Kenwood: New Kenwood TH-D75

[mmckenna]

Well see...that could replace your scanner too. You could have all 30 going at once on different frequencies. Or imagine the spurious emissions you could transmit with 30 of them at once! Would probably create a black hole!

Baofeng Bandolier! I could listen to every FM broadcast station in a 100 mile radius, all while using the flashlights to light up a small soccer stadium.

But seriously, $750 is a lot of money for a portable radio in this market. Looking at what I can get NEW on the commercial market or used/good on the e-Bays makes me think about what I could do. DMR with a GPS speaker mic comes to mind.

 

[alcahuete]

Baofeng Bandolier! I could listen to every FM broadcast station in a 100 mile radius, all while using the flashlights to light up a small soccer stadium.

Baofeng Bandolier! I could listen to every FM broadcast station in a 100 mile radius, all while using the flashlights to light up a small soccer stadium.

But seriously, $750 is a lot of money for a portable radio in this market. Looking at what I can get NEW on the commercial market or used/good on the e-Bays makes me think about what I could do. DMR with a GPS speaker mic comes to mind.

It is a lot of money for sure, but there are hams out there who would do it. They sold a ton of 74s, and had it not been for the chip shortage, they probably would have sold a ton more.

I can't tell you the last time I bought a non-commercial VHF or UHF radio. Well I take that back, I did buy an Anytone 878 a few years ago and a handful of throw-away radios for the boat, because I don't care in the slightest if they go overboard. But I would absolutely buy a multi-band all digital mode ham radio. Wouldn't even think twice about it.

 

[mmckenna]

But I would absolutely buy a multi-band all digital mode ham radio. Wouldn't even think twice about it.

Heard about a Kenwood VM8000 today. All band mobile at a reasonable price, plus DMR. Might have to save up for one of those. Digital + GPS = APRS joining the 21st century.

 

[Josh]

I bought a TH-D72A about a decade ago, never saw a need to upgrade to the 74 or now the 75. I like the nicer display, but the menu system seems to be about as user friendly as the 72 (ie not really easy to manipulate).

If it had DMR, as I've said somewhere in the far past when the 74 was introduced, I would be all over it... and it would work better than the Chinese radios as it would have actual DVSI chips in it, not reverse-engineered China-tech. It really wouldn't hard to have more modes being that they're all the same CODEC, just implemented differently. I'd pay a license fee similar to the NX line to have it, but then again- I have these digital voice modes already with the Kenwood NX... maybe Kenwood can release firmware for it to do APRS (haha).

 

[AK9R]

The MSRP was $649. On sale, the cheapest I ever saw was almost $700. The last place I saw it in stock (Gigaparts) was $750+.

I remember waiting about a year after they came out for the price to come down. I can't find the receipt but I think that I paid around $500 for mine, new, in 2017. Towards the end, as supplies dwindled, some stores, particularly Gigaparts, jacked up the price.

I see speculation online that the TH-D75 will be $750 to $1000 MSRP. Frankly, I think that will be a very hard sell, especially to people who already have a TH-D74. And, it won't be enough to convince me to buy. By comparison, the Icom ID-52A MSRP $649.95 discounted to $599.95 until the end of this month (doesn't have 222 MHz nor APRS) and Yaesu FT-5DR MSRP $469.95 discounted to $419.95 until mid-June (there was an additional $90 off over the weekend...killer deal).

Didn't the FT-5D actually add useful features over the 3D?

They added some memory grouping and monitoring features, IPX7 rating vs. IPX5, a louder speaker, and a new belt clip. I don't see many other changes. In the opinion of Steve Ford WB8IMY, who wrote the product review for QST (April 2022), "It’s fair to describe Yaesu’s FT5DR as the successor to their popular FT3DR handheld transceiver. Like the FT3DR, this is a dual-band VHF/UHF radio that offers analog FM voice and digital C4FM. It is like the FT3DR in many other ways as well, but it also includes several refinements."

 

[DeoVindice]

Baofeng Bandolier! I could listen to every FM broadcast station in a 100 mile radius, all while using the flashlights to light up a small soccer stadium.

But seriously, $750 is a lot of money for a portable radio in this market. Looking at what I can get NEW on the commercial market or used/good on the e-Bays makes me think about what I could do. DMR with a GPS speaker mic comes to mind.

