403 states that no provision of the Rules prevents the use by an amateur station of any means of radiocommunication at its disposal to provide essential communications in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available.
  2. Section 97.405 states that no provision of the Rules prevents the use by an amateur station in distress of any means at its disposal to attract attention, make known its condition and location, and obtain assistance. A sinking ship is a good example. It further states that no provision of the Rules prevents the use by a station, in that exceptional circumstance, of any means of radiocommunications at its disposal to assist a station in distress.

Yes. The Rules, including the analog/digital emission
And note what this says, the rules including, meaning not only analog/digital as posed in the question, but the rest of the rules. And then it goes one to point out specific exceptions and what is allowed and even gives an example of a sinking boat.

Again, in these writings the mind set of the FCC is clear. Do what you need to do to save a life.

Of course it is possible for someone in government to twist the meaning of the above and give it a completely opposite meaning.
 

cmdrwill

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RFboss, good explanation Sir.

Makes sense, but let us not have to 'need' to use this. In other words, let us hope we do not have such a emergency. Be Safe.
 

madrabbitt

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2.405 does not apply to amateur radio, if you read the foot notes you will see that it defers to 97.403

97.403 simply relieves an amateur station operator from the burden of the rules in part 97 which we can all agree sets forth limitations of frequency, bandwidth and power. In fact, it gives the amateur radio operator the same rights as "ordinary citizens" during an emergency.

Examples:

Citizen used officer's radio to call 911 following fatal shootin - WMC Action News 5 - Memphis, Tennessee

Citizen Used Cop's Radio to Call for Help | NBC 7 San Diego

So, i had 3 wonderful days off, and i'm late coming back to this party, and this may have already been discussed, mentioned, or even beaten to death...
But those examples are apples to oranges.
A random citizen used the police officer's radio to call for help.
A radio that was
1. NOT the citizen's
2. PROGRAMMED by the SYSTEM OWNER on the system.
3. Licensed, as is one of the radios accounted for on the system license.

I work in fire dispatch now, on a system without radio ID's, but for the sake of argument, lets say i was in law enforcement dispatch, and i got a distress call (especially from someone with genuine panic in their voice) from an unknown person, but on a department radio displaying the ID of an officer. My first reaction would be determining where that officer last called out at, and second, deploying the effin' cavalry to that location.

BUT. Not at all what we were talking about in this specific thread.

We are talking about a radio that belongs to the user, NOT authorized on any specific emergency services or public safety system, (or any other private system) calling for assistance on said system because it is "the only immediate means at your disposal"
 

SCPD

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I swore several days ago I was finished with this topic, but being unrepentantly curious, I could not resist taking a peek at it yet again. I see that the issue is far from being resolved, and I can tell it never will be, either here, or in the here- after.
I can also feel the heat from several flame throwers, about to Ugly -Flame this topic if it continues. On my return to it, I see that my own veracity- even my sex and possible species was called into question for reporting the substance of a telephone call ... a telephone call, for crying out loud!... one that anyone reading this Post could have made if they had taken the intellectual initiative to do it themselves.

But, all that aside.......

I can see there is lot more at issue here than the simple emergency use of a radio. I see it as a divide between those that can size up a situation, measure the risks, make decisions and then ACT!.. these people, as contrasted to those Milksops who are forever on the sidelines, twisting their hands in fear, who do nothing, hoping someone else will step in. I surround myself with the former, and I hope to God that if I am ever in a situation were I need that kind of help, it will be those "97.403'ers" that come to my aid.
Okay, that's off my chest; and please believe me when I say I am saying this all smiles- no animosity to anyone here. I never-the-less I think its time for me to take a seriously long break from any more Forums, and get back to other things in my life...
So guys, its been fun, and, as I am fond this saying..."(Maybe) I'll see you around here when the Snow Flies!"
Cheers :)
................................CF
 

KK4JUG

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C-F, you should know by now that there are some people who's function in life ls to question everything they see, e.g., the color of one's eyes, 2+2=4, that the moon landing was fake, that professional wrestling is real, ad infinitum, ad nauseum.

