NXDN Upgrade for BCD436HP and BCD536HP Now Available!

[Voyager]

Why are people seeing different results? There has to be a difference in programming or system type or something that isn't being stated/detailed but will be an "ah ha!" moment for one or the other.

Because some are using the techniques/tools described and some only want to use one that doesn't work. Post 486 has two techniques that will work. There may be others, too.

There are tools that will do exactly what he wants. But again, it's not working the way he wants it to work.

I can relate. I tried to tighten a screw with a hammer. It didn't work correctly. It must be a flaw in the design of the hammer.

 

[u2brent]

After the bashing and getting out of discovery mode.

For those who are interested in the topic, you can perform a simple test wherever you are, to duplicate the point I've been attempting to make all along.

Here's how.

Find a P25 PH1 system receivable to you that has encryption in use.
It could be just one Department or system wide ENC.

In my area the LCWC Law Enforcement Department will work for this, Or an entire system like PECO Energy which is 100% ENC.

OK, So now you have one programmed into an FL (Re-iterating it's P25 PH1)
You may need to enable ID Search Mode if no active ENC TG's are already programmed in the system. (Have to wonder why they're missing?)

Now let the radio loose. If you have an ENC Department in the system; then Hold on the Department. If it's system wide then Hold on the whole system.

If clear comms are active on a TG in the Department or System then Avoid them as they hit. Eventually you'll see what I've been typing about.

If you were able to meet those minuscule criteria as laid out above, you'll see the radio behavior I've been referring to all along. And I would like to have an option in the programming to alter that behavior.

No need to respond if this doesn't make any sense to you. (You're already far smarter than I)
But to those who try it.. I encourage to post your finding after trying this out. And would you too also like to to have an option to alter the behavior?

 

[UPMan]

When scanning, the scanner will mute/skip encrypted comms. This is normal, by design, and by the spec.

When doing discovery, the scanner will mute/skip encrypted comms after capturing TGID and UID.

I've not tried the negative delay on a programmed encrypted channel (actually, if that works, it is a bug ).

 

[u2brent]

When scanning, the scanner will mute/skip encrypted comms. This is normal, by design, and by the spec.

When doing discovery, the scanner will mute/skip encrypted comms after capturing TGID and UID.

I've not tried the negative delay on a programmed encrypted channel (actually, if that works, it is a bug ).

You are 100% correct.
No setting will change the "SPEC" behaviour.

I would like an option to opt out of that. It's been the simple point all along and you just corroborated my facts, although the waters have gotten quite muddy.

 

[Voyager]

I would like an option to opt out of that. It's been the simple point all along and you just corroborated my facts, although the waters have gotten quite muddy.

Why are any of the alternatives not acceptable - especially those that will do exactly what you want?

 

[UPMan]

If you are trying to discover channels including encrypted channels, use discovery.

 

[u2brent]

Gee, OK, Thanks for all your help.

There's nothing more to discuss.

 

[mikewazowski]

Gee, OK, Thanks for all your help.

There's nothing more to discuss.

Perhaps we can get back to disgusting the NXDN upgrade then?

 

[Voyager]

Perhaps we can get back to disgusting the NXDN upgrade then?

Or discussing it.

 

[mikewazowski]

Or discussing it.

Damn autocorrected.

Yes, please discuss the NXDN upgrade.

 

[jonwienke]

I've not tried the negative delay on a programmed encrypted channel (actually, if that works, it is a bug ).

Then there is a bug in how encrypted P25 Phase II is handled, as well as several flavors of encrypted DMR and NXDN.

Encrypted traffic on the Adams County PA P25-II system is handled as I describe. I set a -5 Delay several months ago on the encrypted TGs so I would know if there was traffic, but not be spammed with garbled audio. The audio is silenced with 1.14.00, but the scanner still pauses on the channel for the length of the transmission or 5 seconds, whichever is shorter. And I've seen a variety of encrypted DMR and NXDN that pauses on the channel the same as unencrypted audio, some of which still plays garbled audio. If you'd like, I can start trying to collect log files on encrypted stuff.

 

[u2brent]

Yup PH2, just as I was saying.

If it did exactly what I wanted. There would be no "disgusting".

And I'm sorry about the misdirection I caused in the thread. Carry on, Please.

 

[UPMan]

I was able to confirm negative delay mutes w/o skipping. So, that method is confirmed to work as well (I'll leave the bug in). I see no real deficit in the way it works, now. Scanning is not intended for new channel discovery (we have an entire mode for that). EDIT: But I am going to see if the ENC status can be logged in Discovery. Might get added, depending on complexity. Some people think adding a menu or option is a simple matter. It is not.

 

[Voyager]

It really comes down to which has priority - the delay or the skip. I would almost argue that if you want the 5 second delay (no matter what is going on), it should apply to all aspects including encrypted transmissions. The "negative delay" has priority over other functions, but a positive delay is secondary to the mute/skip.

Priority list:
Negative delay
Mute/skip
Positive delay

 

[jonwienke]

I was able to confirm negative delay mutes w/o skipping. So, that method is confirmed to work as well (I'll leave the bug in).

There is still inconsistency in some NXDN and DMR encryption behavior, not all of it is muted. Do you want log files for non-spec behavior where a negative Delay is NOT set?

 

[CQ]

Ok U2 will take your word on that,I was going by the FCC license info in addition to RR database.
No offense but many times RR database is out of date..
Thanks.

DMR has been out for quite a while as is as stable as it is probably going to get.

NXDN works for most things I'd tried if programmed correctly and you have a strong enough signal. HOWEVER, unless you try/buy a third-party software package, you'll have to program NXDN stuff by hand as Sentinel doesn't handle it yet.....

Discovery and search will now correctly identify NXDN, and when Sentinel is updated, you will be able to program NXDN systems. Until then you have to program NXDN with the scanner menu (ugh).

RR isn't the only game in town. Why can't you just import from some other source and twerk as needed?

https://digitalfrequencysearch.com/Search/QuickImport.php

 

[troymail]

RR isn't the only game in town. Why can't you just import from some other source and twerk as needed?

https://digitalfrequencysearch.com/Search/QuickImport.php

That's not a reliable source... it's a tool but you'll find lots of incorrect information in FCC license data. Lots of that is 'someday, we might...'

Bottom line is that you need multiple sources to work with on a lot of this stuff.

 

[hiegtx]

RR isn't the only game in town. Why can't you just import from some other source and twerk as needed?

https://digitalfrequencysearch.com/Search/QuickImport.php

That site is based on licensing, not confirmed usage. I use it to find possibly undocumented systems, but it's only going to tell you whose license has the emission codes for DMR or NXDN.

Some users will update their license for more than one format (P25, DMR, or NXDN), yet still use analog communications. I've run across several, including a couple of public safety agencies, that are licensed for about anything except TCOS (tin cans on a string).

 

[W5RGP]

That's not a reliable source... it's a tool but you'll find lots of incorrect information in FCC license data. Lots of that is 'someday, we might...'

Bottom line is that you need multiple sources to work with on a lot of this stuff.

yep ive quit even using anything from there too much wrong info

 

[jonwienke]

About 90% of the frequencies are unused. All it's good for is narrowing down search to something that doesn't take as long as multiple band scans. It doesn't give you LCNs or talkgroups or break out frequencies by site.