Amateur-focused VHF/UHF radios have a tough time competing with LMR gear nowadays. Why would I buy a Part 97 D-STAR portable when I can get an XPR/NX/VP-whatever in the same price range built to a higher standard that can also be used for work?

 

[palmerjrusa]

I remember waiting about a year after they came out for the price to come down. I can't find the receipt but I think that I paid around $500 for mine, new, in 2017. Towards the end, as supplies dwindled, some stores, particularly Gigaparts, jacked up the price.

I see speculation online that the TH-D75 will be $750 to $1000 MSRP. Frankly, I think that will be a very hard sell, especially to people who already have a TH-D74. And, it won't be enough to convince me to buy. By comparison, the Icom ID-52A MSRP $649.95 discounted to $599.95 until the end of this month (doesn't have 222 MHz nor APRS) and Yaesu FT-5DR MSRP $469.95 discounted to $419.95 until mid-June (there was an additional $90 off over the weekend...killer deal).


They added some memory grouping and monitoring features, IPX7 rating vs. IPX5, a louder speaker, and a new belt clip. I don't see many other changes. In the opinion of Steve Ford WB8IMY, who wrote the product review for QST (April 2022), "It’s fair to describe Yaesu’s FT5DR as the successor to their popular FT3DR handheld transceiver. Like the FT3DR, this is a dual-band VHF/UHF radio that offers analog FM voice and digital C4FM. It is like the FT3DR in many other ways as well, but it also includes several refinements."

Audio was just awful on my FT3DR and not much of it. Also, sensitivity on HF was downright mediocre = signals present on comparable handhelds were just not present on the FT3DR.

I sold my FT3DR and bought an FT5DR = great audio and much improved HF sensitivity.

I like to hang on to great pieces of gear, the FT5DR is a keeper.

It will be interesting to see what the TH-D75's MSRP price is.

 

[krokus]

Kenwood is probably hoping to tap into the market of people like myself. I was not able to get a TH-D74, before they became Unobtainium. (I wanted the new radio due to having the features of my TH-D72 & TH-F6 in one package.)

 

[palmerjrusa]

Kenwood is probably hoping to tap into the market of people like myself. I was not able to get a TH-D74, before they became Unobtainium. (I wanted the new radio due to having the features of my TH-D72 & TH-F6 in one package.)

The TH-D74 is an outstanding handheld (wideband receive and has SSB!), also a keeper, hanging on to mine.

 

[hp8920]

It is interesting when people lament about a mode not used/popular in their area and ponder why a product is made.

Anyways, how big would a handheld be that actually had all those digital modes? How robust would it need to be as well, given the cost it would be? Would it be like my APX7000? For a those that don’t know, the APX is a brick with an antenna.

No size. Look at MMDVM repeaters. One cheap microcontroller does FM, P25, DMR, System Fusion, NXDN, D-Star, M17, POCSAG. Multiple modes today are trivial: everything, including analog, is done in modern radios in software on a DSP. Different modes is merely more code. Not only that, it's not hard: somebody wrote all the code for free as a hobby.

You have the issue on commercial radios, like the APX, that modes like P25 and NXDN 6.25 kHz have very strict spectral masks, to allow for close channel spacing and interference rejection. This does require more hardware. However, it isn't an issue on amateur radios. Besides, most of the bulk of the APX is the battery (particularly the hazloc batteries): the 8 hour battery life on ham radios is not acceptable in the commercial world.

 

[mortoma61]

I'm just getting back into ham after about 28 years. To me the digital mode stuff is not a biggie. I want a tri-band radio that will do 220 with as much transmit power as 2m and 440. The Yaesu VX-6R has only a tiny bit of power on 220 but I ordered one of those too, I'll just put a Diamond tri-band antenna on it to give it a little more oomph. Could care less about DMR or D-star or any of the other digi-modes. What's the point since you can get on a PC and talk to anyone in the world just about on Skype or similar? I mean @#$*, I can also call or text message them on a phone. Big whoop-dee-freaking-doo!! Only interested in analog. Back when I lost interest in ham, the big thing was packet radio but I didn't care for that either. They could have shoved packet up their back side for all I cared. But glad I have religiously renewed every 10 years, I knew I might get interested again. And I also have enough $$ to buy one of these radios and Kenwood ain't going to ever have DMR because D-star is their thing. Even I can figure that @#$* out!!