And, there are people who can't say, "I think you might be mistaken." Instead, they'll say, "Are you out of your ever-lovin' freakin' mind?" There is no tact in anything they say or do. (There seem to be an awfully lot of those here.)

I've learned to live with them (just like in real life). You should stick around and laugh at them like I do.
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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I swore several days ago I was finished with this topic, but being unrepentantly curious, I could not resist taking a peek at it yet again. I see that the issue is far from being resolved, and I can tell it never will be, either here, or in the here- after.
I can also feel the heat from several flame throwers, about to Ugly -Flame this topic if it continues. On my return to it, I see that my own veracity- even my sex and possible species was called into question for reporting the substance of a telephone call ... a telephone call, for crying out loud!... one that anyone reading this Post could have made if they had taken the intellectual initiative to do it themselves.

But, all that aside.......

I can see there is lot more at issue here than the simple emergency use of a radio. I see it as a divide between those that can size up a situation, measure the risks, make decisions and then ACT!.. these people, as contrasted to those Milksops who are forever on the sidelines, twisting their hands in fear, who do nothing, hoping someone else will step in. I surround myself with the former, and I hope to God that if I am ever in a situation were I need that kind of help, it will be those "97.403'ers" that come to my aid.
Okay, that's off my chest; and please believe me when I say I am saying this all smiles- no animosity to anyone here. I never-the-less I think its time for me to take a seriously long break from any more Forums, and get back to other things in my life...
So guys, its been fun, and, as I am fond this saying..."(Maybe) I'll see you around here when the Snow Flies!"
Cheers :)
................................CF

C-F I apologize for suggesting you were an AI, though you did pass the Turing Test!

I am hoping for a reply from Riley Hollingsworth to settle this once and for all.

I agree with you, if ever necessary I intend to interpret 97.403 as a "get out of jail free card" as far as my personal safety and that of family.

However if rendering aid to any hams I might be inclined to subject them to a pop quiz about 97.403 before taking action to get them help. I would hate to have some of these self proclaimed "Radio Police" rat on me after the helicopter drags their sad a&& to safety.
 

mmckenna

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On my return to it, I see that my own veracity- even my sex and possible species was called into question for reporting the substance of a telephone call

OK, I'll take ownership of that.

I sometimes mistakenly presume that humor and sarcasm carry better over the internet than they actually do. My comments were purely meant to be humorous. No offense intended. I'm sorry.


... a telephone call, for crying out loud!... one that anyone reading this Post could have made if they had taken the intellectual initiative to do it themselves.

You are correct, we could have made that call. I could have contacted the FCC, Reily, etc. But I chose not to. That's because I know when it comes down to it, it really doesn't matter.

As I've said at several points in this thread I would ignore the rules and do whatever necessary to preserve human life, even modifying a radio so I could get help on the way. I wouldn't fault anyone else for doing that. My reasons for posting on this thread was for the amateurs that confuse the hobby aspect with being a real live public safety professional, or for people that ignore common sense preparedness. My point all along through this was intended to be "modifying the radio shouldn't be your only act of preparing". Modify the radio if that's what you/I need to do, but preparedness shouldn't stop there.

I can see there is lot more at issue here than the simple emergency use of a radio. I see it as a divide between those that can size up a situation, measure the risks, make decisions and then ACT!.. these people, as contrasted to those Milksops who are forever on the sidelines, twisting their hands in fear, who do nothing, hoping someone else will step in. I surround myself with the former, and I hope to God that if I am ever in a situation were I need that kind of help, it will be those "97.403'ers" that come to my aid.

