NMO mount antenna for my brand new truck

[FPR1981]

I have a brand new Ford F-150 pickup truck that I have settled on the Larson (not to be confused with Larsen) no-drill, third-brake light mounting plate for my antenna mount. I'm going to use an NMO-style, and I'm trying to decide between the Larsen NMO 27 or the Laird C27. I'm leaning toward the Laird.

I know that these are popular brands with some of the regulars on here. Any suggestions as to which one you think would be a better choice?

I'd normally do a magnetic mount antenna and call it a day, but due to the aluminum surface of the truck roof, that is not an option.

 

[mmckenna]

I have a brand new Ford F-150 pickup truck that I have settled on the Larson (not to be confused with Larsen) no-drill, third-brake light mounting plate for my antenna mount. I'm going to use an NMO-style, and I'm trying to decide between the Larsen NMO 27 or the Laird C27. I'm leaning toward the Laird.

I know that these are popular brands with some of the regulars on here. Any suggestions as to which one you think would be a better choice?

I'd normally do a magnetic mount antenna and call it a day, but due to the aluminum surface of the truck roof, that is not an option.

Keep in mind that placing the antenna at the rear edge of the cab is going to result in a very lopsided ground plane, a directional radiation pattern towards the back of the truck, and maybe some challenges getting it to tune properly.

Larsen NMO-27 was always my favorite, and while I haven't used mine since about 2017, it is well past 30 years old and in good shape. That included time off road, tree branch strikes, large Texas bugs, etc.

I've never had an issue with Laird antennas. Some report some issues with the base cracking, but I have never seen that on the Laird VHF antenna mounted on my UTV.

There's some people that really like using the Larsen NMO-30 base coil and then buying their 64" whip and making your own out of that. It'll require some careful calculations/tuning since it's outside the tuning charts that come with the NMO-30. Reports are that it'll have a performance edge over the NMO-27.

 

[FPR1981]

My practical options at this point are:

1. Third brake light mount
2. A front-fender mount that uses an existing hole under the hood lip (front-mounted antennas look like dog poo)
3. A rear tail-gate area mount that uses an existing hole

My truck is part of my compensation package for my job. It's mine to use for personal and work use with virtually no stipulations, but one of them is that I cannot permanently roof mount an antenna.

All of these 3 options would be less than optimal for radiation pattern, but my thought was that the third brake light mount is probably the best choice of the three, given that it will be above roof line and more centered over the entire truck than a front fender mount or rear tail gate mount.

Do you feel as though either one of the other two options would be better than third brake light, and therefore above roofline?

 

[mmckenna]

Third brake light mount is probably your best option then. Getting the antenna up high and in the clear would be my choice.

Just be wary if you start having interference issues. The third brake light probably has LED lamps and some of those can generate RF noise.

 

[FPR1981]

I can't believe that these mounting kits are anywhere between $200 and $400 depending on the manufacturer. But, when you need it, you need it. And they know that.

 

[mmckenna]

I can't believe that these mounting kits are anywhere between $200 and $400 depending on the manufacturer. But, when you need it, you need it. And they know that.

Read the reviews on them, and especially search this site for info on them.

I've heard several people report that some of these leak and make a mess in the back of the cab. While I can understand your employer not wanting modifications, moldy carpet and damaged electrical is expensive to fix. A properly installed NMO mount will not leak.

 

[exkalibur]

I've used both an NMO27 and Sinclair SVB-0270. The Sinclair I think worked a bit better, but nothing worked as good the old K40 I used to have (not magnet mount).

 

[niceguy71]

I can't believe that these mounting kits are anywhere between $200 and $400 depending on the manufacturer. But, when you need it, you need it. And they know that.