 

[kayn1n32008]

Could Kenwood have produced the "unicorn" radio? Yeah, sure. They obviously know how to do many DV modes and I assume they could figure out System Fusion. But, at what cost? When JVCK gets around to allowing P25, NXDN, and DMR to be installed on a VP-8000, what will it cost? Would an amateur radio community that snaps up Baofengs like chocolate chips pay that kind of money? I highly doubt it. Meanwhile, the TH-D75 gets Kenwood back into the amateur radio market. And, I'm all for that.

I would be absolutely shocked if any of the hammy manufacturers produce a hammy toy radio that is capable of DMR, NXDN or P25 CAI.

The reasons are very simple.
1: Cost of licensing the DVSI codec.
2: They don't want the LMR world to try and go the cheaper route of buying hammy toys and modifying them for out of band transmit.

Another big reason is because of the ham community snapping up the garbage, barely functional Chinese radios.

Side note, AFAIK, the VP8000 will only be capable of P25 phase 1&2 and DMR tier 2. I do not believe they are going to add NXDN to it. I honestly do not believe there is enough NXDN being used in public safety to warrant adding the capability when they already have it in the NX-5xxx series. I do believe there is enough DMR tier 2 used by the fire service through out North America to justify its addition to the VP8000 though.

One agency near me has zero intention to abandon their Tier 2, VHF system, to join our provincial 700MHz P25 system. They do like the idea of having a radio they can use on both though.

 

[mmckenna]

I would be absolutely shocked if any of the hammy manufacturers produce a hammy toy radio that is capable of DMR, NXDN or P25 CAI.

The reasons are very simple.
1: Cost of licensing the DVSI codec.
2: They don't want the LMR world to try and go the cheaper route of buying hammy toys and modifying them for out of band transmit.

Another big reason is because of the ham community snapping up the garbage, barely functional Chinese radios.

Excellent point. I think we are getting to the point that very few hams are going to tolerate spending more than $100 on a hand held radio here pretty soon. The top tier stuff will command a high price, but I think we'll see the majority of hams base their choices off price more than anything.

Side note, AFAIK, the VP8000 will only be capable of P25 phase 1&2 and DMR tier 2. I do not believe they are going to add NXDN to it. I honestly do not believe there is enough NXDN being used in public safety to warrant adding the capability when they already have it in the NX-5xxx series. I do believe there is enough DMR tier 2 used by the fire service through out North America to justify its addition to the VP8000 though.

One agency near me has zero intention to abandon their Tier 2, VHF system, to join our provincial 700MHz P25 system. They do like the idea of having a radio they can use on both though.

I'm a big fan of NXDN, and have been running an NXDN trunked system for 12 years now. It's a great product and does exactly what it is designed to do.
But, I think you are 100% right. While Kenwood does seem to have a long term plan to support NXDN, they are focusing more and more on DMR capable products.
I had big hopes that this radio would be an option for our officers, P25 on the public safety system, NXDN on the public works type system. As time goes on those hopes are fading. But I'll get over it.
Thinking long term where my NXDN system will go tends to lead away from that product line and to DMR or P25.

 

[hp8920]

I would be absolutely shocked if any of the hammy manufacturers produce a hammy toy radio that is capable of DMR, NXDN or P25 CAI.

The reasons are very simple.
1: Cost of licensing the DVSI codec.

They're already paying for the DVSI codec. D-Star and System Fusion both use AMBE. That's how the cross-modes like YSF2P25 and DMR2NXDN work.

Besides, IMBE patents are expired. Basic IMBE-based P25 is around 30 years old, it's patent-free.

The first version of DMR standards came out in 2005, patents on that and AMBE+2 expire around 2025-2028.

 

[tunnelmot]

2: They don't want the LMR world to try and go the cheaper route of buying hammy toys and modifying them for out of band transmit.

Of course I don't know ish, but this has been my theory. There is literally nothing stopping them, so this make the most sense to me personally.

 

[borjam]

I own a TH-D74.

The fact is: if you are interested on APRS, Kenwood has the only really usable APRS implementation in the market for two reasons:

- Support for APRS features such as advertising your VFO frequency over APRS.

