Ongoing Changes: Marion Co. MECA System

[scannerfreak]

Both of MECA's TRUE P 25 systems are down sites 262-101 262-102 as of 6:44 PM 2-26-2008

Actually, it's one system, 2 sites. We have yet to see the second system and I suspect the one they are testing now is actually system 1. Only time will tell :wink:

 

[SCPD]

Actually, it's one system, 2 sites. We have yet to see the second system and I suspect the one they are testing now is actually system 1. Only time will tell :wink:

It is 2 systems 2 Different CC from what I was told and just testing on open freqs for now

 

[scannerfreak]

It is 2 systems 2 Different CC from what I was told and just testing on open freqs for now

If it were two systems, you would have 2 system ID's. You only have one, 262..The 101 and 102 are site numbers for one of the systems.

 

[jerk]

If it were two systems, you would have 2 system ID's. You only have one, 262..The 101 and 102 are site numbers for one of the systems.

And no doubt they are testing coverage of the individual cell sites, as well as penetration into buildings as that is a specific requirement of the new system. Then they'll go simulcast.

But right now they will be doing lots of testing in grids. And the system will be up and down, and CC's will be changing.

AL

 

[SCPD]

Update on MECA with APCO not going well
T07062912042570 METROPOLITAN EMERGENCY COMMUNICATION AGENCY 4159737 On Hold 2/27/2008 10:09:46 AM
T07062912042571 METROPOLITAN EMERGENCY COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY 4159737 On Hold 2/27/2008 10:09:46 AM
T08021917049047 METROPOLITAN EMERGENCY COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY 4159737 New 2/19/2008 5:13:27 PM
T07042512040641 METROPOLITAN EMERGENCY COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY 4159737 On Hold 2/27/2008 10:09:45 AM

 

[Viper43]

And no doubt they are testing coverage of the individual cell sites, as well as penetration into buildings as that is a specific requirement of the new system. Then they'll go simulcast.

But right now they will be doing lots of testing in grids. And the system will be up and down, and CC's will be changing.

AL

They are not testing grids or anything yet, they are still registering radios and TG's. As of now only 3 towers have appeared and one hasn't been on long enough to log any frequencies in either Unitrunker or Pro96Com. One tower has 7 frequencies (102) and 101 8 frequencies. They are doing a lot of data testing on tower 102 , but there again it's only registering the ID's.
It does appear from what I heard on one TG that they are working on system 1 and not system 2, unless they will have police on system 2 using it for investigations, but thats highly doubtful.

V

 

[SCPD]

Let’s try and explain what is going on with MECA

They are testing two separate systems yes they have the same system number but they divided it into two, now then they used some open frequencies to test on.
They would NOT be using 10 different frequencies per site that would be 110 frequencies for the whole system per 11 sites they don’t even have that many now listed on WNNM 854 lic. The sites will have the same frequencies at all of them maybe a different control channel here and there just like it is set up now. ALL of these sites fire at the same time or just a hair off if they where all different as viper says you would need to have a lot of frequencies programmed in. In a TRUE P25 9600 system you can not go with Control Channel only mode there is no setting for this they go by Band Plans. It just happens that MECA in there CC data stream they broadcast that band plan and it automatically puts this band plan in the scanner so it trunks off the cc and it tells the scanner witch frequency to go to. MECA has applied through APCO for a separate license for the P 25 system but if they don’t get it then they will use the WNNM 854 that they have now. All of the radios can be open aired programmed ”wirelessly” very quickly when they have the right setup this is a neat feature of them going digital where on the old system they would have to bring in the radio and hook it up to a computer. They have pulled these site/systems off the air while awaiting word on the lic.
I know some of you will pick this apart witch is fine I know the facts and have verified them and I seem to be the only one on RR right now posting them and have been right and the first one to post them to help out. So pick away I will just ignore it and maybe I will not post and let all of you guess and try and figure it all out on your own.
Thanks and have a great day

 

[SCPD]

A note on Testing

You will hear PD/FD testing on both of the new P25 systems as sys 2 must support PD/FD operation if sys 1 fails also you will hear training on these and on the consoles witch has for the most part wrapped up. This is that order This is the current plan

New P25 sys 1 PD/FD
New P25 sys 2 if sys 1 fails FD/PD ops takes over sys2
If New P25 sys 2 fails then PD/FD ops moves to SYS 1 OLD ANALOG
If OLD ANALOG sys 1 fails PD/FD ops moves to OLD SYS 2 ANALOG
If old sys 2 fails they move PD/FD ops to SAFE T
If SAFE T fails then all ops moves to Simplex Talk around


New P25 sys1
New P25 sys2
Old sys1
Old sys2
Safe T
Simplex Talk Around
All listed as back up operations if any one goes down

 

[SCPD]

851.8375 P25 262-102 Back on air

 

[SCPD]

I had an email with still some confusion on MECA in regards to system/site I hope this example clears it up

Look at Safe T

System- Site
7829H-002 Boone County Simulcast

7829H-0013 Hamilton County

7829H-0081 Indianapolis ISP


They all have the same System ID but site ID is different they are using the Site ID as a system in a particular area but different frequencies the same for MECA new P 25 digital

MECA NEW P25

262H-101 OLD TERM SYS 1 Different frequencies

262H-102 OLD TERM SYS 2 Different frequencies

The total frequencies count is yet to be determined but could be as high as 30+ that would be 15 each site

Each Tower should have its own id such as
5dd0H
2BD0H
21F0H
5EF0H
Just like the current Systems do.

On a 996T or a 396T hold on sys 1 analog right now it will show 2723H watch that for a while and it will change from 2723 to lets say 5E30H and 21F0H that is the tower site ID each one has its own ID that will show up.

 

[Viper43]

SAFET and MECA are two totally different things! The MECA setup is TWO totally seperate systems and WILL have two completly different system ID's just as they do with the old system 1 2373 and system 2 3A3A the new systems MUST have seperate ID's or it won't work properly. One system will be 262 and who knows what the other other will be at this point. But each tower on 262 will be 101, 102 103 etc.... the same with the other system when it comes on line just a different system number.

V

I had an email with still some confusion on MECA in regards to system/site I hope this example clears it up

Look at Safe T

System- Site
7829H-002 Boone County Simulcast

7829H-0013 Hamilton County

7829H-0081 Indianapolis ISP


They all have the same System ID but site ID is different they are using the Site ID as a system in a particular area but different frequencies the same for MECA new P 25 digital

MECA NEW P25

262H-101 OLD TERM SYS 1 Different frequencies

262H-102 OLD TERM SYS 2 Different frequencies

The total frequencies count is yet to be determined but could be as high as 30+ that would be 15 each site

Each Tower should have its own id such as
5dd0H
2BD0H
21F0H
5EF0H
Just like the current Systems do.

 

[jerk]

They are not testing grids or anything yet, they are still registering radios and TG's. As of now only 3 towers have appeared and one hasn't been on long enough to log any frequencies in either Unitrunker or Pro96Com. One tower has 7 frequencies (102) and 101 8 frequencies. They are doing a lot of data testing on tower 102 , but there again it's only registering the ID's.
It does appear from what I heard on one TG that they are working on system 1 and not system 2, unless they will have police on system 2 using it for investigations, but thats highly doubtful.

V

Ok, whatever, I have actually tested radio transmit and receive coverage, and at some point, someone will do the same for the new MECA system. And it is usually by using some type of grid system. Could be floors, or pages on a map, or city blocks... etc.

 

[SCPD]

They have already done street testing using the larger rubber duck antenna and will switch to the smaller one when the sytem goes fully online.

As far as 101 102 103 104 that is incorrect and what you are saying is those sites will have ther own cc and set of freqs so you are saying there will be 11 cc operating at the same time and 10+ freqs at the same time witch would put that system over 100+ freqs all operating at the same time I am sorry but you are incorrect. But time will tell

 

[jerk]

They have already done street testing using the larger rubber duck antenna and will switch to the smaller one when the sytem goes fully online.

As far as 101 102 103 104 that is incorrect and what you are saying is those sites will have ther own cc and set of freqs so you are saying there will be 11 cc operating at the same time and 10+ freqs at the same time witch would put that system over 100+ freqs all operating at the same time I am sorry but you are incorrect. But time will tell

11 Control Channels, one for each site, though I believe one site is receive only, which will mean 10 control channels, which will be the same exact frequency, simulcasted. So, this means 10-11 Control Channels total in use for each system, not site. Only one CC per site per system. That would leave 27 frequencies available for trunking, yet not really because one or two will dedicated to data only. So this means 25 or 26 channels available for trunking. Unless the data frequencies are separate from the ones being used for trunking, and that’s a likely possibility. Which would bring it back to 27 channels available for trunking. 28 channels, minus one for CC.

It would be better if only "actually in use" information is posted here, not speculation, or hearsay, or stuff I got through an email... IMHO Or just wait until the system is 100% operational. It will be easy enough to figure out then, with or without the 2 people supposedly in the know.

 

[SCPD]

Some one please tell me a system using 2 controll chanels at the same time in Indiana look at MECA sys 1 now they have 4 controll channels to it but only use 1 at a time.
so what every one is saying is the new system site 101 and 102 have ther own cc right now so the new system will have 2 or more controll channels operating at the same time WRONG!
right now
262-101 858.1875 cc
262.102 851.8375 cc
so you are telling me this is one system what CC does the scanner use to trunk? both wrong the scanner treats it as seprate systems it can not do 2 seprate cc at the same time.

 

[SCPD]

11 Control Channels, one for each site, though I believe one site is receive only, which will mean 10 control channels, which will be the same exact frequency, simulcasted. So, this means 10-11 Control Channels total in use for each system, not site. Only one CC per site per system. That would leave 27 frequencies available for trunking, yet not really because one or two will dedicated to data only. So this means 25 or 26 channels available for trunking. Unless the data frequencies are separate from the ones being used for trunking, and that’s a likely possibility. Which would bring it back to 27 channels available for trunking. 28 channels, minus one for CC.

It would be better if only "actually in use" information is posted here, not speculation, or hearsay, or stuff I got through an email... IMHO Or just wait until the system is 100% operational. It will be easy enough to figure out then, with or without the 2 people supposedly in the know.

You speculate a lot in your post so stop telling me not to and for one ALL DATA feeds are up and running on diffrent freqs NOT in the trunking system witch I all ready posted way back if you bother to read and at leat I know I have the facts time will tell I am right so go ahead and post what you want I realy dont care and why do you ? you cant even get MECA where you live but that is old news and been posted before.

 

[SCPD]

This is the current frequencies list for lic WNNM 854 take out all freqs for the OLD SYS 1 and OLD SYS 2 and the OLD and NEW DATA channels that does not leave very many left to support a NEW system with 10 or 11 NEW control channels or 8 to 10 NEW DIFFERENT FREQS per SITE. Maybe 10 NEW ALL SITES THE SAME but not all new and each site diffrent

WNNM 854

851.0375
851.1000
851.1250
851.1875
851.3000
851.3500
851.5375
851.7875
851.8125
851.8375
852.1125
852.2375
852.7000
852.8250
853.2250
853.6875
854.9875
855.4875
855.9875
856.1625
856.1875
856.2125
856.4375
856.5125
856.7625
856.9375
856.9875
857.1625
857.2125
857.2625
857.4375
857.6625
857.7625
857.9375
857.9875
858.1875
858.2125
858.2625
858.4375
858.7625
858.9375
858.9875
859.2125
859.2625
859.4375
859.7625
859.9375
859.9875
860.2125
860.2625
860.4375
860.7625
860.9375
860.9875
866.0375
866.1000
866.1250
866.1875
866.3000
866.3500
866.5375
866.7875
866.8125
866.8375
867.1125
867.2375
867.7000
867.8250
868.2250
868.6875

 

[jerk]

Some one please tell me a system using 2 controll chanels at the same time in Indiana look at MECA sys 1 now they have 4 controll channels to it but only use 1 at a time.
so what every one is saying is the new system site 101 and 102 have ther own cc right now so the new system will have 2 or more controll channels operating at the same time WRONG!
right now
262-101 858.1875 cc
262.102 851.8375 cc
so you are telling me this is one system what CC does the scanner use to trunk? both wrong the scanner treats it as seprate systems it can not do 2 seprate cc at the same time.

Each System will have four Control Channels, and only one will be in use at a time for each separate system.

System A 800.000 MHz Others 800.050; 800.100; 800. 150
System B 801.000 MHz Others 801.050; 801.100; 801.150
In my make-believe system, those and only those are used for Control Channel operation.

Now whether there is one site or ten sites, the CC would be used for all sites in System A . System B would use the second set. So it would be the same frequency for each site in a simulcast system. And that’s is how it will be for the new system under construction.

Now if the operators wanted, they could rotate Control Channel function through all 28 frequencies, they could do so, but all 28 would have to be programmed as possible CC’s.

Four works fine and allow other channels to be entered for roaming interoperability purposes. Smartzone operation.

And I may get a chance to listen tomorrow to the new system. I think I am allowed to listen to this system right?

 

[jerk]

You speculate a lot in your post so stop telling me not to and for one ALL DATA feeds are up and running on diffrent freqs NOT in the trunking system witch I all ready posted way back if you bother to read and at leat I know I have the facts time will tell I am right so go ahead and post what you want I realy dont care and why do you ? you cant even get MECA where you live but that is old news and been posted before.

Did I mention you, I don't think I did? You seem to take umbrage when somebody, posts, thinks, or says something different from what you are saying. Lighten up; you are not RIGHT 100% of the time. You may not even be right 10% of the time.

This is a place for discussion, not I'm right and everybody else is wrong, or you’re not allowed to listen, and I have the “facts” or the corner on truth with this system.
In reality the “facts” as they are right now are open to debate and discussion. And they WILL change, perhaps many more times before the system is finalized. And that’s partly what this thread is about.

Maybe MECA will put you on their payroll. You seem to be both the unofficial and official spokesperson here.

What I mention in my post is some stuff I do not know, like what frequencies they will use. And neither do you know what frequencies they will finally end up using. It’s not really speculation what I’ve posted, because most of it is on the basics of trunking. And more specifically simulcast trunking.

 

[scannerfreak]

Some one please tell me a system using 2 controll chanels at the same time in Indiana look at MECA sys 1 now they have 4 controll channels to it but only use 1 at a time.
so what every one is saying is the new system site 101 and 102 have ther own cc right now so the new system will have 2 or more controll channels operating at the same time WRONG!
right now
262-101 858.1875 cc
262.102 851.8375 cc
so you are telling me this is one system what CC does the scanner use to trunk? both wrong the scanner treats it as seprate systems it can not do 2 seprate cc at the same time.

Let me help you. Please listen, because you are confused.

262 is the system ID

101 and 102 are site numbers for that system. It is one system, 2 sites. I suspect there will eventually be a 103 and 104 etc...Some sites operating alone, some simulcasting.

THEN, there will be ANOTHER system with a different system ID. It could be 261 or 263, (that would make sense). Then, they will also have 101, 102, 103 etc..

Now, example, 101 could be 4 sites simulcasting as one and 102 could be a single site all within the same system.