I know, crazy the prices for a little piece of bent metal!!!
I used to recommend a lot of these to guys with Aluminum roofs... but heard the radiation pattern made for a terrible system.. they could talk forwards but could not talk to the people behind them... washing the truck with it in place is a little difficult also
but I used to recommend this one a lot BIG MONEY but supposed to be one of the best....

if I was to do it and already had a magnetic mount antenna I liked... like you like the Tram 3500....... I would buy this one... Buyers product .. it's aluminum.... but it sits over the roof of the truck.... closer to the middle of the truck..... I would then cut a piece of metal 3/16" and bolt it to the aluminum piece. then take it apart and paint both sides then put it all together again.... then I could stick my Tram 3500 on it and it would be closer to the middle of the truck... the magnetism grounding effect "MIGHT" couple to the aluminum to make a ground plane???? the bolts going into the third brake light might make a good RF bond???? I don't know... but I was thinking maybe if it was close enough to the roof maybe it would give a decent ground plane??? ... I really don't know if it would work... probably not????
as mmckenna says if you made the hole it really wouldn't be that much damage... they sell rubber plugs that pop into the hole before your company sells it..... and they have a NMO mount that only takes a 3/8" hole... so a little 3/8" hole with a rubber plug in it wouldn't affect the resale price.... unless it's a lease? then those pricks will make you pay a million dollars for the damage..... but this mount is a small hole...
3/8 mount
you can also see this guy putting the 3/8 hole and mount in... it's really pretty small. small hole video

 

[mmckenna]

The 3/8" NMO mounts require access to the underside of the roof, and that usually requires pulling the headliner down. 3/4" mount is much easier as you don't have to drop anything, and they are just as easy to plug. The dome light is not always in the best place for the ground plane, and in some of these vehicles there is no direct access to the underside of the roof from the dome light hole. The last few Ford's I've had were that way.

While it's 100% up to the vehicle owner, I have never, not once, had any issues selling a vehicle with an NMO mount, and I've even done some on leased vehicles. The dealerships don't look, and don't care. Often, trade-in's go immediately to a broker who buys them sight unseen and get redistributed out to other lots. The dealership is just going to pass the vehicle along to the next buyer.

3/4" hole plugs are easy. Or put an NMO rain cap on top. Or put a cellular looking antenna and tell the new buyer that their phone will "get more G's" and faster internets.

But since that's off the table, the cargo lamp mount would be my (disappointing) next step. You want the antenna down on the ground plane, not hovering above it too far. The Buyer products and similar things are good for strobe lights and maybe a UHF or 800MHz antenna, but probably not going to work very well with VHF or CB.

 

[slowmover]

tell the new buyer that their phone will "get more G's" and faster internets

Darn tootin’! ‘Cause with a see-bee antenna the SWRs were great!

.

 

[niceguy71]

The 3/8" NMO mounts require access to the underside of the roof, and that usually requires pulling the headliner down. 3/4" mount is much easier as you don't have to drop anything, and they are just as easy to plug. The dome light is not always in the best place for the ground plane, and in some of these vehicles there is no direct access to the underside of the roof from the dome light hole. The last few Ford's I've had were that way.

While it's 100% up to the vehicle owner, I have never, not once, had any issues selling a vehicle with an NMO mount, and I've even done some on leased vehicles. The dealerships don't look, and don't care. Often, trade-in's go immediately to a broker who buys them sight unseen and get redistributed out to other lots. The dealership is just going to pass the vehicle along to the next buyer.

3/4" hole plugs are easy. Or put an NMO rain cap on top. Or put a cellular looking antenna and tell the new buyer that their phone will "get more G's" and faster internets.

But since that's off the table, the cargo lamp mount would be my (disappointing) next step. You want the antenna down on the ground plane, not hovering above it too far. The Buyer products and similar things are good for strobe lights and maybe a UHF or 800MHz antenna, but probably not going to work very well with VHF or CB.

Thanks mmckenna, I had no idea... as I had said I think I would try it... it was a nice idea... too bad it won't work.. I was hoping the aluminum bracket would get the ground plane from bolting into the third brake light... and I also hoped above the roof would help with the directional pattern.... guess my next ford will have a hole in the roof.

 

[mmckenna]

Thanks mmckenna, I had no idea... as I had said I think I would try it... it was a nice idea... too bad it won't work.. I was hoping the aluminum bracket would get the ground plane from bolting into the third brake light... and I also hoped above the roof would help with the directional pattern.... guess my next ford will have a hole in the roof.

It should get a DC ground, but the bracket standing above the roof would make things pretty weird. Won't hurt to try, but it's an expensive experiment with those brackets.
But it's hard to get a good ground plane on 27MHz, even with a full size vehicle. Everything is a compromise. I know you've experience that with the Jeeps.
Much easier for us that work the higher frequencies.

 

[FPR1981]

I know, crazy the prices for a little piece of bent metal!!!
I used to recommend a lot of these to guys with Aluminum roofs... but heard the radiation pattern made for a terrible system.. they could talk forwards but could not talk to the people behind them... washing the truck with it in place is a little difficult also
but I used to recommend this one a lot BIG MONEY but supposed to be one of the best....

if I was to do it and already had a magnetic mount antenna I liked... like you like the Tram 3500....... I would buy this one... Buyers product .. it's aluminum.... but it sits over the roof of the truck.... closer to the middle of the truck..... I would then cut a piece of metal 3/16" and bolt it to the aluminum piece. then take it apart and paint both sides then put it all together again.... then I could stick my Tram 3500 on it and it would be closer to the middle of the truck... the magnetism grounding effect "MIGHT" couple to the aluminum to make a ground plane???? the bolts going into the third brake light might make a good RF bond???? I don't know... but I was thinking maybe if it was close enough to the roof maybe it would give a decent ground plane??? ... I really don't know if it would work... probably not????
as mmckenna says if you made the hole it really wouldn't be that much damage... they sell rubber plugs that pop into the hole before your company sells it..... and they have a NMO mount that only takes a 3/8" hole... so a little 3/8" hole with a rubber plug in it wouldn't affect the resale price.... unless it's a lease? then those pricks will make you pay a million dollars for the damage..... but this mount is a small hole...
3/8 mount
you can also see this guy putting the 3/8 hole and mount in... it's really pretty small. small hole video

I've queried people who seemed happy with the rear tailgate mount, and the front fender mount. To me, the radiation pattern would seem much worse in either location than the third brake light mount. The third-brake light mount, although at the rear of the cab, is more centered over the truck than the F150 mount kits that do the front or the rear.

There will always be *some* compromise when you aren't mounting absolute dead center. How much performance is lost seems to be situational, and some people seem to be decently okay with it. When you consider that a 102-inch steel whip (being the gold standard of performance) is either bumper mounted or mounted to the side of a vehicle, you're always compromising your radiation pattern, but I think that the sheer performance of a true-sized 1/4-wavelength antenna is good enough that the compromise isn't something people are too upset about.

I don't care so much about resale value of the vehicle and what it could potentially do to that. I just don't want to see myself disciplined or fired if I take the liberty to do a permanent mount. At present, upper management doesn't seem to be the slightest bit approving of the idea, unfortunately.

 

[slowmover]

I've queried people who seemed happy with the rear tailgate mount, and the front fender mount

I’ve yet to encounter one that’s away from roof-center that has ears to converse at distance. Adding an amp to increase TX range is worthless as it’s no help to RX.

A mount on the hood, or in a pickup bed is an exception. Some of those surprisingly good.

The guys who’ve run a 108” on a stake-pocket “can” do okay. I think that’s up to very careful tuning (antenna analyzer; bonding), but it’s still not equivalent to roof center.

A few years back listened for a truly impressive long time to a man parked on a rise talking to the Interstate below with reported 108” on pickup roof and stock radio.

.

 

[JustinWHT]

I tried a base loaded Larsen CB antenna couple of inches in front of third taillight and it was lossy to the rear. Personally I prefer whip antennas with a spring.
Check out Team / Tram Browning out of Oklahoma. They are exclusively sold through Radio Research on eBay out of New York.

Radio Research, Inc.

www.radioresearch.us