- Both transmission and reception actually work. I own a Yaesu FT3 and the APRS implementation is an absolute disgrace. Compared to a Yaesu VX-8 or a TH-D74 the FT3 receiver barely works, missing most of the frames. I've been told that the FT5 is similar in that regard.

I tried to report the issue to Yaesu (I even have a theory) but I have had no answer.

While most ot the APRS implementations around are more of a "checklist oriented" feature ("hey, it transmits and receives, check!") Kenwood actually embraced the protocol putting some care into the implementation. It helps that Bob Bruninga was working with them, I guess.

Now, it would be nice if Kenwood fixed some TH-D74 bugs. I haven't tried that yet but it seems that the builtin TNC doesn't work over USB, you need to use Bluetooth.

 

[jazzboypro]

I bought the 74 a few years ago. That was before the ID-52 came out. At the time it was pretty the only option (I’m not interested in Yaesu’s offering in their line of handheld). I bought the 52 when it came out and I’m happy with it. I’m not into APRS and 222 is pretty much non existent here so I don‘t use my 74 anymore.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

This is an interesting thread as I think it really shows how little Americans in general understand Japanese business practices. Now this is just my personal opinion while I sit at home and sip on a glass of bourbon. The TH-D75 may not be what many American amateur's were hoping for but I think there are several points to consider (some of which have already been stated).

1. This HT restores the pre-Naka factory fire status quo. SoC's and IC's aren't interchangeable unfortunately. So having to redesign for a change in a integrated circuit component pretty much guarantees a complete redesign of the product and even for Japanese manufacturers...this can take years. Look at how long many of us have been following the VP8000 (some started hearing rumblings back in 2018). It was a hard decision to make...end production and start designing an updated product using components that were currently available or wait for component production to begin again...a redesign shortened the time to get a product back onto the market by what deemed to be an justifiable amount of time.
2. "D-STAR is dead". Well, that may be in the US but it certainly isn't in Japan. It's been pretty clear that D-Star is the JARL's digital mode of choice. What you may not realize, NXDN is in a similar boat in Japan. If you don't have a NXDN solution, GTFO. Very similar to the US when looking at P25...pretty much every major vendor offers a P25 solution in North America. Keep in mind, the JDM market drives a lot of the products manufactured by JVCK. It's also one of the reasons JVCK has been very hesitant to allow source access to NextEdge to the subsidiary companies which is why it is not likely we would see a NXDN implementation in EFJ or Radio Activity solutions without considerable demand for it (i.e. @mmckenna to an exponential factor).
3. "They should have designed the ultimate radio (multi-band, multi-digital protocol) as they already have the platform to do it". That would be cool but that takes money...something hams are really stingy with. I've heard rumors of a $1,000 MSRP on this radio. That's nothing compared to public safety but for hams that's pretty pricey. They won't typically spend that much on a radio that will give them 10-15 years of service...but will buy a new iPhone every two to three years. In terms of them already having the platform...keep in mind that that product is not a Kenwood solution but a Viking solution. JVCK allows EFJ and Radio Activity to operate as independent subsidiaries. Could JVCK decide they want to use it, sure but as of the current moment it's exclusive to EFJ (for all intents and purposes, the VP6000 hasn't been left as an EFJ exclusive as well). For those unaware. Viking radios may say Kenwood on the front but they still proudly display the Viking logo upon boot and still say "EF Johnson Company" on the ID tags.

When you begin thinking of the D75 as a product to return the status quo and really catering to the Japanese Domestic Market, your overall outlook looks slightly different. If it doesn't sell well in North America...then it doesn't sell well.

 

[AK9R]

Kenwood was at Ham Radio Friedrichshafen last weekend and showed the TH-D75. What I noticed from the photo posted on Facebook was that Kenwood found a taller display case so they could show the radio, "under glass", with the antenna attached and the radio's display showed a different frequency on the A band than what it showed at Hamvention. Given that Kenwood reps would not touch any buttons or turn any knobs in public at Hamvention, I'm jumping to conclusion that someone has been playing with the radio behind the scenes.

 

[GlobalNorth]

Since I don't own a 74, I'm planning on buying one. I was going to just go the UHF XTS5000 route, but the prices keep shooting upwards and it is either buy the radio and forgo the Hi-Viz green EmComm ARRL Commodore vest or buy the new KW and hope I have enough for this t-shirt for Applebee's: