Denver Provoice

[K4XB]

Let's clear up this mis-information now.

I have gone on the record many times that this is one of the goofiest trends in technology today.
In charge of the communications department is now someone who has probably never used a two way radio in their life, let alone had to have their life depend on the proper functioning of the system.
I can harp on this for hours and bore you all to tears. This is another it ain't broke, so don't fix it situations.
They stopped using commisioned police officers in Denver to save money. At the time, you needed a second class radiotelegraph license. pass the test, were commissioned, qualified to use a gun, paid sergeants pay and life was good.

Let's clear up some mis-information.
Gary Pasicznyk is in charge of the Denver Radio System. He is one of the most competent radio techs I have worked with. The Career Service position announcement read as if they wanted more of an IT/Computer position. For whatever reason, IT management sobered up or something, they chose Gary. An excellent choice.

The city never had commisioned police officers doing the tech work after Bob Danhour. That was a long time ago. The Radio Engineers had guns, this is true. They never attended any police academy. They never did any police work or had any police duties. In fact, the Colorado Court of Appeals in "Nation vs. City and County of Denver" specifically ruled the Radio Engineers were not police officers. They were electronic technicians, nothing more.

K4XB
Real radios glow in the dark

 

[K4XB]

Disable PTT

Interesting! Thank you both! Would you have to make any mod's to the radio?

Transmit ability in EDACS radios can be disabled on a talk group by talk group basis though programming. No need to physically disable the PTT switch to prevent acidental PTT.

K4XB
Real radios glow in the dark

 

[kc0kp]

Let's clear up some mis-information.
The city never had commisioned police officers doing the tech work after Bob Danhour. That was a long time ago. The Radio Engineers had guns, this is true. They never attended any police academy. They never did any police work or had any police duties. In fact, the Colorado Court of Appeals in "Nation vs. City and County of Denver" specifically ruled the Radio Engineers were not police officers. They were electronic technicians, nothing more.

K4XB
Real radios glow in the dark

Actually, Larry Fenstermacher and Bob Lindner were the last. Fenstermacher ritired in 2002, Lindner retired in 2003, not a long time ago. Fenstermacher was the last engineer to make a morse code contact at the old KGPX installation at 9th and Josephine in 1968. It was on Collins S line equipment.
They did have one police duty and that was to qualify once a month at the firing range.
Regardless to what the courts held, someone with a badge, police ID card and a gun would appear to me to be a police officer.
And as for Bob Nation (I thought it was Nations), he was the best portable products technician in the region. I replaced him at American Mobile, Denver's Motorola MSS when he left for the police department.

 

[jfab]

Transmit ability in EDACS radios can be disabled on a talk group by talk group basis though programming. No need to physically disable the PTT switch to prevent acidental PTT.

K4XB
Real radios glow in the dark

Cool! Thanks! I will PM you with other questions so as not to tie up this thread!

 

[K4XB]

Actually, Larry Fenstermacher and Bob Lindner were the last. Fenstermacher ritired in 2002, Lindner retired in 2003, not a long time ago. Fenstermacher was the last engineer to make a morse code contact at the old KGPX installation at 9th and Josephine in 1968. It was on Collins S line equipment.
They did have one police duty and that was to qualify once a month at the firing range.
Regardless to what the courts held, someone with a badge, police ID card and a gun would appear to me to be a police officer.
And as for Bob Nation (I thought it was Nations), he was the best portable products technician in the region. I replaced him at American Mobile, Denver's Motorola MSS when he left for the police department.

Bob Danhour was the last real Police Officer. The Radio Engineers never held the rank of Police Officer. They were hired as "Radio Engineers". There was a specific rank of Radio Engineer. Their badge and ID said "Radio Engineer", not "Police Officer". Qualifiying with a gun does not make you a Police Officer. Otherwise every gun carrying security guard wannabe would qualify as a "Police Officer" The legal description of "Police Officer" is specific. And court decisions are final until overturned by a higher court. That never happened.

K4XB
Real radios glow in the dark

 

[Blogger]

You would think with everything to know/learn/deal with radio/MDTs/Lights etc that the last thing a radio tech would want to deal with is a gun...