I can totally agree with this.
I'm heading out next week for 6 days in the Eastern Sierra Nevada mountains with a 3 or 4 others. Of those others, there is:
1 retired fire chief/EMT
1 with CERT and First Aid training.
1 with a first responder certification (me)
1 Spot beacon.
1 PLB
2 trauma kits
Enough tools to field strip an ATV on the side of the trail, rebuild carburetors, fuel pumps, repair tires, electrical systems. (and we've done all these things)
2 spare tire/wheel combinations.
2 winches with enough straps, rigging, chain, snatch blocks to lift and elephant.
Enough Part 90 radios that every UTV/ATV has a mobile mount radio with a proper antenna and at least one portable Part 90 VHF radio.
Enough fuel, water and supplies to get us to hell and back, twice.
And enough gear to do this in what sometimes turns into below freezing weather, snow storms, hail, rain, etc.

It's not just about relying on a radio for rescue. You really do need more than that. We may go overboard, but most of that gear we've used at one point or another. We've helped out so many "strangers" along the trails that we've lost count. I've rolled an ATV and broke my pelvis and had to radio others in the group for rescue, so this is more than just talk, it comes from experience. I've seen what can go wrong, and I've seen riders out on the trail that have zero gear and zero preparedness.

I shudder at the idea that some will think a radio is the only thing they need to have.

Again, I'd use a modified amateur radio to call for help if that's all I had. My encouragement would be to think beyond the radio and the hobby.
 

kayn1n32008

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I Can see there is lot more at issue here than the simple emergency use of a radio. I see it as a divide between those that can size up a situation, measure the risks, make decisions and then ACT!..

Sadly those that can size up a situation, make decisions and act are few and far between. They are also the ones that are prepared, with more than they need. They are the people that know a PLB/SPOT/sat-phone is much more useful than a hacked ham radio, or a Part 90 radio preloaded with frequencies they are not authorized on 'just in case'

I hope to God that if I am ever in a situation were I need that kind of help, it will be those "97.403'ers" that come to my aid.

Not me. I prepare, and make sure I have what I need. I also make sure those that I am with are on the same page when it comes to needing to put an ERP into use if it is me that needs the help.
 

kayn1n32008

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I agree with you, if ever necessary I intend to interpret 97.403 as a "get out of jail free card" as far as my personal safety and that of family.

I truly hope you don't plan on relying on a hacked ham radio, or a part 90 radio loaded with frequencies you are not authorized on 'just in case' that's piss poor planning, and by not preparing for what can come, you put your life and the lives of your family at risk.
Prepare, plan and have the proper tools to do the job. Do that and you will NEVER need a hacked radio or a radio with frequencies your not authorized to use, to save your bacon.

But on the other hand you might be one of those hams that salivates at the possibility of having an excuse, even if it's not a truly life and death situation, to pop up on your local first responder frequencies...

By planing, preparing, and having the right tools, you will never need a hacked ham radio.

I know this because I have "been there, done that" I even have the t-shirt for using radio to get real help to a real emergency.
 

cajunjerry

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A few years ago an arkansas state trooper had his wife as a ride along. He stopped a vehicle and he was shot. She used his radio to call for help. I just happened to hear that.
 

SCPD

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Thanks for the kind comments guys!.. you all were very sweet to make them... certainly no hard feelings here at all..... :)

!Via con Dios, mis amigo's!....... see you a few months ....;)
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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I truly hope you don't plan on relying on a hacked ham radio, or a part 90 radio loaded with frequencies you are not authorized on 'just in case' that's piss poor planning, and by not preparing for what can come, you put your life and the lives of your family at risk.
Prepare, plan and have the proper tools to do the job. Do that and you will NEVER need a hacked radio or a radio with frequencies your not authorized to use, to save your bacon.

But on the other hand you might be one of those hams that salivates at the possibility of having an excuse, even if it's not a truly life and death situation, to pop up on your local first responder frequencies...

By planing, preparing, and having the right tools, you will never need a hacked ham radio.

I know this because I have "been there, done that" I even have the t-shirt for using radio to get real help to a real emergency.

PLONK!
 
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