 

[n0doz]

This discussion sure brings back the memories!
Yup, their badge did indeed say "Radio Engineer" in place of "Denver Police." They were issued a badge number in the same sequence as regular officers.
A few years ago, I was leaving an off-duty job at Empire Savings, over there at Alameda and Dayton. As I pulled out of the lot, I saw a guy running south on Dayton with red smoke streaming from his pants. I recognized immediately that he'd robbed the World Savings Bank next door, and that they'd slipped him a "dye pack," which exploded in his pocket.
I drove along, a little behind him, looking to see if he was alone. When he stopped at a car and started to open the door, I jumped out and drew down on him. I ordered him to lay down in the street.
This, of course, was 5 PM, so there was a lot of traffic, which quickly grew into a jam with a cop and a stickup in the street.
As I'm getting ready to approach the guy, up comes Bob Nation. He was on his way home and saw what happened, and decided to help. We cuffed the guy, and Bob told me it was his first "arrest!"
The stickup went to DGH on the way to jail... seems that dye packs have one vent, and the pack burns through that vent as it discharges smoke and tear gas. Of course, he put it in his pocket with the vent aimed toward the family jewels....

 

[rfburns]

Wasn't that World Savings getting robbed about once a week back then? And wasn't there a private security guard killed there during a robbery? That might have even been when DPD was VHF.

 

[n0doz]

Yes, it was, on all counts except the radio... we went UHF before I was hired in '79.
The guard murder happened after I stopped working next door. They had started the guard service shortly after the robbery I "interrupted."

 

[cstockmyer]

My cousins husband retired last year after 30 years at DPD. He and I where talking yesterday about how at one time they only had radios in the cars, no pack sets. Can you imagine that?

 

[N_Jay]

My cousins husband retired last year after 30 years at DPD. He and I where talking yesterday about how at one time they only had radios in the cars, no pack sets. Can you imagine that?

Yes, it sis very easy to imagine.

It was the norm then.

 

[rfburns]

Denver VHF Handhelds

they only had radios in the cars, no pack sets. Can you imagine that?

I think that would have been before he was on. In the latter VHF days patrol had GE handhelds. PR36's if I remember correctly that they started getting around 1968 or so. Seems like batons were also PR and a 2 digit number. The 2 digit number might have been the length of the baton. That was way before ASP's.

The twang noise on VHF came from the guys keying up and making the metal clip on the back of the GE handheld vibrate. The mechanical oscillation would modulate the radio making the twang sound. Guys did that to annoy the dispatcher. You couldn't do that with a Motorola HT-200 or HT-220.

 

[cstockmyer]

I remember when Denver's handholds also where their car radio, anyone else remember that?

 

[kc0kp]

Remember

I remember when Denver's handholds also where their car radio, anyone else remember that?

Yes I do, the heavy black metal GE Mastr portables that could drop a fleeing felon at ten yards and still transmit. Unfortunately, the car adaptors became a maintenance headache. The connections on the side of the radio became intermittent.
They eventually were replaced by Motorola MT500s. They were not as heavy and had a nasty habit of losing the crystal filters when dropped. But the cops were still throwing them at fleeing felons.

 

[abqscan]

Okay, Okay, this thread is well past the weeds, and far into the Mountains. It either needs to get back on subject, Denver Provoice, or it will be closed.

If someone wants to open a thread about the history of Denver radios, go for it.

 

[Troop]

My cousins husband retired last year after 30 years at DPD. He and I where talking yesterday about how at one time they only had radios in the cars, no pack sets. Can you imagine that?

well since the thread is on it's way out..i'll post my cents worth.....it was only 9 years ago and I was working w/o a packset.....using the ole outside speaker.....sucked on large crash scenes...they'd call you...you run to the car..answer...go back..they'd call you...over and over...

 

[jfab]

Is there a possibility they could simulcast for a while? Or am I dreaming?

 

[christenorio]

The North Las Vegas Police Dept. edacs system was in fact a provoice system that simulcasted in analog mode before switching to the clark county system so anything is possible. DPD could follow that format.